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Study Finds No Gender Gap in Tech Salaries

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Re: Study Finds No Gender Gap in Tech Salaries

#61
"I have to say, wouldn’t it be nice if these options were in addition to, instead of a replacement for, higher salaries?"

That was a kind of pointless observation. I too would like a pony.

Obviously the jobs with both flexible work options _and_ high salaries are going to be very fiercely competed for, since they're the best jobs to have.

Re: Study Finds No Gender Gap in Tech Salaries

#62
post #15

This is fairly consistent with other studies. The "77%" number is arrived at by comparing the median wage of full-time male & female employees. It doesn't account for differences in industry, job title, experience, etc. It's super broad. That doesn't mean we should ignore it, but it means we need more granularity. Coming out of uni/grad school, male and female salaries are equal in comparable fields. They depart a fe…

"Coming out of uni/grad school, male and female salaries are equal in comparable fields."

Given that there's more female that graduate now, there's still bias in the process, just not the bias people hope to find.

Re: Study Finds No Gender Gap in Tech Salaries

#63
post #43

I'm surprised. In a technical PM role a few years ago I found out that I earned 20-40% less than other PM's at the company. There were more than a dozen PM's and I was the only woman who was mid-level seniority. My male direct report made almost the same as me, while my female direct reports made a lot less. In my case it was not due to lack of initial negotiation, but that at each promotion I didn't get a sufficient…

The best way to fix this is to create a social pressure to be open about salaries. Some want to fix this by teaching better negotiation skills to those who are poor at it, but as long as the social pressure is to hide this data, it is going to keep being a problem regardless if the cause is racism, sexism, classism, or just difference in negotiation skills.

Re: Study Finds No Gender Gap in Tech Salaries

#64
post #15

This is fairly consistent with other studies. The "77%" number is arrived at by comparing the median wage of full-time male & female employees. It doesn't account for differences in industry, job title, experience, etc. It's super broad. That doesn't mean we should ignore it, but it means we need more granularity. Coming out of uni/grad school, male and female salaries are equal in comparable fields. They depart a fe…

Here's a really interesting freakonomics radio episode that goes into some good detail here if anyone's curious where these differences really originate: http://freakonomics.com/podcast/the-true-story-of-the-gender...

Beat me to it. The episode is basically an interview with Claudia Goldin who is about as qualified a person as you could hope for to speak on this matter. [1]

tl;dr women start out with equal pay, but trade pure monetary compensation for flexibility and/or fewer hours when they have kids because society still sucks at gender equality when it comes to enabling parents to equally contribute to certain aspects of parenting due.

[1] http://scholar.harvard.edu/goldin/biocv

Re: Study Finds No Gender Gap in Tech Salaries

#65

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I like the idea of "mandatory paternity leave", to make up for the biological asymmetry. Even if you have a stereotypical breadwinner/housewife relationship, you are legally mandated to take time off, even if you don't want to. That way you avoid the "you're allowed to take paternal leave, but real go-getters don't!" game altogether. edit: The way I see it, the responses just prove my point. "This would just make peo…

That would go a long way to correct for differences resulting from maternal leave, but there would still be issues such as single people, and especially single men, being favored (since it is rare for them to have a child who they must then take mandatory leave to care for).

It would definitely favour gay men, though they could still adopt and take paternity leave.

Re: Study Finds No Gender Gap in Tech Salaries

#66
post #62
post #15

This is fairly consistent with other studies. The "77%" number is arrived at by comparing the median wage of full-time male & female employees. It doesn't account for differences in industry, job title, experience, etc. It's super broad. That doesn't mean we should ignore it, but it means we need more granularity. Coming out of uni/grad school, male and female salaries are equal in comparable fields. They depart a fe…

"Coming out of uni/grad school, male and female salaries are equal in comparable fields." Given that there's more female that graduate now, there's still bias in the process, just not the bias people hope to find.

In STEM? Far fewer women graduate with CS degrees than men. I think that percentage is actually declining.

Re: Study Finds No Gender Gap in Tech Salaries

#67
post #26
post #15

This is fairly consistent with other studies. The "77%" number is arrived at by comparing the median wage of full-time male & female employees. It doesn't account for differences in industry, job title, experience, etc. It's super broad. That doesn't mean we should ignore it, but it means we need more granularity. Coming out of uni/grad school, male and female salaries are equal in comparable fields. They depart a fe…

> We need to upend the idea that family care is solely the domain of women (normalizing parental leave for fathers with newborns is a good Don't have a kid, but I would think that an infant is better off having his mother close to him in his early months of life compared to having his father, for the simple biological reason that the mother can breast-feed, while a father can't. From what I remember reading kids who…

My wife couldn't produce milk. My wife's niece wouldn't latch. There are a lot of people in these situations where, even if true, your reasoning does not apply.

Re: Study Finds No Gender Gap in Tech Salaries

#69
post #46
post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> We need to upend the idea that family care is solely the domain of women (normalizing parental leave for fathers with newborns is a good Don't have a kid, but I would think that an infant is better off having his mother close to him in his early months of life compared to having his father, for the simple biological reason that the mother can breast-feed, while a father can't. From what I remember reading kids who…

I don't think they were suggesting that it becomes the norm that only fathers stay home. Only that paternity leave should be considered normal, something that all companies offer and expect you to take. Whether both parents are at home, or just the dad in cases where the mother can't easily take time off, either is fine. Currently there is a gender asymmetry in that maternity leave is normal (and required by law), bu…

> Currently there is a gender asymmetry in that maternity leave is normal (and required by law), but paternity leave is frequently non-existent, or discouraged.

In the US, at the federal level, maternity and paternity leave (both unpaid) are covered by the same mandate (FMLA).

In California, paid maternity and paternity leave are covered by the same mandate.

That doesn't negate the social asymmetry, of course.

Re: Study Finds No Gender Gap in Tech Salaries

#70
post #15

This is fairly consistent with other studies. The "77%" number is arrived at by comparing the median wage of full-time male & female employees. It doesn't account for differences in industry, job title, experience, etc. It's super broad. That doesn't mean we should ignore it, but it means we need more granularity. Coming out of uni/grad school, male and female salaries are equal in comparable fields. They depart a fe…

I like the idea of "mandatory paternity leave", to make up for the biological asymmetry. Even if you have a stereotypical breadwinner/housewife relationship, you are legally mandated to take time off, even if you don't want to. That way you avoid the "you're allowed to take paternal leave, but real go-getters don't!" game altogether. edit: The way I see it, the responses just prove my point. "This would just make peo…

We already suffer from declining birthrates in the west. Your solution would make not having a child the best choice for "go-getters."
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