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The Electric Car may be entering its “cell phone” period

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61–70 of 79 posts

Re: The Electric Car may be entering its “cell phone” period

#61

Current oil prices make electronic cars a total personal economic loss.

Just for comparison here, I have a 2013 Leaf. In December I drove 920 miles and with my utility prices the cost of electricity to cover those miles was about $28. You still need either an extremely efficient car or quite a bit lower gas prices to beat this. This also does not account for the fact that you can routinely get free electricity for your EV.

Re: The Electric Car may be entering its “cell phone” period

#62
post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why don't electric cars come with a tiny kerosene cabin heater as standard? A small heater would take up little space or weight, could be easily refueled at home so not need a detour to a petrol station, and be much more cost effective than adding extra batteries just to provide cabin heat. Sure, it's not zero-emission, but the efficiency of a kerosene heater can be pretty good (much better than an internal combustio…

No one would be silly enough to cart around a tank of highly explosive liquid in their vehicle.

While outputting toxic carbon monoxide directly into the breathing air of the vehicles following immediately behind

Re: The Electric Car may be entering its “cell phone” period

#63
post #2

1) The Tesla just surpassed the Leaf as the most popular electric car (yes, even with the price difference). 2) Electric car perks are everywhere and rarely mentioned. Free charging, way better parking, fielding questions from curious onlookers, more cargo space, no noise, no warmup, no oil changes, etc.) 3) In the winter months in areas of the world with real seasons (read: not San Francisco area), cabin heating wil…

Regarding the hearing issue. These cars already have an Ac. I was thinking they could run it in reverse as a heat pump to save energy on heating. That's how residential heat pumps work both as heaters and ac.

Id think the insulation on electric cars could also be drastically improved. No one ever put much thought into insulating a car since there's free heat from the engine.

Re: The Electric Car may be entering its “cell phone” period

#64
post #2

1) The Tesla just surpassed the Leaf as the most popular electric car (yes, even with the price difference). 2) Electric car perks are everywhere and rarely mentioned. Free charging, way better parking, fielding questions from curious onlookers, more cargo space, no noise, no warmup, no oil changes, etc.) 3) In the winter months in areas of the world with real seasons (read: not San Francisco area), cabin heating wil…

Why don't electric cars come with a tiny kerosene cabin heater as standard? A small heater would take up little space or weight, could be easily refueled at home so not need a detour to a petrol station, and be much more cost effective than adding extra batteries just to provide cabin heat. Sure, it's not zero-emission, but the efficiency of a kerosene heater can be pretty good (much better than an internal combustio…

I like your thinking. See my other comment for what I think is a good idea for improving the heating situation. https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=10953036

Re: The Electric Car may be entering its “cell phone” period

#65
post #23

As the long as the charging is not way faster I do not see mass adoption. If you're using cars just in the city then charging is no issue but for long distance travel it is one. Only way is to own at least two cars but this can't be the solution.

This argument again... The average commute time in 2011 was 25.5 minutes in USA and 24.5 in Canada. In Canada 17.2% of commuters drove more than 45 minutes to get to work. Source: https://www12.statcan.gc.ca/nhs-enm/2011/as-sa/99-012-x/99-0... At least for 82.8% of people the commute as well as grocery stop can be handled with a single charge. For many their whole day of driving can be done with a single charge! Now…

Even if a short-range car would be fine for your daily commute (and you have a second car or some other method for making longer trips), there's another issue to consider: If you have to charge your car every night in order to get to the work in the morning, then you need to be guaranteed a parking spot with a charger, but in densely packed areas where short commutes are common, shitting parking is common as well. That means a lot of places would need to improve their parking situation in addition to providing reliable charging infrastructure, and that's going to take a lot of money and effort.

Re: The Electric Car may be entering its “cell phone” period

#66
post #2

1) The Tesla just surpassed the Leaf as the most popular electric car (yes, even with the price difference). 2) Electric car perks are everywhere and rarely mentioned. Free charging, way better parking, fielding questions from curious onlookers, more cargo space, no noise, no warmup, no oil changes, etc.) 3) In the winter months in areas of the world with real seasons (read: not San Francisco area), cabin heating wil…

Regarding the hearing issue. These cars already have an Ac. I was thinking they could run it in reverse as a heat pump to save energy on heating. That's how residential heat pumps work both as heaters and ac. Id think the insulation on electric cars could also be drastically improved. No one ever put much thought into insulating a car since there's free heat from the engine.

The LEAF has a heat pump and it works till about freezing at which point it switches over to an electric heater. The loss of efficiency due to cold weather really dwarfs the cost of heating/cooling in the vehicle.

Re: The Electric Car may be entering its “cell phone” period

#67
post #8

Good electric car battery standard would solve almost all of the problems of electric cars. 1. The battery is where most development happens and where it's most needed. So you don't have to worry about your car getting too old too fast. Just get fresh battery. 2. Range: just swap the battery if you run out of juice. They could be rented like gas bottles are at service station. 3. Battery charge lifespan. 4. Potential…

>> Good electric car battery standard would solve almost all of the problems of electric cars. It'd create a bunch more problems, just like all cellphones aren't going to use the same battery. Each car is designed around the battery since it's such a large piece of the car.

>>Each car is designed around the battery since it's such a large piece of the car.

This is not exactly true. Battery is heavy piece, so it has to be low for low center of gravity. The bottom mount is going to happen anyhow. Tesla and Leaf both have their battery in the bottom.

The only real problem would be that you can't use the battery as structural element if it's easily detached. But the bottom center point is not exactly critical for structural integrity, so the result would be slightly increased weight.

Re: The Electric Car may be entering its “cell phone” period

#68
post #53
post #2

1) The Tesla just surpassed the Leaf as the most popular electric car (yes, even with the price difference). 2) Electric car perks are everywhere and rarely mentioned. Free charging, way better parking, fielding questions from curious onlookers, more cargo space, no noise, no warmup, no oil changes, etc.) 3) In the winter months in areas of the world with real seasons (read: not San Francisco area), cabin heating wil…

My experience is that the decrease during cold weather is more a function of the lowered performance of the battery than the result of the cabin heating. The battery draw at freeway speed is maybe 30kw. The baseline draw from the accessories in the vehicle ( radio, console ) and no heating/cooling/defroster is around 0.5kw. With the heat cranked up all the way and all the various heaters turned up to high the additio…

Of course I can't find the links now via Google, but I saw an announcement recently (multiple actually) about batteries in development that are not affected by cold temperatures AND have higher charge capacity AND speed than Li-Ion. I believe (guessing here) it involved aluminum (but not those charge-only-once aluminum-air batteries... something else).

If those batteries were released commercially within the next 5 years, it would be a game-changer

Re: The Electric Car may be entering its “cell phone” period

#69
post #60
post #8

Good electric car battery standard would solve almost all of the problems of electric cars. 1. The battery is where most development happens and where it's most needed. So you don't have to worry about your car getting too old too fast. Just get fresh battery. 2. Range: just swap the battery if you run out of juice. They could be rented like gas bottles are at service station. 3. Battery charge lifespan. 4. Potential…

> 1. The battery is where most development happens and where it's most needed. So you don't have to worry about your car getting too old too fast. Just get fresh battery. Isn't the situation more like, current battery technology (lithium) has only seen small incremental improvements for a while and apart from cost reductions there isn't anything major on short-medium timescale coming up. You can still put in a new ba…

Personally I'm waiting for the moment when someone notices that you can burn pretty much anything in fuel cell. Then long distance travel could be fueled with vegetable oil or biowaste extracted methane. Once you step away from hydrogen, everything gets much easier. But the hype is on hydrogen and currently the economical incentives for alternatives are lacking.

Re: The Electric Car may be entering its “cell phone” period

#70
post #33
post #8

Good electric car battery standard would solve almost all of the problems of electric cars. 1. The battery is where most development happens and where it's most needed. So you don't have to worry about your car getting too old too fast. Just get fresh battery. 2. Range: just swap the battery if you run out of juice. They could be rented like gas bottles are at service station. 3. Battery charge lifespan. 4. Potential…

Tesla did have battery swap stations where the battery would be swapped in around 90 seconds (less time than it takes to fill up a tank)[0]. However, uptake was apparently very small so focus was shifted to building the network of supercharger stations[1]. [0] https://www.teslamotors.com/blog/battery-swap-pilot-program [1] http://www.engadget.com/2015/06/10/tesla-battery-swap/

The more interesting question, then, becomes "why didn't you swap your battery?" to drivers who charged instead.
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