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Before I Can Fix This Tractor, We Have to Fix Copyright Law

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Re: Before I Can Fix This Tractor, We Have to Fix Copyright Law

#61

Post by nitrogen »

zanny wrote: post #47
err4nt wrote: post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'd love to hear more about #1. I don't know the history of the DMCA, and as a non-American I never heard about it before I saw it in action on Youtube. What were the (subjectively worse) alternatives being talked about at the time, and what do you think the best way out of this mess from today moving forward would be? You seem to hold a unique perspective on copyright issues I haven't hear before!

During the debate of the DMCA the media lobby was bribing congress to insanity to make sharing copyright material online a felony, and that any site enabling it be liable as an accomplice and enabler. We might not be in great shape in terms of intellectual freedom, but things could have gone much worse if big media got their way.

That's the Overton Window/door-in-the-face tactic -- introduce extreme rhetoric (felonies for uploaders) in order to get a "compromise" that's basically what they wanted all along (forced takedowns at their discretion).

Re: Before I Can Fix This Tractor, We Have to Fix Copyright Law

#63

Post by wonkaWonka »

oneJob wrote: post #31

Let's rewind. VHS won because of porn. Listening to music is now a buffet style affair because of Napster. AC kicked DC in the nuts and the public applauded because it was better and it could. I respect those working to improve the system from within, but also respectfully point out that change of the sort this article is talking about comes from the outside. Revolutions all have one thing in common. Out with the old…

I was with you, right up until you said "Out with the old, and in with the new."

You're first paragraph is spot on. But.

The next step is, DIY tractors, as if they were hot rod motorcycles, since, let's be honest... Tractors are NOT high technology items.

Okay, so tractors aren't as sexy as motorcyles, and gear heads don't cut their teeth on John Deer. So... just buy ordinary tractors, why not? They are basically covered wagons with motors, and attached shovels. They scrape dirt. They sift potatoes out of mud.

Why do tractors need horrendously advanced software at all? How complicated is a riding lawn mower?

These are not jumbo jets with multi-core governed CPU voting systems. Tractors don't have ailerons that need to adjust pitch and yaw at hypersonic velocities.

They fucking creep along at like 5MPH. Christ.

Then, after that one little nitpick, I'm with you all the way.

Re: Before I Can Fix This Tractor, We Have to Fix Copyright Law

#64

Post by nitrogen »

fanquake wrote: post #26
ec109685 wrote: post #19

Feels like the best approach is to encourage farmers to boycot at least one of the major tractor providers until these restrictions are removed. No new laws or lawsuits needed -- just some collective action.

Which provider do you propose we boycott, and which one do we use in the mean time? JohnDeere, CASE, New Holland etc dominate the industry, and no farmer is going to (let alone can afford to) stop using their current equipment, and spend millions of dollars (it would easily cost us this much) buying different brand machinery. Let alone dealing with the hassles that come with swapping from one stream of ag software to…

I think what the parent was suggesting is an arbitrary boycott for all future purchases. In other words, if they all use the same tactics, then make an example out of one to scare the others.

It sounds vindictive and harsh, until you consider that's exactly how the legal system is used all the time.

Re: Before I Can Fix This Tractor, We Have to Fix Copyright Law

#65

Post by nitrogen »

TazeTSchnitzel wrote: post #49
oneJob wrote: post #31

Let's rewind. VHS won because of porn. Listening to music is now a buffet style affair because of Napster. AC kicked DC in the nuts and the public applauded because it was better and it could. I respect those working to improve the system from within, but also respectfully point out that change of the sort this article is talking about comes from the outside. Revolutions all have one thing in common. Out with the old…

VHS didn't win because of pornography, it won because it was cheaper and was actually a superior format in certain respects. Listening to music is now "buffet-style" because of iTunes, not Napster. Napster died. AC kicked DC because the latter was financially non-viable.

Napster and related sites/services/apps made iTunes possible by priming the marketplace.

Re: Before I Can Fix This Tractor, We Have to Fix Copyright Law

#66

Post by itistoday2 »

simoncion wrote: post #60
itistoday2 wrote: post #57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> So, it is physically impossible to even pay lip service to what you propose in either fourty-six, or fourty-eight of the states in the US. lol, that is the opposite of my proposal, and your post (thank you for it btw) just further solidifies my point. When math says it's impossible for your representative to represent you, perhaps at that point we realize that the system has reached the end of its shelf life. See t…

> When math says it's impossible for your representative to represent you... That's not at all what I said, and it's a dramatic misinterpretation of my words. There are substantially better mechanisms available to us to figure out what people want and what they need than for a decision maker to ask them, one-on-one. From what I understand, there's a whole raft of really good, reproducible research on how to tease out…

> From what I understand, there's a whole raft of really good, reproducible research on how to tease out what people mean from what they say

Having a game of telephone for a government... sounds like it would result in the sort of legislation that can be found in the OP. XD

> Based on this comment, you appear to be proposing that we dramatically increase the number of Federal representatives per citizen.

Not at all. I again invite you to read my other comments.

Re: Before I Can Fix This Tractor, We Have to Fix Copyright Law

#67

Post by simoncion »

itistoday2 wrote: post #66
simoncion wrote: post #60

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> When math says it's impossible for your representative to represent you... That's not at all what I said, and it's a dramatic misinterpretation of my words. There are substantially better mechanisms available to us to figure out what people want and what they need than for a decision maker to ask them, one-on-one. From what I understand, there's a whole raft of really good, reproducible research on how to tease out…

> From what I understand, there's a whole raft of really good, reproducible research on how to tease out what people mean from what they say Having a game of telephone for a government... sounds like it would result in the sort of legislation that can be found in the OP. XD > Based on this comment, you appear to be proposing that we dramatically increase the number of Federal representatives per citizen. Not at all.…

I read your other comments. Did you read the footnote attached to the quoted sentence?

Re: Before I Can Fix This Tractor, We Have to Fix Copyright Law

#68

Post by nitrogen »

wonkaWonka wrote: post #63
oneJob wrote: post #31

Let's rewind. VHS won because of porn. Listening to music is now a buffet style affair because of Napster. AC kicked DC in the nuts and the public applauded because it was better and it could. I respect those working to improve the system from within, but also respectfully point out that change of the sort this article is talking about comes from the outside. Revolutions all have one thing in common. Out with the old…

I was with you, right up until you said "Out with the old, and in with the new." You're first paragraph is spot on. But. The next step is, DIY tractors, as if they were hot rod motorcycles, since, let's be honest... Tractors are NOT high technology items. Okay, so tractors aren't as sexy as motorcyles, and gear heads don't cut their teeth on John Deer. So... just buy ordinary tractors, why not? They are basically cov…

Tractors are NOT high technology items.

You'd be surprised. There are far more lasers, GPS units, etc. in use at the typical farm than owned by the typical consumer.

Re: Before I Can Fix This Tractor, We Have to Fix Copyright Law

#70

Post by itistoday2 »

simoncion wrote: post #67
itistoday2 wrote: post #66

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> From what I understand, there's a whole raft of really good, reproducible research on how to tease out what people mean from what they say Having a game of telephone for a government... sounds like it would result in the sort of legislation that can be found in the OP. XD > Based on this comment, you appear to be proposing that we dramatically increase the number of Federal representatives per citizen. Not at all.…

I read your other comments. Did you read the footnote attached to the quoted sentence?

Apologies, reading your comment was like going down a choose-your-own-adventure maze.

For footnote [3] my reply is that representative democracy is one of a vast variety of possible systems you could use. That ratio of yours becomes much less meaningful in say, a liquid democracy: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Delegative_democracy

These two links should (hopefully) address any further questions: https://fixingtao.com/2016/01/lunatics-terrorists-and-the-th... + this thread: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=10899574

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