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Microsoft Admits Windows 10 Automatic Spying Cannot Be Stopped

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Re: Microsoft Admits Windows 10 Automatic Spying Cannot Be Stopped

#61

Post by criddell »

jakejake wrote: post #35
criddell wrote: post #8

I don't understand how Windows 10 can be used in a lot of small business environments. If you are big enough to get the enterprise version, everything apparently can be tweaked. But there are a lot of tiny businesses that order a PC from Dell, install some software for their vertical, and then do little more than regularly install updates. My old dentist was a two person operation. They aren't going to get the enterp…

Putting on my trusting hat, I would think that MS is only transmitting enough data to keep the machine running and virus free without any intervention from the non-technical people. So it would be a safe machine for a small company without any IT staff. A lot of those companies just take the computer out of the box and plug it in and don't do anything further anyway. I don't see why they don't just add the option to…

> trusting hat

If you are wrong and Microsoft suffers a breach, your defense for HIPAA violations has to be better than "but I trusted Microsoft!"

> I would think that MS is only transmitting enough data to keep the machine running and virus free

I don't think that's true. It uploads what you type, your calendar, contacts, etc... so that things like Cortana work better. What makes me nervous is that even if you turn off all the Cortana things that you can, Cortana is still always running. Plus, how often to business users use Cortana?

Re: Microsoft Admits Windows 10 Automatic Spying Cannot Be Stopped

#62

Post by mark_l_watson »

I generally support privacy issues (donor to EFF and ACLU).

But, I see some hypocracy in criticizing companies like Microsoft and Google about the danger of private information being leaked. What about github repos, data on AWS, etc.? Most people seem willing to trust those companies.

I believe that companies like Microsoft and Google will immediately fire any employee caught improperly accessing user information.

We also trust our doctor's office and our bank with critical information.

I trust Microsoft and Apple to a large degree because I believe that their interests and my interests are aligned. I trust Google and Facebook, as sellers of data for advertising, less.

In the last five years I have gone through two "phases" where I used Linux on my laptops almost exclusively - for privacy and control reasons. The problem is both times I was a bit less productive during the periods when I used Linux. Personal efficiency trumps some of my concerns over privacy, especially given that the NSA and other intelligence agencies around the world record most of what we all do anyway.

Re: Microsoft Admits Windows 10 Automatic Spying Cannot Be Stopped

#63

Post by ecnahc515 »

bhrgunatha wrote: post #60
McGlockenshire wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No, Windows 10 does not generally log keystrokes. The one and only place that things like keystroke logging are mentioned in the privacy policy is in the context of interacting with Cortana and the related search service, where the phrasing is similar to "things you enter here get sent to us, and we log those things." The vast majority of the Windows 10 privacy concerns are mitigated by turning off the Customer Exper…

It's been reported elsewhere that key strokes are logged. Whether it is limited i nature or not, the ability is there and is used. Why? What's the need for key strokes to be logged rather than just a complete edited search term sent to a server. Why does anyone need to know which keys I press on my computer?

This is how autocomplete works. You progressively type, it progressively adjusts the results so you can stop typing and just select the result you want.

Re: Microsoft Admits Windows 10 Automatic Spying Cannot Be Stopped

#64

Post by blackoil »

Is there a layman's guide to this whole. Does Cortana sends only explicitly told to it or everything I speak in vicinity of computer. Also, if I create a text file notepad that uploaded. My email, contacts, photo, messaging all already live in cloud. I am ok with Cortana having some access as long as I am aware of what it is.

Re: Microsoft Admits Windows 10 Automatic Spying Cannot Be Stopped

#65

Post by Pharaoh2 »

marssaxman wrote: post #5
Someone1234 wrote: post #3

Regardless of how you fall on this issue, this article is clearly highly biased. If you read their link "detailed data"[0] you can see there is an issue but you can also see that the level of invasion is low with most telemetry disabled. This article links to that, but then ignores that author's conclusions (that it is a relatively light level of privacy invasion) to draw this conclusion: > So how concerned should us…

"Relatively light level of privacy invasion" is still privacy invasion.

But it still doesn't validate the need for a clickbait title or a highly inflammatory article. Say it how it is... no better or worse.

Re: Microsoft Admits Windows 10 Automatic Spying Cannot Be Stopped

#66

Post by tagrun »

DiabloD3 wrote: post #29
Someone1234 wrote: post #3

Regardless of how you fall on this issue, this article is clearly highly biased. If you read their link "detailed data"[0] you can see there is an issue but you can also see that the level of invasion is low with most telemetry disabled. This article links to that, but then ignores that author's conclusions (that it is a relatively light level of privacy invasion) to draw this conclusion: > So how concerned should us…

I agree with Someone1234 here. Mods, can we get this link swapped out with a less biased one? I'm okay with Microsoft's telemetry stance hitting the front page, but I want it from a better source.

As linked by the article, the original news is at PC World, the language is milder but the point about the invasion of privacy is essentially the same http://www.pcworld.com/article/2997213/privacy/microsoft-doe...

Re: Microsoft Admits Windows 10 Automatic Spying Cannot Be Stopped

#67

Post by marssaxman »

Pharaoh2 wrote: post #65
marssaxman wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"Relatively light level of privacy invasion" is still privacy invasion.

But it still doesn't validate the need for a clickbait title or a highly inflammatory article. Say it how it is... no better or worse.

From the perspective of a person whose standard for an operating system is "zero invasion of privacy", there's nothing particularly inflammatory about the article.

It's fine if your expectations are less rigorous; you simply aren't part of the article's intended audience.

Re: Microsoft Admits Windows 10 Automatic Spying Cannot Be Stopped

#68

Post by Quiark »

bitL wrote: post #15

Microsoft has essentially forced me to turn off Windows Update on all my Windows 7 machines/partitions and migrate everything I can to Linux. All I am waiting for is SteamOS delivering AAA games to Linux and I won't need to touch future Windows ever again. How can you justify using Windows for enterprise work if due to new policies you can't be assured you can keep anything you work on secret? I am not willing to kee…

Wait, how do I prevent automatic update to Win10? I actually like the UI but the system Does Not Work (tm) on my hardware (I tried). I'm finding it hard to believe MS is going to auto-brick my laptop overnight.

Re: Microsoft Admits Windows 10 Automatic Spying Cannot Be Stopped

#69

Post by Pharaoh2 »

marssaxman wrote: post #67
Pharaoh2 wrote: post #65

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But it still doesn't validate the need for a clickbait title or a highly inflammatory article. Say it how it is... no better or worse.

From the perspective of a person whose standard for an operating system is "zero invasion of privacy", there's nothing particularly inflammatory about the article. It's fine if your expectations are less rigorous; you simply aren't part of the article's intended audience.

I know ubuntu, osx and windows 7 phone home for certains scenarios. Until you are running some *BSD box, you aren't getting that "zero invasion of privacy", you just think you are.

Re: Microsoft Admits Windows 10 Automatic Spying Cannot Be Stopped

#70

Post by mindcrash »

Quiark wrote: post #68
bitL wrote: post #15

Microsoft has essentially forced me to turn off Windows Update on all my Windows 7 machines/partitions and migrate everything I can to Linux. All I am waiting for is SteamOS delivering AAA games to Linux and I won't need to touch future Windows ever again. How can you justify using Windows for enterprise work if due to new policies you can't be assured you can keep anything you work on secret? I am not willing to kee…

Wait, how do I prevent automatic update to Win10? I actually like the UI but the system Does Not Work (tm) on my hardware (I tried). I'm finding it hard to believe MS is going to auto-brick my laptop overnight.

They will when Windows 10 becomes a preferred update.

Before that head into Control Panel > Windows Update > Change Settings

Oh, btw: if you have let Automatic Updates run until now it's probably best to do a fresh reinstall of Windows 7 or Windows 8, because they retrofitted almost all of Windows 10 telemetry services in those operating systems in a series of "updates" released around August.

Which gave me enough reasons never to trust any update from Microsoft ever again.

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