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Your phone is about to stop being yours

keepandroidopen.org

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Re: Your phone is about to stop being yours

#591

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sometimes reality is one sided, I personally see zero advantage to the new system. And I don't see how this change adresses the number one source of scams, the Play Store.

Is the Play Store the number one source of scams though? It might be in absolute terms, but Google has said malware off Play is 50x higher, and clearly Google does a huge amount of work to keep scams off Play. It seems logical to have a multi-faceted approach and try to reduce malware distribution elsewhere.

When I search for ChatGPT right now on the Play Store, the first result on my phone is a counterfeit app with a fake logo, I don't think even basic diligence has been done on the play store, it's the far west.

As for the apk, of course not many people distribute legitimately this way ... because it's already too complicated! Even Fortnite couldn't make it work, so if they cannot, how can your average developer do it?

If you want more legitimate apks, the solution is to remove friction and make them easier to install.

Google has been acting in two steps here:

- first make apks too complicated for legitimate developers

- then claim that no legitimate developer use them...

Re: Your phone is about to stop being yours

#592
post #68

This change has served me well! I have been a Mac OS X users for years who used an android phone. As soon as google announced their impending walled garden status, I went out and bought into the ios eco system. I have really been enjoying my iphone, ipad, and apple watch. You see, the only value that Android really offered me was the ability to run my own code on my own device. Since they are taking that away that ju…

I used to own a house, I could decorate it the way I wanted. It was hard work, but it was mine!

Then they locked it, so I went to live in a luxury hotel, it's more expensive, I can't decide how I want it and I don't own anything, but it's such a superior experience!

Re: Your phone is about to stop being yours

#593
Russian here, a former Android and iPhone user. I had to switch to Graphene OS in full paranoid more due to our worsening situation regarding VPNs and phone searches.

After about a month of using Graphene OS, I'm not looking back – it's great. I'm not recommending it as a 100% solution for everyone, but it's definitely a very solid practical step towards keeping the phone yours:

1. Your phone will be able to operate as a basic phone (calls, SMS, web, photos / videos, location, Bluetooth, eSIM) without a Google account.

2. You will always be able to install an APK. This helps you install apps that are banned from Google Play Store in your country.

3. There's a duress PIN that lets you wipe the phone completely from any 'Enter PIN' screen. (I tried it, it's a bit messy, but it does wipe the phone and in the end you return to a blank Graphene OS installation – no need to reinstall.)

4. There's a setting that lets you disable any USB port functionality other than charging.

5. The permission system is amazing. If you are forced to install a state-mandated spy app (like the Max messenger in Russia), you can put it into a "permission jail" where the app assumes that it has access to the requested data but actually receives what you explicitly give it. For example, you can select individual photos and contacts to make available to the app – while the app will think that it has access to all contacts and photos. Bonus: the new Internet permission, which lets apps think that they are connected to the Internet while they are actually blocked from it.

6. You can have a separate profile for data and apps you don't want to expose. (There's also a Private Space for that, it's very convenient but it exposes installed apps via app search from the main space.)

7. There's an End Session function for a logged-in profile that stops it from running, wipes it from memory, and puts the data at rest.

8. You can have a separate VPN in each profile. This should help against situations where your local equivalent of Roskomnadzor sniffs out your VPN connection settings via state-mandated changes in apps operating in your jurisdiction, and bans that particular VPN later. Just make sure you install all spy apps under a profile with a disposable VPN that you aren't afraid to lose.

9. Each profile (and the Private Space too, because technically it is a special kind of Profile) can have a separate Google account. For example, one profile can have a Russian Google account (for banking and state apps), while another profile can have an Armeninan Google account (for things that are banned in Russia, like Spotify and Kindle.) However, to arrange this, you have to physically be in the desired country – Google doesn't let you change the account country without being there.

To sum up – if you are concerned about this situation, buy Pixel 10 (excellent hardware btw.), install Graphene OS (very easy, their web installer is great), and try using it for a while.

Re: Your phone is about to stop being yours

#594
post #9

The opt out is graphene os yeah?

Yes, but there are issues. You can’t use stuff like banking apps on a modified device and losing access to normal android devices would be a big blow to the momentum of the F-Droid community. GrapheneOS might not be a big enough community to sustain work on the projects delivered by F-Droid.

I know this isn't the case with all banks, but for whatever my anecdata is worth I've been using a number of banking apps on mine for years, so it's incorrect to say that banking apps can't be used.

Re: Your phone is about to stop being yours

#595

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think the common masses just expect it in the first place. If you told someone that leaving their phone unattended could lead them to getting their data stolen, they would probably be surprised. I know this isn't a surprise to the HN crowd, but it is for regular people. I would also guess that the common masses would choose the opposite as shown by them choosing convenience over openness. It's convenient to not hav…

To be frank, I'm tired of this security theater. Yes, let's lock things down to prevent evil-maid attacks and bring in the technological dystopia in the process, who cares that the same evil maid could put your finger onto the fingerprint sensor and unlock the phone while you sleep without ever fiddling with the bootloader. "The masses" used to use completely unencrypted devices for decades. That doesn't mean they do…

I'm not terribly concerned about an evil maid entering my room at night and managing to authenticate my fingerprint without waking me.

I do, however, regularly have to check my phone in at [places] and am highly concerned about that.

I'm not interested in bringing about a tech dystopia to combat it, either, but I don't think those are our only two choices.

Threat modeling is important, and selectively false equivalences aren't helping matters, but only add to the theatrics.

Re: Your phone is about to stop being yours

#598
post #68

This change has served me well! I have been a Mac OS X users for years who used an android phone. As soon as google announced their impending walled garden status, I went out and bought into the ios eco system. I have really been enjoying my iphone, ipad, and apple watch. You see, the only value that Android really offered me was the ability to run my own code on my own device. Since they are taking that away that ju…

I used to own a house, I could decorate it the way I wanted. It was hard work, but it was mine! Then they locked it, so I went to live in a luxury hotel, it's more expensive, I can't decide how I want it and I don't own anything, but it's such a superior experience!

Some want ownership, some want experience. People differ, who might have thought.

Re: Your phone is about to stop being yours

#599
post #234

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> stop being yours As if most android maker phones don't already fully own your device - preventing you from unlocking of bootloader and installing an OS that actually doesnt enforce the restriction google is introducing in their flavour of android. To pretend that with this change android becomes exactly like iOS is... ridiculous? I can pick any 10yo old android phone from my drawer and develop for it, no problem an…

In the words of a Great American: "Those who would give up essential Liberty, to purchase a little temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety."

AFAIK there is more to that quote and it is usually misrepresented.

Re: Your phone is about to stop being yours

#600
post #68

This change has served me well! I have been a Mac OS X users for years who used an android phone. As soon as google announced their impending walled garden status, I went out and bought into the ios eco system. I have really been enjoying my iphone, ipad, and apple watch. You see, the only value that Android really offered me was the ability to run my own code on my own device. Since they are taking that away that ju…

No, Android still offers way more features than iOS. Replace the lock screen with a custom app Replace the home screen with a custom app Set default apps for SMS, phone service, assistant, camera, photo gallery. all things you can not change on iOS Always on widgets and dynamic wallpapers It has a much more customizable inter app communication system so that you can get more apps to be the default viewers At allows t…

As a wise man once said - Android when you want to do thing TO your phone, iOS when you want do to thing with your phone.
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