Virginia passes law to enforce maximum vehicle speeds for repeat speeders • Hacker News Board

Re: Virginia passes law to enforce maximum vehicle speeds for repeat speeders

#591

Post by vel0city » Mon, Apr 28, 2025, 1:20 PM UTC

Leynos wrote: post #571

ChoGGi wrote: post #541

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You're assuming they have insurance. I think it's something like 1-5 don't have insurance in Texas.

Interesting. It's illegal to drive without insurance in the UK.

It's illegal to drive without insurance in Texas as well.

It's also illegal to murder someone and yet people still do it from time to time. Stealing is illegal and yet stuff gets stolen. Drunk driving is illegal and yet people drive drunk. Turns out just making something illegal doesn't completely stop the action.

When we build our societies where you need to drive to function it's not surprising people will continue to drive when they shouldn't. Maybe we should build our societies so people don't have to drive just to live.

Re: Virginia passes law to enforce maximum vehicle speeds for repeat speeders

#592

Post by pclmulqdq » Mon, Apr 28, 2025, 1:21 PM UTC

marketneutral wrote: post #525

dabeeeenster wrote: post #523

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You're using a highly regulated piece of equipment that kills over 40,000 people in America annually. What do you feel is the appropriate balance? How is this different to driving around with a mobile phone on?

I think the point is that we should aim to solve it without surveillance / sacrificing rights. So in this case, increasing the fines / jail time is at least one alternative.

Raise the speed limits on major highways to match the speed of traffic, and strict enforcement will have a lot more support.

Re: Virginia passes law to enforce maximum vehicle speeds for repeat speeders

#593

Post by Hobadee » Mon, Apr 28, 2025, 1:22 PM UTC

Can we all stop equating speed with being unsafe? I've heard this BS stat that speed is a factor in car deaths. If speed were really so dangerous, then planes would be one of the least safe methods of travel.

The real problem is people driving outside the limits of what is safe for the road, car, situation, or themselves. This is the reason there is a 25MPH limit in school zones, where some kid darting out in front of you is likely, but the exact same road during non-school hours is often 35 or 40 MPH.

Cars these days are extremely safe at high speeds, and speeding in and of itself isn't necessarily unsafe. It's when the driver does something else unsafe, and couples it with high speeds, that things get deadly.

Re: Virginia passes law to enforce maximum vehicle speeds for repeat speeders

#594

Post by mschuster91 » Mon, Apr 28, 2025, 1:22 PM UTC

lillecarl wrote: post #445

mschuster91 wrote: post #387

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The question is, if everyone is speeding, would it not make sense to raise the speed limit?

KE = ½mv² shows that kinetic energy is directly proportional to the mass of an object and proportional to the square of its velocity. This means that doubling the mass doubles the kinetic energy, but doubling the velocity quadruples the kinetic energy. The kinetic energy of an 1800 kg car traveling at 30 km/h is about 62.5 kJ The kinetic energy of an 1800 kg car traveling at 50 km/h is about 173.6 kJ The kinetic ener…

> KE = ½mv² shows that kinetic energy is directly proportional to the mass of an object and proportional to the square of its velocity. This means that doubling the mass doubles the kinetic energy, but doubling the velocity quadruples the kinetic energy.

You're wrong there, that assumption fundamentally only makes sense on a full-on hard crash to 0 km/h - and about the only cases where that happens on a German road are suicides or someone not recognizing a traffic jam. Most crashes on highways are at relatively close speeds so the energy delta is way, way smaller.

Re: Virginia passes law to enforce maximum vehicle speeds for repeat speeders

#595

Post by hermannj314 » Mon, Apr 28, 2025, 1:22 PM UTC

jampekka wrote: post #573

hermannj314 wrote: post #522

This has as much to do with chronic speeding as bans on encryption have to do with terrorism. It is nothing more than a foot in the door for massive police surveillance of all motor vehicles. Virginia famously cares more about police than the rights of its citizens so it isn't a surprise the weapons of the future police state are being born there.

You could do it without any surveillance. Just have a feature in the car where the ECU will limit the speed when e.g. programmed via the CAN-bus. Such speed limits are quite common. E.g. mopeds in Finland have been (mechanically) speed limited for decades. Electric bikes are also limited to not supply force above 25km/h (IIRC).

I am fully in support of making cars or mopeds or all travel safer.

The US government and state governments are openly hostile to our residents and currently implementing massive mechanisms to track and control our population including our immigrant communities, women who need access to birth control, LGBTQ communities .

The government wanting a system that requires GPS and speed information to allow law enforcement to remotely control the movement of undesirable activities is the obvious goal here.

Re: Virginia passes law to enforce maximum vehicle speeds for repeat speeders

#596

Post by Const-me » Mon, Apr 28, 2025, 1:24 PM UTC

solatic wrote: post #453

Cities can replace smooth asphalt with rough brick and cobblestone, and replace traffic lights with traffic circles / roundabouts. If they really want to force cars to slow down, they could, in a way that doesn't take anyone's rights away and doesn't require any vehicle manufacturer to play ball. Freedom isn't free. It's always cheaper to take away people's freedom instead of doing the hard work of building infrastru…

Bricks and cobblestones don’t handle high traffic well, require too much maintenance i.e. too expensive. Cobblestones are only good for areas with heavily restricted or banned vehicle traffic. For roads and higher traffic streets, asphalt is more practical.

Agree with the rest of your comment. I also think the main reason for high traffic deaths in America is road design.

Re: Virginia passes law to enforce maximum vehicle speeds for repeat speeders

#597

Post by shlant » Mon, Apr 28, 2025, 1:25 PM UTC

donatj wrote: post #560

graemep wrote: post #527

Repeat offenders should not be allowed to drive. In the UK we have 12 points, and lose them for various offences. You get a fine, usually with the alternative of a course the first time. Speed again within 12 months and you get a fine and a minimum of three points (more if you are well above the limit). Speed again within four years and you will lose more points, and AFAIK pretty much guaranteed to be more than the m…

Many places in the United States use speed traps as revenue streams, and in many of the same places in the US it's nigh impossible to get around without a vehicle. Taking someone's license away for getting caught doing 5 over a few too many times on the freeway where literally everyone is always doing 5 over and you are more of a danger by not going the speed of traffic doesn't in any way serve the public interest as…

> Taking someone's license away for getting caught doing 5 over a few too many times on the freeway where literally everyone is always doing 5 over and you are more of a danger by not going the speed of traffic doesn't in any way serve the public interest as far as I can tell. It's a death sentence for a victimless crime.

What percentage of people who would be effected by this do you think match this description?

Re: Virginia passes law to enforce maximum vehicle speeds for repeat speeders

#598

Post by ryao » Mon, Apr 28, 2025, 1:28 PM UTC

jkestner wrote: post #577

ryao wrote: post #548

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> There is no reason in the world to assume that US drivers have the same level of driving skill as German drivers. That is a very typical response, yet the notion of Germans being intrinsically superior to others has long been debunked.

Yes, I recall there was a war fought. Intrinsically, of course not, but how about due to laws/culture/training?

Then it is possible to replicate German success in vehicle safety in the U.S. without increasingly draconian speed limit restrictions. As for laws/culture/training, look at NYS:

1. There are annual mandatory vehicle inspections. Driving an uninspected vehicle is illegal and you cannot get the inspection certificate for your windshield unless your vehicle passes.

2. The state requires a driving test to get a license (in addition to prelicensing education requirements) and effectively forces everyone to take driver education courses every 3 years by raising insurance rates if they do not.

3. There is a points system for violations. Reach 11 points, and you lose your license. Reaching 11 points is fairly easy to do.

It is unclear how driving skill in Germany would be much different than driving skill in NYS. If you believe it should be, then you should have reasons for it that would give concrete things that can be changed.

Re: Virginia passes law to enforce maximum vehicle speeds for repeat speeders

#599

Post by SnazzyUncle » Mon, Apr 28, 2025, 1:29 PM UTC

chippiewill wrote: post #588

SnazzyUncle wrote: post #570

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You don't seem to have ever driven on a long, empty, well lit 4 lane carriage way at 4am in he morning. If I am going 70MPH (UK Motorway speed limit) or 120MPH in such a situation makes no difference in terms safety. In the UK we have variable speed limit roads. When they are busy/obstructions the speed limit is lowered. It is put back to 70mph when the traffic is light / no safety issues. The safe speed on a road is…

Except the average person isn't a highways engineer and isn't aware of the road design limits which means 120mph can be unsafe even on a visually empty road. Even the German autobahns are only unrestricted in specific stretches where someone will have done the legwork to demonstrate safety at those speeds.

> Except the average person isn't a highways engineer and isn't aware of the road design limits which means 120mph can be unsafe even on a visually empty road.

Firstly there is no such thing as the average person.

Secondly, I don't need to be a "highways engineer" to be able to see there is few / no cars in front of me for over several miles on a long straight, multiple lane highway with no junctions for sometimes miles.

Thirdly, the decision for the motorway speed in the UK is a historical artifact.

https://readcars.co/2017/06/20/history-speed-limits-uk/

Generally most cars (even modern ones) it is unwise to sustain speeds over 90mph for a long duration if the engine is small (coolant systems are more likely to fail, it is hard on engines), it is also not fuel efficient to drive much faster than 60 mph in cars that have engines that are lower than 2.0 litres IME (I've done a lot of driving in different vehicles).

I would prefer they have variable speed limits on motorways / or special toll roads where the limit is higher.

Re: Virginia passes law to enforce maximum vehicle speeds for repeat speeders

#600

Post by ryao » Mon, Apr 28, 2025, 1:30 PM UTC

dathinab wrote: post #587

ryao wrote: post #553

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Then instead of doing all of these increasingly draconian measures, perhaps we should try to copy the Germans. The interstate highway system itself was a copy of the German autobahn system. We should have copied it in all of its aspects. It is never too late to do this.

It's actually not possible in the US. The US is too car dependent and as such it's practically non-viable to - put high (skill/knowledge) requirements on drivers (especially given that this normally entails increased monetary requirements) - put high car maintenance/road safety requirements on cars and in generally fundamentally changing driving rules is hard in general and also a safety hazard during transition. I.e…

As I said to someone else, look at NYS:

1. There are annual mandatory vehicle inspections. Driving an uninspected vehicle is illegal and you cannot get the inspection certificate for your windshield unless your vehicle passes.

2. The state requires a driving test to get a license (in addition to prelicensing education requirements) and effectively forces everyone to take driver education courses every 3 years by raising insurance rates if they do not.

3. There is a points system for violations. Reach 11 points, and you lose your license. Reaching 11 points is fairly easy to do.

You are saying that improved driver education and vehicle maintenance cannot be done in the U.S., yet NYS does it. You say that people’s licenses cannot be taken away for unsafe driving in the U.S., yet NYS does it. NYS is part of the U.S.