US Administration announces 34% tariffs on China, 20% on EU • Hacker News Board

Re: US Administration announces 34% tariffs on China, 20% on EU

#591

Post by dang » Thu, Apr 03, 2025, 2:29 PM UTC

aredox wrote: post #152

[flagged]

Please don't take this thread or any HN thread into even more of a political flamewar hell. It's not what this site is for, and destroys what it is for.

https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html

Edit: it looks like your account has been using HN primarily for political battle. That's a line at which we ban accounts, regardless of what your politics are or aren't. See https://hn.algolia.com/?sort=byDate&dateRange=all&type=comme... for past explanations.

If you'd please revert to using HN as intended, we'd appreciate it.

Re: US Administration announces 34% tariffs on China, 20% on EU

#592

Post by cs702 » Thu, Apr 03, 2025, 2:30 PM UTC

Three things:

1. On the face of it, this looks horrible. I won't rehash the many arguments against it here, though. This page is already chock-full of those arguments.

2. Robot labor could make ultra-low-cost manufacturing possible in the US, to the point that many things become cheaper to make locally than to ship from abroad, tariffs or or no tariffs.

3. If any major country/region negotiates lower tariffs by fully opening its market to US products, every other country/region will be forced to do the same, expanding free trade everywhere.

Re: US Administration announces 34% tariffs on China, 20% on EU

#593

Post by acdha » Thu, Apr 03, 2025, 2:30 PM UTC

nilkn wrote: post #521

I don't know how I feel about this overall. But I do want to recount something from my childhood. I'm American. I grew up in the rural Midwest. The truth is that much of this country is a depressing shell of its former self. The town I grew up in is all but dead -- about 12,000 people still live there, though. The nearest big city, previously a hub of manufacturing innovation, has been on a steady decline for decades…

I think that’s part of what I find so frustrating about this. There’s an alternate history where we’d have a national effort to invest in domestic industry, especially outside of a few areas which are doing well, but that just wouldn’t look anything like this.

A good example I saw was living in New Haven years back, where they were struggling to build businesses around the Yale community. There’s a ton of unused industrial area, especially as you go east, but they didn’t have the right combination of funding environment, local workforce, and infrastructure so in practice everyone went to NYC or Boston, or SF, and the state of Connecticut kept losing out.

Fixing that would be huge, but tariffs won’t do it unless you also invest in those other things and also something like antitrust protection so the key decisions aren’t made by a handful of gigantic companies.

Re: US Administration announces 34% tariffs on China, 20% on EU

#594

Post by dmix » Thu, Apr 03, 2025, 2:31 PM UTC

ggm wrote: post #87

I think a lot of people assume the economic consequences like these have not been understood by the WH. Although I don't like this administration I beg to differ: they know what's going to happen, and they expect the coming storm because they seek what follows. They want to repudiate foreign held debt, or devalue it, by revaluation of the USD and they will wear what they think of as a one time economic shock to get t…

People are also getting way too caught up in the math and numbers. They think WH calculated the percentages through incompetence but the 25% tariffs weren't based on anything very real either. The entire goal is not carefully calculated trade equality, it's mafia style intimidation to get some easy concessions as quickly as possible from everybody... before the economy crashes too hard. Spamming tariffs to see what sticks. The math is just a plausible justification for something they would have done anyway.

It's bully tactics.

For ex see Canada's fentynal importation issue, which was something invented to justify a natsec emergency legally. The numbers don't have to be real, just plausibly deniable.

Re: US Administration announces 34% tariffs on China, 20% on EU

#595

Post by dcchambers » Thu, Apr 03, 2025, 2:33 PM UTC

ggm wrote: post #87

I think a lot of people assume the economic consequences like these have not been understood by the WH. Although I don't like this administration I beg to differ: they know what's going to happen, and they expect the coming storm because they seek what follows. They want to repudiate foreign held debt, or devalue it, by revaluation of the USD and they will wear what they think of as a one time economic shock to get t…

My personal opinion is less complicated: they're pulling the economic levers they have in a way that they can use to enrich the top 0.1% even more. The richest of the rich got very wealthy during COVID (economic fallout, buying up lots of stocks at a discount then the biggest stock market bull run we've ever seen) and they want to make it happen again.

Re: US Administration announces 34% tariffs on China, 20% on EU

#596

Post by xnx » Thu, Apr 03, 2025, 2:33 PM UTC

stickfigure wrote: post #480

Here's something I want to understand: In 1930 the Smoot-Hawley Tariff Act was passed by congress - an act of legislation. Nearly 100 years later we have the president unilaterally picking any tariff numbers he wants. What happened?

Congress could stop this tomorrow if they wanted. They ceded all control to the executive. [Republican] Congress is hoping to claim credit for anything good that happens, but scapegoat Trump when things crash.

Re: US Administration announces 34% tariffs on China, 20% on EU

#597

Post by mschoch » Thu, Apr 03, 2025, 2:33 PM UTC

macinjosh wrote: post #588

All the gigabrains trying to be economists ITT don't understand this is a political move for Trump's base. It is not about what is technically best or the most logical according to the academics. It is an emotional decision more than anything. It stems from the working class in America being given cheap crap from Asia that barely works in exchange for shipping the good jobs overseas to the lowest bidder. The working…

[dead]

Re: US Administration announces 34% tariffs on China, 20% on EU

#598

Post by blast » Thu, Apr 03, 2025, 2:34 PM UTC

dostick wrote: post #506

This historical period will be remembered by being a cause for legislation to introduce strict testing for mental illness in government positions. Ask any psychologist and it’s clear what it is, but they won’t say it publicly because of Goldwater “rule”. fact is they have the most dangerous and destructive mental illness known, and they captured the power exactly because of their disorderly mindset. Yet for months an…

A medicalized psychiatric state is not the solution to the current lunacy. Just imagine the abuses it would lead to.

Re: US Administration announces 34% tariffs on China, 20% on EU

#599

Post by TaurenHunter » Thu, Apr 03, 2025, 2:34 PM UTC

I don't see anyone mentioning that the United States needs to manage its massive national debt, currently in the trillions, by issuing Treasury securities. These securities mature at varying intervals and require continuous "rolling" or refinancing to pay off old debt with new borrowing.

Significant rollovers are expected from April through September 2025, with additional short-term maturities due by June.

Higher interest rates significantly complicate US' ability to refinance. The cost of servicing this debt — paying interest rather than reducing principal — is already a major budget item, surpassing Medicare, approaching Defense and Social Security levels.

If rates don't come down soon it locks in higher costs for years. The country is at risk of a debt spiral.

How can rates come down? The present uncertainty around tariffs and a potential crisis could create conditions that pressure interest rates downward before those Treasury securities mature, by influencing Federal Reserve policy.

Treasuries are considered safe during such crisis. Increased demand for Treasuries pushes their prices up and yields down, effectively lowering interest rates.

What are the flaws in this thinking?

Re: US Administration announces 34% tariffs on China, 20% on EU

#600

Post by rchaud » Thu, Apr 03, 2025, 2:34 PM UTC

dostick wrote: post #506

This historical period will be remembered by being a cause for legislation to introduce strict testing for mental illness in government positions. Ask any psychologist and it’s clear what it is, but they won’t say it publicly because of Goldwater “rule”. fact is they have the most dangerous and destructive mental illness known, and they captured the power exactly because of their disorderly mindset. Yet for months an…

This is the equivalent of the "mentally ill lone wolf" rationales given for American mass shootings.

What possible difference would a psychological test make when an pre-existing felony conviction is not enough to keep him from voting, but also to actually sit as head of state?

What is happening in America simply doesn't happen without broad-based, implicit, systemic support at all the important decision-making junctures. In 2017, several of the highest-profile executive orders were slapped down in court within days. In 2025, the government is not even pretending to abide by court rulings on their EOs, and are detaining people without charge and revoking their visas without due process.