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Cruise is opening driverless cars to the public in San Francisco

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Re: Cruise is opening driverless cars to the public in San Francisco

#591

Post by bluGill »

loceng wrote: post #580
shaklee3 wrote: post #483

Earlier quoted context omitted.

what's stopping them is fsd has been promised on all these cars without those sensors. taking that away would likely mean a lawsuit

A promise isn't a contract, so whether it's actually guaranteed in the language in whatever agreements may be signed, will be the determining factor. And how the automative industry has functioned since its existence is risk-benefit-cost analysis, so if the cost of a future fallout is less than the short-term benefit then they tend to decide for the short-term benefit; most disgustingly in regards to known problems o…

No, courts look at the spirit of the language and the letter of the law. The letter takes precedent only when it is clear that the two parties are not intending to defraud each other and there is just a misunderstanding. If the court decides both parties had a different understanding of the contract than the letter, then what they understand is what is used. As a lawyer in court your jobs it to make the court believe what you understood the contract was about is what they use - if the letter supports you then you yell that, and since the letter is a easy to prove while a shared understanding that is different from the letter is impossible the letter normally wins.

Marketing is admissible in court as evidence of intended contract. Since marketing is generally easier to understand the legalese, if the court decides the marketing is misleading they will tend to punish you for that and accept the marketing as the shared understanding over whatever the letter of the contract is.

Note that I used a lot of wishey-washy words like tend... Each court case is different, and there is no real rule of what courts will do in any given situation. Consult a lawyer for legal advice about your specific situation.

Re: Cruise is opening driverless cars to the public in San Francisco

#592

Post by ramesh31 »

andy_ppp wrote: post #557
walrus01 wrote: post #391

Earlier quoted context omitted.

to be fair, this is because Elizabeth Holmes is probably a sociopath, so you'd expect to hear something overly confident like that from such. Not that we knew it at the time.

I've met quite a few people like her and I really don't believe they are sociopaths - they say things that sound real and even convince themselves of it but as soon as you start peeling back details they don't exist. It's like you are talking to a Turing machine and it's you failing the test. People on these forums never really speak to these people because we are already largely scientists and love empirical evidenc…

>There's a whole class of people who have learned to pattern match talking like us without anything to back it up. See the industry "Comms" for many many examples.

Have noticed this through my career as well. There is a whole class of people who go through life never actually doing anything. They just talk about people doing things. And get paid to talk about people doing things. And by the time people realize that they are just full of shit, they move on to the next place where they get paid to talk about people doing things. And they never actually did anything in the first place, so it's not like you can even say they were a bad worker.

Re: Cruise is opening driverless cars to the public in San Francisco

#593

Post by saiya-jin »

andy_ppp wrote: post #557
walrus01 wrote: post #391

Earlier quoted context omitted.

to be fair, this is because Elizabeth Holmes is probably a sociopath, so you'd expect to hear something overly confident like that from such. Not that we knew it at the time.

I've met quite a few people like her and I really don't believe they are sociopaths - they say things that sound real and even convince themselves of it but as soon as you start peeling back details they don't exist. It's like you are talking to a Turing machine and it's you failing the test. People on these forums never really speak to these people because we are already largely scientists and love empirical evidenc…

Roughly 1 in 20 folks on average out there is a sociopath (some quote from Jordan Peterson). It doesn't have to be full 110% on scheming world domination, but detectable (and obvious in daily life). I am not an expert on her or whole saga, but from my perspective many famous people show this trait. In business its almost mandatory to get/stay on top, it certainly gives one advantages compared to nice fair honest people.

Re: Cruise is opening driverless cars to the public in San Francisco

#594

Post by FireBeyond »

jowday wrote: post #435
Retric wrote: post #398

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Novelty isn’t nearly as big of a problem as you might think. One of Wamo’s famous videos was someone on an electric scooter chasing a duck in the middle of the street. That’s very odd behavior, but the car followed the rather simple option of just not hitting them and going forward when possible. Cars really don’t need to identify what something is just it’s location and movement which is a vastly easier problem. A t…

> Cars really don’t need to identify what something is just it’s location and movement which is a vastly easier problem. A trash can rolling down the street can be treated just like an oil drum doing the same thing etc. You’d think that, until you encounter something like a turn restriction sign with a bizarre conditional restriction that it’s never seen before. At which point the car needs to OCR the text, parse the…

Right by my house I have a four lane (on one side) intersection with a traffic signal. Each of the lanes goes straight ahead. However, each lane has its own traffic light, and when the traffic light rotation is in that direction, it alternates the two left most straight lanes red while the right most are green, and then switches (because very shortly after the intersection there is a quick lane reduction to two lanes).

I can't imagine how AI would _correctly_ see four straight arrowed lights in front of it in the intersection, some of which are red, some are green. Humans of course recognize that they correlate to the lanes, but this is a more esoteric case for AI to assimilate.

Re: Cruise is opening driverless cars to the public in San Francisco

#596

Post by ramesh31 »

Ericson2314 wrote: post #595

I think I saw one of these at night with no humans inside . Drivers or passengers. Is that legal?

>Is that legal?

It is if you pay the right people enough money. Welcome to the future; where the mass dregs of humanity are now a liability to our elite cybernetic enhanced 1% overlords.

Re: Cruise is opening driverless cars to the public in San Francisco

#597

Post by bluGill »

astrange wrote: post #344
babyshake wrote: post #272

Earlier quoted context omitted.

All-electric fleets of safe, non-honking AVs that are fine with whatever routes are required of them and go to designated areas to park and charge are going to make our downtown areas so much better.

The urbanist PoV is that anything car-shaped is bad for a city and it doesn't matter how smart it is. The proper answer is micromobility, aka ebikes and smaller vehicles that don't need to ever go highway speeds. Full size EVs are still bad for air quality too because of tire dust.

Full sized EVs have their place in cities. However it isn't for mass transit, the train or bus is for getting people around. EVs are for getting goods and maintenance tools around. This is a small minority of traffic in most cities.

Re: Cruise is opening driverless cars to the public in San Francisco

#598

Post by rob74 »

pmontra wrote: post #492
ryandrake wrote: post #459

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> If there's no Elon, there's no SpaceX. Why not? What mystical gift does this one person have that 7 billion other people don't, that permits him and only him to run the company? This is a really unpopular opinion on a web site that exalts founders, but I don't think it really takes much special skill to run a company. Most (but admittedly not all) CEOs are in their position not because of their know-how, but becaus…

Musk set an improbable goal and he's heading to it. The other people from the Ivy League could do the same but didn't. He deserves some credit for that. Another example Cook (coming from Compaq) is perfectly able to run Apple. A lot of people could have thought about iPhones and Macs but Jobs deserves some credit to actually start the company with Wozniak and actually pushing it to deliver those products. Repeat with…

> Jobs deserves some credit to actually start the company with Wozniak and actually pushing it to deliver those products.

...not to forget the period between 1985 and 1997 when he was ousted, founded NeXT and Pixar, and then re-hired to save Apple, which was on the brink of bankruptcy.

Re: Cruise is opening driverless cars to the public in San Francisco

#599

Post by bluGill »

xp84 wrote: post #302
ghaff wrote: post #178

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I do expect at least some companies will hit L4 within the decade(?) but it's going to be under limited conditions that won't include urban driving. Which could actually be a very useful capability but isn't the "don't own a car" future that some really are focused on. ------ Level 4 _ High Automation System capability: The car can operate without human input or oversight but only under select conditions defined by f…

> "driver might manage all driving duties on surface streets then become a passenger as the car enters a highway." This is the kind of setup I can't wrap my head around. The car might "require" you to take over when you exit the highway, but it can't exactly "make" you. If you fall asleep on the freeway and the car isn't willing/able to drive at the end of your journey, or in edge cases if you were to pass out, etc.…

I'm thinking more like a semi truck. Get onto the freeway on-ramp, pull over and get out, then the truck continues on without you for miles before taking an off-ramp where a driver is waiting to handle the nearby streets. I expect truck stops in rural areas will (with DOT help) get special on/off ramps that are approved (maybe a special stop light?) so that trucks can go to a full service pump for fuel and get back on the freeway.

As you say, city driving is hard, but there are a lot of trucks that cross the US on freeways that are easy to automate.

Re: Cruise is opening driverless cars to the public in San Francisco

#600

Post by [deleted] »

saiya-jin wrote: post #593
andy_ppp wrote: post #557

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've met quite a few people like her and I really don't believe they are sociopaths - they say things that sound real and even convince themselves of it but as soon as you start peeling back details they don't exist. It's like you are talking to a Turing machine and it's you failing the test. People on these forums never really speak to these people because we are already largely scientists and love empirical evidenc…

Roughly 1 in 20 folks on average out there is a sociopath (some quote from Jordan Peterson). It doesn't have to be full 110% on scheming world domination, but detectable (and obvious in daily life). I am not an expert on her or whole saga, but from my perspective many famous people show this trait. In business its almost mandatory to get/stay on top, it certainly gives one advantages compared to nice fair honest peop…

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