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A foreign seller has hijacked my Amazon Klein bottle listing

kleinbottle.com

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Re: A foreign seller has hijacked my Amazon Klein bottle listing

#591

Post by jhgb »

heavyset_go wrote: post #563
fourseventy wrote: post #370

Earlier quoted context omitted.

He should just sue for copyright infringement.

Companies are taking a broad interpretation of Section 230 and claim that the law shields tech companies from all liability for their platform[1], online and off, and not just liability for hosting user created content. Lower level courts seem to agree with them, although one such case has been fought all the way to the Supreme Court[2]. [1] https://www.lawfareblog.com/herrick-v-grindr-why-section-230... [2] https://…

So just having a web shop shields you for example from the consequences of selling counterfeit goods? How does that work?

Re: A foreign seller has hijacked my Amazon Klein bottle listing

#592

Post by narrator »

CliffStoll wrote: post #146
seanwilson wrote: post #55

> To make their blackhead remover listing look legit, Amvoom then submitted several hundred orders over Amazon, and immediately cancelled each order. These depleted my Klein bottle inventory on Amazon - even though nothing was paid for, and nothing was shipped. In turn, this removed the "second color option" for their blackhead-remover, since Amazon felt that the Klein bottles were out of stock. Result: their black-h…

Sean, I just added a few things to my note. I'll try to copy/paste 'em here, although I suspect my sleepy fingers will goof up: I haven't really reviewed what I'm posting here - heck I can't spellcheck at 12:30 in the morning: Amazon, through its "Brand Registry" allows anyone with an issued trademark to take over other brands, whether or not the brand is covered by the specific goods that the trademark was issued fo…

Getting a trademark is not that expensive or complicated. Why do sellers not get trademarks?

Re: A foreign seller has hijacked my Amazon Klein bottle listing

#593

Post by fl0wenol »

CliffStoll wrote: post #391
jgrahamc wrote: post #344

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Cliff... 1. I met you in Kepler's when Silicon Snake Oil came out and we talked about something and you wrote in the inside "I hear you, John". I don't know what we discussed! 2. I am now Cloudflare's CTO and if you want to avoid the dynamic IP address problem you can use Cloudflare Tunnel to connect to us (rather than us to you). https://www.cloudflare.com/products/tunnel/

Yikes! Good stuff! (Just last week I was about to bump up my Cloudflare account. This seals it!) And that Kepler's talk? Happy memories, indeed. They "paid" me for my talk by saying that I could have a copy of any book in the store. I chose the Times World Atlas (a way-big book of maps). The manager's face suddenly dropped -- and then I told 'em that I'd pay full list price if all of their employees sound sign the bo…

This is a really wholesome thread... You guys are great.

Re: A foreign seller has hijacked my Amazon Klein bottle listing

#594

Post by dlgeek »

CliffStoll wrote: post #559
helixfelix wrote: post #221

What is ironic is that there is an annual Award given to an AWS employee called the Cliff Stoll Award: For those individuals who see something suspicious, not working as expected, show ownership and drive it to resolution. As Cliff did to find a KGB spy, and documented in "The Cuckoo's Egg". I wonder what would happen if someone at Amazon pulled on this thread and not only solved Cliff's problem but also the root cau…

If there really is a Cliff Stoll award, I'd be happy to contribute a Klein bottle for its continuation. (seriously!)

I've won one in the past. It's no longer being awarded to the best of my knowledge. But the recipients did get copies of your book (it was my second copy!).

Re: A foreign seller has hijacked my Amazon Klein bottle listing

#595

Post by scrooched_moose »

uberstuber wrote: post #396
scrooched_moose wrote: post #328

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Same. Anything that plugs in, has batteries, or goes in my family's mouths is a no go for me now. I'm pretty much down to a few books, video games, and obscure fasteners/hardware/tools (which annoyingly they're just about the only good source for).

McMaster-Carr might have a better selection of obscure fasteners/hardware/tools. Pricier, but often faster shipping than Amazon

Yeah, it depends on what you're looking for. McMaster is great for high quality serious Machine Shop level stuff, not so much for household oddities.

Recently I needed some vinyl siding hooks[0], a really oddball size drawer slide, and replacement window springs. I ended up getting all of them on Amazon - even tracking back the manufacturers they seemed to exclusively sell on Amazon.

0) https://www.amazon.com/dp/B083TPKJN1/ref=cm_sw_r_sms_awdb_im...

Re: A foreign seller has hijacked my Amazon Klein bottle listing

#596

Post by qvrjuec »

thethought wrote: post #426

Sleazy company hijacked Cliff Stoll’s Amazon Klein bottle listing. To me “foreign seller” implies Amazon sellers/buyers has some sort of national context? Note: I do feel bad hijacking happens in Amazon.

I think they are considered a foreign seller as a merchant shipping from outside the US on amazon.com (the US marketplace)

Re: A foreign seller has hijacked my Amazon Klein bottle listing

#597

Post by vtail »

spoonjim wrote: post #511
vtail wrote: post #347

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You may well think so, but I was asking an honest question. I don’t think it’s distasteful to doubt any allegations, esp. when missing some context, in this case, 10 years old judgement against B&H.

But you should probably examine why you were so quick to assume that the allegations were baseless.

As I tried to point out, a mere fact that someone is suing someone is not enough to conclude anything about which side is right; that’s why I was asking someone who seemed to have more context.

I’m not sure why people are reading too much into my honest question.

Re: A foreign seller has hijacked my Amazon Klein bottle listing

#598

Post by anigbrowl »

swalsh wrote: post #468
danparsonson wrote: post #258

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Plot twist: the root cause is greed

Allowing trusted sellers to be hijacked is not greedy behavior. Keeping 3rd sellers happy will result in less returns, happier resellers, and greater platform usage. The root cause here is organizational failure from disempowered employees. At one point Amazon had great customer service with empowered represenatives. That's not Amazon today.

It is if you make more money from the hijackers, and/or from marginalizing your 'difficult' employees.

Re: A foreign seller has hijacked my Amazon Klein bottle listing

#599

Post by threwawasy1228 »

whelming_wave wrote: post #485
gowld wrote: post #484

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There is nothing wrong with Cliff's store front: https://www.kleinbottle.com The problem is in Amazon's storefront, and there millions of sellers are operating in the same space, so doing some due diligence is required. If Cliff could just seize ownership of his storefront from a thief, why couldn't a thief seize it from Cliff? The solution is to register a proper trademark. Like it or not, the world is messy, and it…

It's interesting that you say "some due diligence is required" and go on to put the burden of that diligence on Cliff, rather than the creator of the marketplace.

It should be pointed out that in a country like India or China it IS often the marketplaces legal responsibility to prevent counterfeit merchandise from being sold in their market. If you go into many malls for example there are signs up on the walls with a hotline to report people selling counterfeit merchandise. In India, they have a service you can contact that enforces returns/refunds of any counterfeit item that you purchase from a vendor (though usually mentioning the hotline and threatening to call it is more than enough to convince the vendor to give you a refund).

Re: A foreign seller has hijacked my Amazon Klein bottle listing

#600

Post by MertsA »

jhgb wrote: post #590
duxup wrote: post #371

Earlier quoted context omitted.

IIRC: Amazon won't tell him who it is and he suspects it's just someone out of legal reach / as the book is just self published his legal resources are pretty limited.

> Amazon won't tell him who it is Does that matter to the police? Surely police reports don't have to include the name of who you think caused you some injury.

"It's a civil matter"

The police are never going to bother trying to seriously curtail online fraud. There's a reason why so many scam calls try to trick vulnerable people into paying them with iTunes gift cards and Google Play gift codes. Even with the added friction and blatantly farcical nature of the scam they find it more profitable to try and get the funds that way. They undoubtedly lose plenty of victims who might have been tricked into sending it through Western Union, mailing cash, or a cashier's check. They're paying a steep price to funnel it through the app store between the platform fees and whatever they pay the merchant that's laundering the funds for them.

They do that because they know that Apple is never going to try to claw back funds and the police are never going to force Apple to return the money that's still sitting in their accounts. You can call Apple 30 minutes after giving the scammers the code and without fail "oh sorry, the funds are gone!" https://i.imgur.com/oijXbLD.jpeg

That's the status quo, the courts are your only remedy here and you're going to lose trying to sue Amazon over a fraudulent seller. Best case scenario you manage to get Amazon to identify the seller and find out they're in a foreign jurisdiction and for all practical reasons untouchable as far as legal recourse is concerned.

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