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No More Free Work from Marak: Pay Me or Fork This

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Re: No More Free Work from Marak: Pay Me or Fork This

#591
post #569

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I use his work, but for me the situation is more complicated my prior experiences with the author. He's been making similar complaints about his lack of renumeration for quite a while. In an older GitHub where he requested contributions, I pointed out that he had barely worked on the project for many months (at that time), and not published a new version to npm in years[1], despite making a $600 withdrawal from his O…

You might see that as “volatile”, but I think I can see what he’s getting at. A charitable reading of his whole stance: • We can enter into a formal contract where I actually do owe you work-on-this-project in exchange for pay; • but without such a contract, donations to me are just that — donations — and don’t influence my work; • but this is an open-source project, so you’re free to put whatever work you like into…

Yeah, bringing money into free software equation complicates things.

It comes down to donors expecting something back for their donation, while authors expect something back for all the effort they put so far into the project that is obviously useful to other people.

For my open source project I made a hard decision not take any money. This curbs expectations and puts users at disadvantage, but lets me take as much time off as I want and I sleep better.

Re: No More Free Work from Marak: Pay Me or Fork This

#592

So you've made something cool and it's time to release it. These seem to be the options at hand: 1. Release under a permissive license (MIT, BSD) and: - Have everyone and their grandma use it. - Die poor 2. Release under a copyleft license (GPL) and: - No company is going to use or contribute to it, unless they can somehow clearly separate it from what they see as their intellectual property. Or just hide it where no…

If you release software under a commercial license, you're essentially forming a software company. It's hard work and not guaranteed to succeed, but isn't that legit and well-traveled path to wealth? Also not mentioned is using your coding skills to land a decent tech job, which seems like a much better shot at financial stability than what many have.

Re: No More Free Work from Marak: Pay Me or Fork This

#593

[this comment was deleted as HN doesn't pay me to contribute to the discussion]

I wonder, how much shareholder value FOSS, either in a package manager or otherwise, has added to MFAANG and other technology companies over the years? A few years ago, someone did break a package that many companies cloned and integrated... the internet nearly broke... My guess; a disruption in services is one thing that’s not already “priced in” to the stock market.

Well, Microsoft didn't spend $8G on Github out of the goodness of their hearts...

As Neal Stephenson said two decades ago : it's not like Microsoft controls developer's means of production and distribution ! (/s now)

Re: No More Free Work from Marak: Pay Me or Fork This

#595

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's just a proprietary license, just write the license like that if you want as I don't see how anything is stopping you from creating or using such a license. Just don't make the assumption that it's open source, it's just another form of a proprietary license like much of the paid software currently present. However, don't complain later on that you can't modify software or run it on your own device like you can…

The traditional ways to make money from free (libre) software and open source were : 1.) selling physical copies 2.) charging for support The first one is probably not viable most of the time these days, but I can see how the second one could work : for instance one could modify one's code forge so that you would need to pay to open a ticket, and/or put up an asked sum of money to start working on a ticket (that seve…

Neither option stops Amazon from packaging your code up and selling it as a cloud service.

Re: No More Free Work from Marak: Pay Me or Fork This

#596
post #258
post #135

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Do they really expect him to work on them? I'm 100% sure they know that open source doesn't guarantee that and that he's well within his rights to ignore their support requests if he feels like doing something else.

It's not about organizations _demanding_ that you do work for them for free, it's the constant _expectation_ of it. I experience it myself quite often where users of my software ask about timelines for bug fixes or new features, but very rarely offer to chip in and certainly never to sponsor the work. Of course these organizations have no way to force me to do anything, but it is emotionally draining to constantly ha…

I wonder where this expectation comes from? Is it because of high quality free as adware/spyware commercial software? Or the way development centered around repository name and we do not use forks?

I treat open source as a gift. It allows modifications, it allows forks, what's wrong with people?

Re: No More Free Work from Marak: Pay Me or Fork This

#597
post #179

Just dual license your code with an AGPL and commercial license. Proprietary software companies hate AGPL, and won’t take the risk to use it, instead preferring to pay your commercial license. MongoDB does that very successfully!

From the MongoDB blog [1]:

> AGPL fixes this “loophole” in GPL by saying that if you use the software over a network, you are bound by the copyleft.

Isn't that basically everything? Loopback is a network, right? I like the general idea and I think AWS really cheated them (ethically), but I wonder if there's something better that's completely safe for small business to ignore as easily as something like the MIT license while forbidding use by huge providers like AWS.

1. https://www.mongodb.com/blog/post/the-agpl

Re: No More Free Work from Marak: Pay Me or Fork This

#598
post #541

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This looks like a pretty popular project, so I assume he's decently talented. How does he not have a day job? Passion projects are great and all, but they're not known for paying the bills. Especially for solo maintainers, it's almost like playing a gig at a coffee shop for tips. Want to make a career out of it? You need talent, marketability, and be ready to compromise on your vision.

He was one of the founders of Nodejitsu, acquired by godaddy in 2015. I wonder if he ended up not seeing any of that acquisition money?

To be honest, any small 3-person company "acquired" and then promptly shut down, probably was just a fancy way to close the business.

Each person got a job with a signing bonus. And the investors may have gotten their money back.

Re: No More Free Work from Marak: Pay Me or Fork This

#599
post #52

I've been noticing more push back against the open source bargain lately. Years ago software was fully build on the backs of a multitude of giants within their niche domain. But for a while now large companies have been adopting a model of taking from open source contributions and raking in billions. The original social bargain of "pay it on" has been broken by the Bezos of the world raking in billions. And yes, as o…

> I've been noticing more push back against the open source bargain lately. Open source is a niche. The vast majority of developers don’t participate in open source. If they do, it’s simple bug fixes that they need for their paid jobs. The number of people creating and releasing significant open source projects is vanishingly small relative to the entire pool of developers. I think it was a mistake to tell entry-leve…

Significant part of open source development is paid for by companies. I don't know why the myth of its being done mostly for free persists, but maybe we should stop pretending it.

Re: No More Free Work from Marak: Pay Me or Fork This

#600
post #566

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Make it a SaaS!

Already done: https://bytepack.io By the same team behind Elixir/Phoenix no less

That looks pretty cool! I'm surprised they only have enterprise level contact us pricing though, it'd be an interesting SAAS self-service product.
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