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Peter Thiel To Join Trump Transition Team

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Re: Peter Thiel To Join Trump Transition Team

#591

Post by masondixon »

eachro wrote: post #578
masondixon wrote: post #575

A huge issue today is the lack of calm, reasoned debate. As a Trump supporter I have never been able to properly explain the rationale to a liberal. I believe there is a worthy debate beneath all the political smear, but it is never reached. I believe the reason for this is the liberal media and the incredibly effective Democratic party election machine. The argument stays at the high level of "how could you vote for…

My issue with Trump has never really been about his politics. I get that immigration and loss of manufacturing jobs due to globalization are serious concerns for a large swath of the American population. What I don't understand is how anyone could feel comfortable with him as commander in chief, or as the US's representative in the international community. Perhaps that's not what most people are concerned about, but…

> how anyone could feel comfortable with him as commander in chief

I understand what you are saying here. He struggles to speak eloquently, and does not have a statesman-like persona. He is no traditional president.

But look at the last 15 years of foreign policy from "statesmen". We had two wars, Obama missed seeing the rise of ISIS, Syria is a humanitarian nightmare, we had a huge financial crash, and terrorism is on the rise.

Trump opposed the war (was not a strong supporter before, and immediately after was certainly opposed to it).

No one likes him and he doesn't owe favours to anyone. The bankers, the lobbyists, the establishment. Everything that we would agree is wrong with the country.

And he did not run on a conservative platform of religion - which has nudged the entire Republican party to the left.

And he use to be a Democrat.

There will never be another candidate like him. But sadly no one can look past the ad-hominem character attacks.

Re: Peter Thiel To Join Trump Transition Team

#592

Post by sebastos »

ch4s3 wrote: post #211
jbpetersen wrote: post #116

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Any specific highlights?

He thinks women shouldn't be able to vote. http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/peter-thiel-women-democr...

When you see comments like this, it's little wonder Thiel has gotten interested in Seasteading. Perhaps he thinks it's the only way to escape from this most virulent strain of stupid.

If we're going to debug what's wrong with America, this comment is like ground zero. Start here, and work backwards.

Re: Peter Thiel To Join Trump Transition Team

#593

Post by pg314 »

edblarney wrote: post #231
Rapzid wrote: post #178

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If we believe all the recently headlines about who he's bringing in it appears pure "pay to play". Lots of individuals who Trump "owes" through either money or support they provided to him; pure cronyism. I'm not sure Trump realizes what worked best in business, or what he felt worked best for him in what business he has done, is not necessarily best for operating policy. I'm not sure he cares. I suspect he might tho…

"Lots of individuals who Trump "owes" through either money or support they provided to him; pure cronyism." Trump is the most 'free' President in modern history. He 'owes' the least, to the fewest people. This is one thing even the center-left press were talking about. As for Thiel - $1M might seem like a lot - but Trump doesn't really 'owe' Thiel anything, because Thiel doesn't have direct future influence etc., and…

Since he never released his taxes we have no idea about his financial situation. We have no clear idea who he owns what to. After a string of business debacles his US financing sources all but dried up. He definitely owes money to Deutsche Bank. (It's going to be fun when he will have to negotiate their 14 billion fine.) It is likely that he owes money to Russian banks. He also owns real estate across the world.

I would not call him a free president, on the contrary. He is more beholden to foreign interests than any other president in recent history.

Re: Peter Thiel To Join Trump Transition Team

#594

Post by gracenotes »

puranjay wrote: post #510
pjdemers wrote: post #275

Disagreeing with each other's views on the economy, international relations, even the environment is good for the country. We need different points of view on important issues. But using race baiting to gain political power crosses a line that should never be crossed. He should not be helping to legitimize this.

At this point, I'm not even sure what's more racist: calling a group of people "lazy and unintelligent", or molly-coddling a group of people because "they need special attention". The way the left treats minorities is pretty patronizing, to be frank. (I say this as a minority)

I am not sure what molly-coddling means in this context, but as a single data point you can look at the platform page of a minority advocacy group: [0]. The actual low-level details of many of the policies (if not the headlines) share a lot in common with Sanders' platform, for instance.

I'd like to think that, for the most part, trying to address a societal problem like [1] is better than denying that any action is needed, even if the increased visibility causes strife—[2] is of interest here—or we don't get it right the first time. It's hard to discuss because many Americans begin on vastly different pages with vastly different experiences.

[0]: https://policy.m4bl.org/platform/

[1]: http://www.benjerry.com/whats-new/systemic-racism-is-real

[2] https://www.africa.upenn.edu/Articles_Gen/Letter_Birmingham....

Re: Peter Thiel To Join Trump Transition Team

#595

Post by ajeet_dhaliwal »

raspasov wrote: post #193
Rapzid wrote: post #178

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If we believe all the recently headlines about who he's bringing in it appears pure "pay to play". Lots of individuals who Trump "owes" through either money or support they provided to him; pure cronyism. I'm not sure Trump realizes what worked best in business, or what he felt worked best for him in what business he has done, is not necessarily best for operating policy. I'm not sure he cares. I suspect he might tho…

"humble-struck" - can't agree more, lol.

If he treated it like a game that you win, he won, but he can't just go home now, he's signed up to be on call 24/7. I'm not wealthy but I've treated job interviews like this and been unhappy after "winning". Now I'm highly selective about what I do. Losing such personal freedom needs someone with a real conviction about the job and stamina, he may have it, otherwise he'll be miserable. The White House probably came across as a dump compared to what he's used to.

Re: Peter Thiel To Join Trump Transition Team

#596

Post by mrslave »

I come to HN because of the high level of intelligent conversation.

This article, and ever more sadly so the comments herein, are a huge disappointment.

Trump is the non-establishment candidate the left asks for from Republicans every presidential election. Hillary is, at the very least, the establishment candidate the left profess to despise.

The propaganda is strong in this one.

Grow up everybody.

Re: Peter Thiel To Join Trump Transition Team

#597

Post by masondixon »

cyphax wrote: post #584
masondixon wrote: post #575

A huge issue today is the lack of calm, reasoned debate. As a Trump supporter I have never been able to properly explain the rationale to a liberal. I believe there is a worthy debate beneath all the political smear, but it is never reached. I believe the reason for this is the liberal media and the incredibly effective Democratic party election machine. The argument stays at the high level of "how could you vote for…

> Thankfully, freedom of speech is such an integral part of the US, that there is not one side trying to control what the other can say, and the other doing the same back. Let's hope _other_ people's freedoms aren't being taken away thanks to your vote, though. I also don't see why you would Trump will actually listen to you. Because he says so? You trust what he says? I understand and will not debate that you feel l…

> Let's hope _other_ people's freedoms aren't being taken away thanks to your vote, though.

Such as?

> I also don't see why you would Trump will actually listen to you. Because he says so? You trust what he says?

I'm not talking about Trump listening. I'm talking about liberals listening to trump supporters trying to explain to them why they lost, and why they feel they are taking away freedom of speech.

> I understand and will not debate that you feel like you haven't been heard by the American political system (I immediately take your word for it), but that just doesn't mean the alternative to staying on the same path isn't significantly worse. Or do you think your life couldn't be any worse? Worse is _also_ an alternative you may have voted for.

The past 15 years have been a disaster. War, humanitarian crises, terrorism. I mean its always been a cruisy life for a white male software engineer though. But I just can't stand irrationality (as I perceive it), but more than anything the biggest risk is the attacks on freedom of speech through the liberal's bullying, public shaming, and ad-hominem attacks.

Re: Peter Thiel To Join Trump Transition Team

#598

Post by robinwarren »

masondixon wrote: post #575

A huge issue today is the lack of calm, reasoned debate. As a Trump supporter I have never been able to properly explain the rationale to a liberal. I believe there is a worthy debate beneath all the political smear, but it is never reached. I believe the reason for this is the liberal media and the incredibly effective Democratic party election machine. The argument stays at the high level of "how could you vote for…

Why not have a go here, I'd be interested to hear your rationale.

On a less important note, re the argument being at a level of "how could you vote for someone who said that". That may not be people refusing to engage with what you see as the important points, but them focusing on what they see as the most important points. That doesn't make it right but if it is the case you may do well to understand their point of view holds that someone with his behaviour and character can't be trusted with power, they may see everything else as somewhat irrelevant. If that is the case at least understanding it may help you frame the discussion with such people, and hopefully not dismiss their arguments as petty since they think they are the most important points.

Anyway, aside complete. Let's hear the rationale for being a Trump supporter, I would be genuinely interested to hear it even if I may ultimately disagree.

Re: Peter Thiel To Join Trump Transition Team

#599

Post by codecamper »

Just googled Peter's feelings on clean energy.

Well I'm hopeful. He has made investments into clean tech. He is both smart & a business guy. So Trump will listen to him & that's good.

He is also a connection back to Tesla & energy storage.

Hmm. Maybe this Trump thing isn't so bad after all (for the planet).

Trump may want more oil -- but the reality of that is that oil is controlled by the market.

Re: Peter Thiel To Join Trump Transition Team

#600

Post by pg314 »

pg314 wrote: post #593
edblarney wrote: post #231

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"Lots of individuals who Trump "owes" through either money or support they provided to him; pure cronyism." Trump is the most 'free' President in modern history. He 'owes' the least, to the fewest people. This is one thing even the center-left press were talking about. As for Thiel - $1M might seem like a lot - but Trump doesn't really 'owe' Thiel anything, because Thiel doesn't have direct future influence etc., and…

Since he never released his taxes we have no idea about his financial situation. We have no clear idea who he owns what to. After a string of business debacles his US financing sources all but dried up. He definitely owes money to Deutsche Bank. (It's going to be fun when he will have to negotiate their 14 billion fine.) It is likely that he owes money to Russian banks. He also owns real estate across the world. I wo…

He also doesn't seem to have a real plan to disentangle himself from his business interests as a president. He said he will let his kids run the Trump foundation, but that's still a huge conflict of interest.

The traditional way to avoid conflicts of interests is to put your assets into a blind trust (i.e. liquidate your assets and let an independent person administer them without you knowing about how your money is allocated). I don't see Trump ever doing that.

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