Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

We're no longer attracting top talent: the brain drain killing American science

theguardian.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

581–590 of 606 posts

Re: We're no longer attracting top talent: the brain drain killing American science

#581

Post by rstuart4133 »

mr_00ff00 wrote: post #181
lateforwork wrote: post #112

In all important areas such as clean energy, fusion energy, biotechnology and AI the Chinese government is heavily investing in and pushing Chinese companies to lead the world. China Is Outspending the U.S. to Achieve the ‘Holy Grail’ of Clean Energy: Fusion See: https://www.nytimes.com/2025/12/13/climate/china-us-fusion-e... America's lead in biotechnology is slipping, while China has made synthetic biology a nation…

But related to this article, is China winning in terms of accumulating talent? I don’t think people all over Europe/Asia/Africa migrate to China. If they succeed, it’s purely with their own talent. The US still has that advantage even if it has less of it, unless I am mistaken.

> But related to this article, is China winning in terms of accumulating talent?

You can ask Google for metrics:

- China produces about over 1.3 to 1.6 million new engineering graduates per year.

- The USA produces about 130,000–200,000, or about 1/10 of China, but has a population of about 1/4.

- Europe is hard to measure, but USA plus Europe combined is almost certainly less than China by a significant margin.

Re: We're no longer attracting top talent: the brain drain killing American science

#582

Post by tomhow »

viking123 wrote: post #565
NietzscheanNull wrote: post #524

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Highlighting Israel's inexplicably strong influence over US foreign policy is not the dog-whistle you seem to be implying it is.

They just scream antisemitism when you point that the bloodthirsty fascist leadership in Israel is trying to get US to die and fight for them in Iran even though Iran is only an issue for Israel. Save the goyim from this one and just go at it alone please. And btw, I don't think normal Israeli people have anything to do with this stuff, it's mostly the bloodthirsty elites, the plebs in Israel like the rest of the wor…

Please don't engage in ideological battle on HN. The guidelines make it clear we're trying for something better here. https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html

Re: We're no longer attracting top talent: the brain drain killing American science

#584

Post by gravifer »

ethbr1 wrote: post #528
mlrtime wrote: post #502

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The major point being is that China doesn't have sanctuary cities. This wouldn't happen if the cities didn't safe harbor the illegals. Most replies at this point will shift the goal posts stating 'due process', again keeping on topic, not available in China either.

I'm just going appreciate the irony someone comparing Chinese civil liberties with relation to internal security forces favorably with the US. Say what you want about ICE, but the reason they wear masks is that the US citizenry still holds power (explicitly with firearms, implicitly with voting, and legally via the judicial system). In China, they don't have to wear masks.

Seems like everyone forgot that before locking down in early 2020, Beijing was trying to ship the view that healthy people wearing masks is immoral - because HK protesters needed those to protect themselves from persecution. Oh, and umbrellas too, because surveillance cameras :) Really shows you the people in PRC huh?

(And then a U-turn where anyone that doesn't wear a mask [even for participating volleyball matches or flute concerts] is an enemy of the state. And if you are a disabled elderly and lockdown yourself, refusing the state-mandated tests, you are an enemy of the state. And they knock down your apartment doors to gas your cats and dogs.)

I really hope the red necks tearing down the procedural system of justice, as well as the left network hosts that got bedazzeled just after a trip to china know what they're asking for. Beware the wishes you make.

Re: We're no longer attracting top talent: the brain drain killing American science

#585

Post by chaostheory »

autoexec wrote: post #551
chaostheory wrote: post #537

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We are in a record amount of debt and we are about to go to war again. That’s not including the fact that we have a shortage of teachers who are underpaid. As for “new” sources of taxation, increasing the burden on the middle class is yet another way the bottom 20% eats up 80% of the resources. Tax the rich? Unfortunately, if you tax them high enough, they will just leave. They haven’t been patriotic since the last c…

> We are in a record amount of debt and we are about to go to war again. Isn't it funny how nobody ever worries about how much that's going to cost, no matter how unnecessary there's never any effort to make sure that our warmongering is funded before burdening taxpayers with it. Seems like a ripe target for some tax savings.

People did worry about the cost pre-Biden because they were unnecessary. Unfortunately, for everyone both Putin and Xi exist. Even if you put your head into the ground, it’s not going to change their intentions or behavior. Only missiles and drones will. Your comment is over a decade out of date.

Re: We're no longer attracting top talent: the brain drain killing American science

#586

Post by [deleted] »

deepsun wrote: post #309
yladiz wrote: post #256

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So you have a business with no revenue that you fund through capital gains? I'm not sure I get the connection between the two.

With revenue of course, how else would I be able to pay the salaries and bills? But I'm not going to move to a country if I know that every quarterly dividend would leave me with 25-50% less money on my bank account.

[deleted]

Re: We're no longer attracting top talent: the brain drain killing American science

#587

Post by nathan_compton »

deepsun wrote: post #309
yladiz wrote: post #256

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So you have a business with no revenue that you fund through capital gains? I'm not sure I get the connection between the two.

With revenue of course, how else would I be able to pay the salaries and bills? But I'm not going to move to a country if I know that every quarterly dividend would leave me with 25-50% less money on my bank account.

I wrote a snarkier reply originally, but a more tempered summary would be: I can't imagine really caring about this. You cannot take it with you.

Re: We're no longer attracting top talent: the brain drain killing American science

#588

Post by [deleted] »

Terr_ wrote: post #289
Sohcahtoa82 wrote: post #281

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I guess I wasn't specific enough. Sure, ICE does have the authority to perform arrests for some crimes unrelated to immigration, that's not what I'm referring to. ICE is arresting US citizens based on immigration charges.

Tacking on: I feel that is also just secondary "icing on the cake" versus the bigger problem you identified in the rest of your sentence, a portion which they ignored. Actually, hold up for a second... What kind of self-described "lawyer" could possibly ignore that portion... except by operating in bad-faith?: > denying due process, then ignoring court orders to release them. Right, even if ICE/CBP were somehow only…

[deleted]

Re: We're no longer attracting top talent: the brain drain killing American science

#589

Post by leptons »

s3r3nity wrote: post #538
leptons wrote: post #218

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think the next 3 or so years in the US are going to be a real awakening for you, if the last year hasn't. It's going to become more and more difficult to shove your head deeper into the sand.

Nah I’m good, and we’re pretty good overall. See how I can have a different opinion and not get arrested? Whereas if you ask someone in China if they’re communist, they’re not allowed to say “No.”

When your opinion of a fascist authoritarian government is "nah I'm good", then anything that follows is nothing worth listening to. Using whataboutism to excuse the current administration is ridiculous.

Re: We're no longer attracting top talent: the brain drain killing American science

#590

Post by disgruntledphd2 »

rayiner wrote: post #522
disgruntledphd2 wrote: post #464

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> against the backdrop of challenging sociological factors and mass low-skill immigration I'm pretty sure that poverty is the issue here. Kids who don't get enough to eat, don't get enough time (or perhaps too much time in some sad cases) with their parents, kids who don't have many opportunities tend to do worse at standardised testing. This is entirely fixable, but it's not (unfortunately) just a matter of funding…

“Poverty” might be the cause, but it’s not just poverty by itself. Every country has rich people and poor people. The U.S., however, has that normal spectrum, plus subpopulations that have unique circumstances that aren't accounted for just by income level. Look at NAEP scores: https://fordhaminstitute.org/national/commentary/some-racial... (Table 1). Asians average 312 in 8th grade math, compared to 293 for whites a…

> Why is there such a big gap in test scores between whites and asians when economically the two groups are similar? There must be some additional sociological factor at play behind poverty in and of itself. One might hypothesize that selective immigration plays a role. The majority of the U.S. asian population is foreign born, and is in the U.S. as a result of skilled immigration. That might have an effect on their kids test scores that’s not accounted for by household income alone. That’s the kind of additional sociological factor that countries like Japan and Korea don’t have.

OK, So I've just actually read your fordham institute link, and you realise that it doesn't argue for this point, instead arguing that it's two parent households and expectations around college that create the gap (which is pretty small, to be fair). This is basically the point that I'm trying to make here, in that parental and broader cultural expectations drive these differences, not selective immigration.

Additionally, for your point to be true, you'd need to observe these kinds of effects for 3-4th generation Asian immigrants, which both seems pretty unlikely to me and difficult to collect data around (as there probably aren't enough Asian americans in this group).

I really think that cultural expectations and poverty provide a more parsimonious account of this data, tbh.

> The majority of the U.S. asian population is foreign born, and is in the U.S. as a result of skilled immigration.

On this point specifically, the percentage for ESL (which normally correlates with 1st generation immigrants) is about 12, which means 88% of the Asians in your sample speak English natively. Again, this article really doesn't support your point.

Post reply on HN