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X offices raided in France as UK opens fresh investigation into Grok

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581–590 of 1001 posts

Re: X offices raided in France as UK opens fresh investigation into Grok

#581

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Punishing kids after the fact does not stop the damage from occurring. Nothing can stop the damage that has already occurred, but if you stop the source of the nudes, you can stop future damage from occurring to even more girls.

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Child sexual abuse material is literally in the training sets. Saying "banning AI" as though it's all the same thing, and all morally-neutral, is disingenuous. (Yes, a system with both nudity and children in its dataset might still be able to produce such images – and there are important discussions to be had about that – but giving xAI the benefit of equivocation here is an act of malice.)

Re: X offices raided in France as UK opens fresh investigation into Grok

#582

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> This looks like plain political pressure. No lives were saved, and no crime was prevented by harassing local workers. The company made and released a tool with seemingly no guard-rails, which was used en masse to generate deepfakes and child pornography.

[flagged]

Not really, they put a shit ton of effort in to make sure you can't create any kind of nude/suggestive pictures of anyone. I imagine they have strict controls on making images of children, but I don't feel inclined to find out.

Re: X offices raided in France as UK opens fresh investigation into Grok

#583

[flagged]

It has always been illegal and morally reprehensible to create, own, distribute or store sexually explicit material that represents a real person without their consent, regardless if they are underage or not.

Grok is a platform that is enabling this en masse. If xAI can't bring in guardrails or limit who can access these capabilities, then they deserve what's coming to them.

Re: X offices raided in France as UK opens fresh investigation into Grok

#584

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's not hypothetical. And in fact the girl who was being targeted was expelled not the boys who did it [1]. Those boys absolutely should be held accountable. But I also don't think that Grok should be able to quickly and easily generate fake revenge porn for minors. [1] https://www.nbcnewyork.com/news/national-international/girl-...

>And in fact the girl who was being targeted was expelled not the boys who did it [1]. And the AI is at fault for this sentencing, not the school authorities/prosecutors/judges dishing justice? WTF. How is this an AI problem and not a legal system problem?

Have you considered that it is possible for two things to be problems?

Re: X offices raided in France as UK opens fresh investigation into Grok

#585

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's not hypothetical. And in fact the girl who was being targeted was expelled not the boys who did it [1]. Those boys absolutely should be held accountable. But I also don't think that Grok should be able to quickly and easily generate fake revenge porn for minors. [1] https://www.nbcnewyork.com/news/national-international/girl-...

>And in fact the girl who was being targeted was expelled not the boys who did it [1]. And the AI is at fault for this sentencing, not the school authorities/prosecutors/judges dishing justice? WTF. How is this an AI problem and not a legal system problem?

Grok made the pictures.

The school authorities messed up.

Both are accuntable.

Re: X offices raided in France as UK opens fresh investigation into Grok

#586

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

In your hypothetical scenario, why aren't the school kids making and distributing fake nudes of his daughter be the ones getting in trouble? Have we a outsourced all accountability for the crimes of humans to AI now?

They may well get in trouble, but in that takes time, in the meantime photos will have been seen by most kids in school + you might get a year of bullying.

Education might be so disrupted you have to change schools.

Re: X offices raided in France as UK opens fresh investigation into Grok

#587
post #489
post #461

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's not really different from how we treat any other platform that can host CSAM. I guess the main difference is that it's being "made" instead of simply "distributed" here

[flagged]

> let's distinguish between generated images, however revolting, and actual child sexual abuse.

Can't because even before GenAI the "oh its generated in photoshop" or "they just look young" excuse was used successfully to allow a lot of people to walk free. the law was tightend in the early 2000s for precisely this reason

Re: X offices raided in France as UK opens fresh investigation into Grok

#588

Earlier quoted context omitted.

At my kids school the children have been using grok to create pics of other children without clothes on - chatgpt etc won’t let you do that - grok needs some controls and x seem unable to do that themselves.

What would raiding the office achieve in this case apart from just showing off power.

Why are you defending X here?

It sounds like they are following due process.

Re: X offices raided in France as UK opens fresh investigation into Grok

#589
post #532

One of the charges is "fraudulent data extraction by an organised group." That's going to affect the entire social media industry if applied broadly.

Frankly it sounds to me like a "show me the man and I'll show you the crime" kind of operation. France and the UK, and judging by yesterday's speech by the PM of Spain maybe the whole EU might be looking to do what China and Russia did earlier on and start cracking down on foreign social media by making it impossible to operate without total alignment with their vision and not just their (new) rules. Together with a…

It's worth pointing out that in France and the UK, the authorities involved are arms length independent of the political bodies - it's not like the US where if you give the President good vibes you can become head of the FBI, and all you have to do in return is whatever he says. There are statutory instruments (in France, constitutional clauses), that determine the independence of these authorities.

They are tasked - and held to account by respective legislative bodies - with implementing the law as written.

Nobody wrote a law saying "Go after Grok". There is however a law in most countries about the creation and dissemination of CSAM material and non-consensual pornography. Some of that law is relatively new (the UK only introduced some of these laws in recent years), but they all predate the current wave of AI investment.

Founders, boards of directors and their internal and external advisors could:

1. Read the law and make sure any tools they build comply

2. When told their tools don't comply take immediate and decisive action to change the tools

3. Work with law enforcement to apply the law as written

Those companies, if they find this too burdensome, have the choice of not operating in that market. By operating in that market, they both implicitly agree to the law, and are required to explicitly abide by it.

They can't then complain that the law is unfair (it's not), that it's being politicised (How? By whom? Show your working), and that this is all impossible in their home market where they are literally offering presents to the personal enrichment of the President on bended knee while he demands that ownership structures of foreign social media companies like TikTok are changed to meet the agenda of himself and his administration.

So, would the EU like more tighter speech controls? Yes, they'd like implementation of the controls on free speech enshrined in legislation created by democratically appointed representatives. The alternative - algorithms that create abusive content, of women and children in particular - are not wanted by the people of the UK, the EU, or most of the rest of the World, laws are written to that effect, and are then enforced by the authorities tasked with that enforcement.

This isn't "anti-democratic", it's literally democracy in action standing up to technocratic feudalism that is an Ayn Randian-wet dream being played out by some morons who got lucky.

Re: X offices raided in France as UK opens fresh investigation into Grok

#590
post #532

One of the charges is "fraudulent data extraction by an organised group." That's going to affect the entire social media industry if applied broadly.

Frankly it sounds to me like a "show me the man and I'll show you the crime" kind of operation. France and the UK, and judging by yesterday's speech by the PM of Spain maybe the whole EU might be looking to do what China and Russia did earlier on and start cracking down on foreign social media by making it impossible to operate without total alignment with their vision and not just their (new) rules. Together with a…

Yes, if you don't follow EU laws prepare to not do business in Europe. Likewise, if you don't follow US laws I'd advise against trying to do business in USA.
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