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Nvidia buys $5B in Intel

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Re: Nvidia buys $5B in Intel

#581

Post by high_na_euv »

tw04 wrote: post #482
arkmm wrote: post #448

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This misses the forest from the trees IMO: - The datacenter GPU market is 10x larger than the consumer GPU market for Nvidia (and it's still growing). Winning an extra few percentage points in consumer is not a priority anymore. - Nvidia doesn't have a CPU offering for the datacenter market and they were blocked from acquiring ARM. It's in their interest to have a friend on the CPU side. - Nvidia is fabless and has c…

> Nvidia doesn't have a CPU offering for the datacenter market and they were blocked from acquiring ARM. It's in their interest to have a friend on the CPU side. Someone should tell nvidia that. They sure seem to think they have a datacenter CPU. https://www.nvidia.com/en-us/data-center/grace-cpu-superchip...

Jensen was literally talking about the need for x86 CPU on yesterdays webcast

Re: Nvidia buys $5B in Intel

#582

Post by high_na_euv »

throwaway2037 wrote: post #479
arkmm wrote: post #448

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This misses the forest from the trees IMO: - The datacenter GPU market is 10x larger than the consumer GPU market for Nvidia (and it's still growing). Winning an extra few percentage points in consumer is not a priority anymore. - Nvidia doesn't have a CPU offering for the datacenter market and they were blocked from acquiring ARM. It's in their interest to have a friend on the CPU side. - Nvidia is fabless and has c…

> Nvidia is fabless and has concentrated supplier and geopolitical risk with TSMC. Intel is one of the only other leading fabs onshor[e] TSMC is building state of the art fabs in Arizona, USA. Samsung in Texas, USA. I assume these are being done to reduce geopolitical risk on all sides. Something that I never read about: Why can't NVidia use Samsung fabs? They are very close to TSMC state of the art.

TSMC will not have state of the art on US soil.

Taiwanese gov prevents them from doing it. Leading node has to be on Taiwanese soil

Re: Nvidia buys $5B in Intel

#583

Post by high_na_euv »

hakfoo wrote: post #545
upboundspiral wrote: post #429

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This seems like it could be a long term existential threat for AMD. AMD CPU + GPU combos are finally coming out strong, both with MI300+ series in the supercomputing space, Strix Halo in laptops, etc. They have the advantage of being able to run code already optimized for x86 (important for gamers and HPC code), which NVIDIA doesn't have. Imagine if Grace Blackwell had x86 chips instead of Arm. If NVIDIA can get Inte…

x86 is important for gamers, but is it for HPC? That tends to be far less dependent on binary blobs.

Jensen was talking about it during webcast, so apparently yes

Re: Nvidia buys $5B in Intel

#584

Post by [deleted] »

93po wrote: post #224
geertj wrote: post #58

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> It’s so gross that companies can just dilute and create stock out of thin air like this. Intel is up 30% pre market on this news so I think the existing shareholders will be fine.

i stole $100 from you, but you later won a scratch off for $300, so my stealing was ok

[deleted]

Re: Nvidia buys $5B in Intel

#585

Post by Mistletoe »

geertj wrote: post #58
Mistletoe wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It’s the most important part of the story. It’s so gross that companies can just dilute and create stock out of thin air like this. Why hold stock in Intel if the only people that ever buy the real stock and create buy pressure are the plebs? Here is the previous time… > Intel stock experienced dilution because the U.S. government converted CHIPS Act grants into an equity stake, acquiring a significant ownership perc…

> It’s so gross that companies can just dilute and create stock out of thin air like this. Intel is up 30% pre market on this news so I think the existing shareholders will be fine.

And it is already trending down today, I wonder how long it will stay up and how long it will take the average investor to figure out NVDA isn't buying INTC on the open market and driving up the price.

Re: Nvidia buys $5B in Intel

#586

Post by jerf »

auggierose wrote: post #514
jerf wrote: post #362

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They want a source of chips for the wars they want to conduct that is not either controlled by the party they want to go war with, or way way closer to the party they want to go to war with than they are. Buying a chunk of Intel is a way of making sure they do the things the government wants that will lead to that outcome. Or at least so the theory goes; I've got my own cynicism on this matter and wouldn't dream of t…

I find it funny that people talk about a US/China war as a real possibility. You are aware that that would be the end of life on earth as we know it, right?

Unfortunately, "it would end life on Earth as we know it" is not, on its own terms, a thing that will stop it from happening. All it takes is the people who can make the decision deciding to do it because they think they will come out ahead, and not caring about what it may do to anyone else. And they don't even have to be right. They just have to think they will come out ahead.

Don't mistake talking about a thing as advocating for that thing. It leaves you completely unable to process international politics, and frankly, a lot of other news and discussion as well. If you can only think about things you approve of, your model of the world is worse than useless.

Re: Nvidia buys $5B in Intel

#587

Post by [deleted] »

adrian_b wrote: post #568
kbolino wrote: post #355

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The only consumer GPUs ten years ago that offered decent FP64 performance were the GTX TITAN series. And they were beasts! It's a shame nothing quite like them exists anymore. But they were the highest of high-end cards, certainly not that common or cheap.

AMD Hawaii GPUs in their professional variant (FirePro), which were cheap, unlike the "datacenter" GPUs of today, and the more recent Radeon VII had much better FP64 performance per $ than GTX Titan. Moreover, there were claims that the memory errors on GTX Titan were quite frequent. On graphics applications memory errors seldom matter, but if you have to do a computation twice to be certain that there were no memory…

[deleted]

Re: Nvidia buys $5B in Intel

#588

Post by kbolino »

adrian_b wrote: post #568
kbolino wrote: post #355

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The only consumer GPUs ten years ago that offered decent FP64 performance were the GTX TITAN series. And they were beasts! It's a shame nothing quite like them exists anymore. But they were the highest of high-end cards, certainly not that common or cheap.

AMD Hawaii GPUs in their professional variant (FirePro), which were cheap, unlike the "datacenter" GPUs of today, and the more recent Radeon VII had much better FP64 performance per $ than GTX Titan. Moreover, there were claims that the memory errors on GTX Titan were quite frequent. On graphics applications memory errors seldom matter, but if you have to do a computation twice to be certain that there were no memory…

Fair enough. I did not know about these. It's hard to find reliable MSRP for them today, though. Given the era, market segment, and the competition, I'd estimate $1500-2000. It's not clear to me they were on consumer store shelves, either, whereas the GTX Titan was.

A cheap GPU ten-plus years ago was $200-300. That GPU either had no FP64 units at all, or had them "crippled" just like today. What happened between then and now is that the $1k+ market segment became the $10k+ market segment (and the $200+ market segment became the $500+ market segment). That sucks, and nVidia and AMD are absolutely milking their customers for all they're worth, but nothing really got newly "crippled" along the way.

Re: Nvidia buys $5B in Intel

#589

Post by mihaaly »

evanjrowley wrote: post #211

Nvidia's stake in Intel could have terrible consequences. First, it is in Nvidia's interest to kill Intel's Arc graphics, and that would be very bad because it is the only thing brighing GPU prices down for consumers. Second, the death of Intel graphics / Arc would be extremely bad for Linux, because Intel's approach to GPU drivers is the best for compatibility, wheras Nvidia is actively hostile to drivers on Linux.…

Now the whole purchase makes sense! : /

Using fortunes falling in the lap to kill competition is a common practice of economics (vs. technology) oriented organizations. That brings benefits only for the organization, for others it brings damages and disappointments.

Re: Nvidia buys $5B in Intel

#590

Post by yvdriess »

smegger001 wrote: post #375
YeahThisIsMe wrote: post #303

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why would anything that isn't Intel implode? And what's "everything"?

a plateauing in AI development leading to another AI Winter causing dotcom bubble 2 electric boogaloo.

If anything that would be a boost to Intel. One of their problems is GPU capex sucking the air out of the room.
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