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FedNow Is Live

federalreserve.gov

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Re: FedNow Is Live

#581

Post by gtirloni »

lampiaio wrote: post #444
TechBro8615 wrote: post #192

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sure, but in most countries, those services are provided by banks, not the government. There is certainly something to be said for legislation like open banking regulations that encourages/forces banks to facilitate instant peer to peer payments. But that's a far cry from a service offered directly from the government (okay, technically the fed isn't the government, but it may as well be).

> in most countries, those services are provided by banks, not the government That's something I always point out when telling others how awesome the Brazilian Pix system https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pix_(payment_system) is. It's not a private initiative by a bunch of individual banks, but rather a zero-fee payment system managed by the country's central bank: https://www.bcb.gov.br/en/financialstability/pixfaqen .

And it seriously rocks. It has been such a tremendous change to everyday life.

Re: FedNow Is Live

#582

Post by jowea »

oorza wrote: post #548
LadyCailin wrote: post #537

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Credit card fees that aren’t passed through to you are a bit tragedy of the commons. Probably good for them to go away. It’s fine if you choose to pay them, and it’s still worth it to you, but otherwise you’re forcing everyone around you to subsidize your credit card rewards. That’s not fair.

Alternatively, everyone not taking advantage of the credit card protections isn't taking advantage of what's offered around them. Everyone should be subsidizing everyone else, because no one should be using a debit card to make direct consumer purchases in 2023. It's too fraught with risk comparatively, and even the scummiest of the sub-prime credit cards give you a grace period to not accrue interest.

It is relevant that credit cards with good reward programs are more accessible to wealthier people, meaning that both people who don't use credit cards and poorer people with inferior credit cards are subsidizing them.

Re: FedNow Is Live

#583

Post by [deleted] »

phpisthebest wrote: post #533
ZoomerCretin wrote: post #522

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>with a focus on mocking online misbehaviour and a reputation for unpopular political views. A less generous interpretation is that they coordinate harassment campaigns against transgender people and have caused at least three suicides.

[flagged]

[deleted]

Re: FedNow Is Live

#584

Post by patmorgan23 »

pyrelight wrote: post #426
semiquaver wrote: post #413

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Apologies if I’ve misunderstood you (edit: I have) but assuming you are saying that 1ms to transfer funds between banks is ridiculously slow, why do you say that? Light travels about 300km in one millisecond in a vacuum, about 200km in optical fiber. The best achievable theoretical fiber optic RTT for NYC-LA is about 35-40ms. In practice 65ms+ is more realistic due to routing overhead and the fact that cables aren’t…

This is the most hacker news conversation ever.

Yeah like who the f*ck cares if their bank transfer takes 1 second or 1 millisecond.

Re: FedNow Is Live

#585

Post by pas »

oorza wrote: post #548
LadyCailin wrote: post #537

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Credit card fees that aren’t passed through to you are a bit tragedy of the commons. Probably good for them to go away. It’s fine if you choose to pay them, and it’s still worth it to you, but otherwise you’re forcing everyone around you to subsidize your credit card rewards. That’s not fair.

Alternatively, everyone not taking advantage of the credit card protections isn't taking advantage of what's offered around them. Everyone should be subsidizing everyone else, because no one should be using a debit card to make direct consumer purchases in 2023. It's too fraught with risk comparatively, and even the scummiest of the sub-prime credit cards give you a grace period to not accrue interest.

... umm, no, at least in my experience. I happily ordered stuff online for years from many merchants.

I want banks and stripe and gateways and shopify and visa/mc to weed out bad actors fast.

and if some small shop starts to transact a lot, let them manage their risk, don't require consumer side credit for this.

there's already a ton of data, endless kyc/aml paperwork put on consumers and banks/gateways they should figure it out, and if someone still insists on paying hundreds of thousands on totally-free-bitcoins.top after the bank, the app, the browser, their neighbor warned them then let them. and let them try a chargeback.

Re: FedNow Is Live

#586

Post by MBCook »

sjdmdlakziggy wrote: post #559
wslh wrote: post #538

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Last time, a decade ago, I played with RabbitMQ and similar open source queue system they didn't handle congestion and rate limitation well (crashed). From my little experience with classical IBM systems like MQ they knew about that stuff.

I spent a couple years deploying and integrating IBM MQ, and I own a couple of services currently that interact with it. It was (just a couple years ago) and probably still is more robust than current open source solutions, as long as you weren't planning on forking the code for some very specific use case that requires heavy modification, or the more likely situation of just wanting to save money. As far as message…

Being able to publicly claim your product as the one that underlies part of the federal reserve banking system has got to be worth some real money to IBM.

Re: FedNow Is Live

#588

Post by xyst »

Mortiffer wrote: post #83

Amazing news. Kinda sad to see that Stripe was not on the list of early adopters but I'm sure they will implement it soon. In Switzerland we build an awesome eBill system ontop of the equivalent thing to FedNow. Its all run by Six Group which is the biggest Stock Exchange but it is jointly owned by the big banks and government. So they all agreed to add this eBilling system. Its so much superior to having paper come…

FedNow can undercut most of their credit card processing business. Not sure why they would even get on board.

Re: FedNow Is Live

#589

Post by jowea »

88913527 wrote: post #441
HoyaSaxa wrote: post #314

Earlier quoted context omitted.

TLDR: Nearly all payments will irrefutably settle within a handful of seconds Strictly speaking the primary means in which money moves in the United States from a volume perspective is ACH today. That system is a T+1 day from a default perspective, but it has offered the option to same-day settle during a handful of batches throughout a business day. However, ACH is not irrefutable and so it is common to have holds a…

Couldn't having payments settle so quickly result in increased risk of overall system instability? I don't have a specific example, but I'm thinking of things like bank run panics. I'm sure this sort of thing would have been considered, however.

Good question. Did that happen in any other country with faster payments? And SVB collapsed fast before this.

Re: FedNow Is Live

#590

Post by aidenn0 »

mattsan wrote: post #550
aidenn0 wrote: post #436

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is the eventual end-game that I can send money from my account at Bank A, to a friend's account at Bank B to split a check at dinner without using a third party like Venmo?

I had to read this twice - is it really not like in the UK? Is this the first US implementation of "Faster Payments"? Sure people in the UK sometimes use PayPal, Revolut, but most of the time its always just a friend gives (and you save on your banking app) their bank account number and sort code, and you instantly send it across. edit: with no fee

Wire transfers exist, but have a high fixed-transfer cost ($20 is not unusual).

The larger banks have their own systems that only work within the bank; some smaller banks offer systems that work with any bank that offers the same system.

ACH exists, and I've used it to move money between accounts I own, but there is some friction to set up. I don't know anyone who uses it for C2C payments.

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