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GitHub staff are required to use Teams by Sep 1, 2023

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Re: GitHub staff are required to use Teams by Sep 1, 2023

#581

Post by ChickenNugger »

ukoki wrote: post #279
aspaviento wrote: post #212

Using it on the browser: - it's wonky - 1 on 1 calls not always share the screen and I need to hang up, refresh the browser and call again - translation stopped working both ways. Once a text is translated it doesn't go back to its original language - it's a mess if you make a lot of group calls with different people. You end up having trillions of opened chat. I ended up pinning the main ones to keep them at the top…

You forgot the worst one! When you copy a message in Teams, it "helpfully" adds a header so you end up pasting "[Tuesday 12:54] John Doe" into random form fields / your terminal / your browser location bar ten times a day

...I would seriously consider bytecode manipulation to remove this "feature" from the executable. And I haven't touched even assembly in almost 20 years.

Re: GitHub staff are required to use Teams by Sep 1, 2023

#582

Post by wkat4242 »

chaostheory wrote: post #504
addandsubtract wrote: post #362

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I feel like a lot of it comes down to which system & client people use. If you're on PC or macOS and using the desktop client, you're probably having a good experience (as long as you only have one account). If you're on Linux or use the web version, you're probably going to have a bad time.

The web client has been far more stable and useable than the desktop client. Someone can correct me, but the desktop client doesn’t even seem like it’s fully native even on Windows.

That's because it's not. It's electron on every platform including Windows.

Re: GitHub staff are required to use Teams by Sep 1, 2023

#583

Post by markmark »

jasonlotito wrote: post #89
kimbernator wrote: post #72

How is it possible that Teams is still such a poor product? I really didn't like it when my job switched like 6 years ago, and I don't recall ever feeling that it improved in any meaningful way. I switched jobs to one using Slack and it's not perfect but it is a lot better. It's almost a meme at this point. In the presence of other clients that have gotten it "right" (or at least more "right" than teams) like Slack,…

They are still using Slack. This is for video conferencing only. I've heard that with regards to video conferencing, it's competitive with zoom.

My current company had the same thing happen on acquisition, we had to ditch Zoom for Teams for video, but could stay on Slack. I find Teams video absolutely fine. It just works and I never think about it.

Re: GitHub staff are required to use Teams by Sep 1, 2023

#584

Post by luckman212 »

generalk wrote: post #421

Regardless of what you think of Teams -- I myself have had nothing but poor experiences over 2.5 years of using it daily -- it's telling that Microsoft has to require folks to use Teams. I'm sure this is just Microsoft unifying everyone on the same comms platform, but seriously, I don't know anyone who chooses Teams. I know non-tech folks who chose Outlook 365 because of familiarity and then end up on Teams because i…

It's boring reading comments like these.

Really? 2.5 years of "nothing but poor experiences"? I have to ask: what the hell is wrong with your computer?

I started using Teams heavily in 2020 and yes, back then it was unequivocally the worst of the bunch. But I've seen it make great strides, and it's been many months, perhaps years since I've really had any problems with it. Audio, video, screen sharing, PSTN dial-in, whiteboard, call handoff between mobile app and desktop... it all works fine. I'm not using anything special. Just a run-of-the-mill MacBook Air. They started pushing out an Arm-native build for macOS last year and that really solved the slow perf and battery drain. As long as you stay reasonably current with updates, Teams works just fine.

It's just lazy at this point to bash Teams "because".

Re: GitHub staff are required to use Teams by Sep 1, 2023

#585

Post by syngrog66 »

MS Teams has been the worst tool of its type I've ever been forced to use. Emphasis on forced.

Historically the UX of most (but not all) Microsoft software has been bad, so I was not surprised.

For the same project I was forced to use Azure's login system the first time: another clownshow.

It was a sad day when Microsoft acquired two of my favorite things, GitHub and Minecraft, because I bet that the awful "Microsoftness" would creep in and degrade them. At least the Teams mandate at GitHub is only for internal comms. But it tells me that bad taste and bad judgment is still there.

Re: GitHub staff are required to use Teams by Sep 1, 2023

#586

Post by wkat4242 »

vel0city wrote: post #412
onlyrealcuzzo wrote: post #394

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Things like having chats for Meets and sharing documents in a chat then get integrated into Drive are things that Teams does well and last I saw Google still kind of didn't have a fully-baked solution, at least at the time. I'm not sure what quality of integration Teams has - but Chat has had this integration for several months now.

Here's an example in Teams. I'm in a call and someone shares a document in the chat. That chat is (somewhat) exactly like any other group chat in Teams, it appears in the same list as other chats I've had in my recents and is searchable in the same way. There's a couple of odd features that are or are not available from chats from meetings, but those are at the fringes of usages usually so for the most part its the s…

> Now, that document isn't just in that chat, its also in the OneDrive/Sharepoint and in the history of recently opened documents in something like Excel or Word or Powerpoint.

That for me is a huge drawback because it's constantly cluttering up a huge mess of different document versions in SharePoint and teams itself.

Try to search for the right one a few weeks later. Good luck :)

Re: GitHub staff are required to use Teams by Sep 1, 2023

#587

Post by wkat4242 »

thepostman0 wrote: post #481
ifyoubuildit wrote: post #365

Teams is dogshit in general, but the unforgivable part is that sometimes messages just don't show up until you restart the client. It's hard to know when this is happening, unless someone follows up on or refers to the missing message(s), but once you catch it a couple times it's hard to have any faith in the software at all. We've been told that this has been fixed, and it does seem more rare now, but I still end up…

For me it is the amount of ram it demands. Most of the day it is an IRC client, for a small portion it does voice/video. How does it need a gig of RAM all day? This squeezes my computer towards e-waste, and I'll be damned if I throw this computer away for an IRC client. Screw you MSFT, get it fixed.

> How does it need a gig of RAM all day?

Electron.

Now, an electron app doesn't have to be terrible. The tech makes it really easy to make turds, but if you spend the time optimizing it, it can be very good. See VS Code for example.

I think Microsoft should acquire the company that makes VS Code and let those guys teach the Teams devs how to do it.

Oh wait ...

Re: GitHub staff are required to use Teams by Sep 1, 2023

#588

Post by kneebonian »

wkat4242 wrote: post #579
generalk wrote: post #421

Regardless of what you think of Teams -- I myself have had nothing but poor experiences over 2.5 years of using it daily -- it's telling that Microsoft has to require folks to use Teams. I'm sure this is just Microsoft unifying everyone on the same comms platform, but seriously, I don't know anyone who chooses Teams. I know non-tech folks who chose Outlook 365 because of familiarity and then end up on Teams because i…

I think the biggest problem with Teams is the leadership's strategy. They seem to be focusing on adding as many glossy features as quickly as possible. The quality, performance and consistency doesn't seem to be a point of consideration at all. Yet for a user who spends a lot of time in it each day, I really don't care about animated waves on top of my video, or this together mode. I just want it to work and not take…

It's CDD, checklist driven development. When you are competing against another product in the enterprise space the people making the decision probably won't be using what you are selling often but they will look at the list of features, so money spent adding new features is more important and higher prioritized than stability reliability or any other nonfunctional requirement.

Re: GitHub staff are required to use Teams by Sep 1, 2023

#589

Post by vel0city »

wkat4242 wrote: post #586
vel0city wrote: post #412

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Here's an example in Teams. I'm in a call and someone shares a document in the chat. That chat is (somewhat) exactly like any other group chat in Teams, it appears in the same list as other chats I've had in my recents and is searchable in the same way. There's a couple of odd features that are or are not available from chats from meetings, but those are at the fringes of usages usually so for the most part its the s…

> Now, that document isn't just in that chat, its also in the OneDrive/Sharepoint and in the history of recently opened documents in something like Excel or Word or Powerpoint. That for me is a huge drawback because it's constantly cluttering up a huge mess of different document versions in SharePoint and teams itself. Try to search for the right one a few weeks later. Good luck :)

I don't experience this at all. Maybe our SharePoint/OneDrive is better managed, maybe something else is going on, but I have not yet encountered a single time of multiple versions unless someone was explicitly copy and pasting the file to make versioning in their own dumb system. Which, the same dumb thing could be done in Google Workspace.

Don't have people copy and pasting the file all over the place and you won't have a thousand versions of important_numbers_v3_final_V2_DRAFT.xls.xlsx. Thats a people problem not a technical problem.

Re: GitHub staff are required to use Teams by Sep 1, 2023

#590

Post by wkat4242 »

rexreed wrote: post #532
kimbernator wrote: post #72

How is it possible that Teams is still such a poor product? I really didn't like it when my job switched like 6 years ago, and I don't recall ever feeling that it improved in any meaningful way. I switched jobs to one using Slack and it's not perfect but it is a lot better. It's almost a meme at this point. In the presence of other clients that have gotten it "right" (or at least more "right" than teams) like Slack,…

How is it possible SAP is still such a poor product after almost 4 decades? Time does not cure all ills with software. The powers that purchase software are not swayed by arguments about user experience or even efficiency.

SAP is just a swamp of legacy. Companies have customized and integrated so much during the decades (often in unsupported ways by people that have long gone) that any meaningful improvement will cause millions worth of redevelopment on their enterprise clients' side. And every little problem introduced has the potential to crash entire companies for days.

All they can do is put a bit more lipstick on the pig.

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