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Tesla’s headquarters will move to Austin

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Re: Tesla’s headquarters will move to Austin

#581

Post by ant6n »

darawk wrote: post #525
skissane wrote: post #274

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> But he never has to sell any Tesla shares, he can just buy hedges against them and take out loans So he takes out a $1 billion loan, and he offers $1 billion in stock as a security, and then also buys a futures contract (or a put option) on his $1 billion of stock to lock in the current price, so if the stock goes down in value over the life of the loan, the lender doesn't lose their security? And then when the loa…

Yep, you've got it. The most beautiful part of the whole thing is the step up in basis for the estate. When you pass on your estate, the cost basis of all your assets get "stepped up" to the current market value. This means that if he passes on his estate to his children, they can then sell the shares to repay the loan with zero tax. All this adds up to zero capital gains taxes being paid ever on the entire amount.

How does the "step up" of the cost basis happen with paying any taxes at the same time?

Re: Tesla’s headquarters will move to Austin

#582

Post by jansan »

pmorici wrote: post #109
cjensen wrote: post #76

When CEOs move, they often move their headquarters closer to where they live. Somehow Tesla managed to survive all the problems of California until shortly after Musk moved to Texas. Folks talking about the advantages and disadvantages of California vs Texas may be overthinking this.

Wonder if it had anything to do with this… https://mobile.twitter.com/unusual_whales/status/14462517624...

On the list of most expensive tweets of all time, the one by Lorena Gonzales must be in the top ten.

Re: Tesla’s headquarters will move to Austin

#583

Post by hellbannedguy »

pcwalton wrote: post #482
bradknowles wrote: post #475

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I lived and worked for six months in the Cupertino area for a contract job at Apple. My wife and I moved to Austin in 2006. Traffic in Austin is weird. There are some places where it’s literally the worst in the nation — I-35 is the most congested interstate in the nation, and the most congested part of I-35 starts just above Austin and ends just south of Austin. I-35 is more or less congested pretty much around the…

> And yes, we still hate all the jokers coming in from California who are gladly dropping millions of bucks to buy up houses that just a few years ago were only worth a few hundred thousand. > Thanks for visiting, but Austin is full. Yankee go home, please. This NIMBY mentality is why Austin is rapidly catching up to California in housing prices. The advantage is not going to last long at this rate. (And before you s…

I have a weird feeling the Yankees won't be there long.

I feel it's just a matter of time before Musk moves the factory to Mexico along with everything else except the white collar jobs.

Right now--a move just doesn't feel right, but I bet he is itching to move the manual labor south. He has a bunch of competition comming up real quick, and Elon is not planning on running for office, so why not sell out to cheap labor? (I don't agree with that last sentance, but so many wealthy Americans do.)

He will stay two years at most. (I don't know if he got any tax payer incentives. That might play a part?)

I wouldn't be surprised if Tesla hasen't bought up large chunks of Mexican land already.

Re: Tesla’s headquarters will move to Austin

#584

Post by dotancohen »

achenatx wrote: post #470
t-writescode wrote: post #442

Earlier quoted context omitted.

https://www.cbsnews.com/pictures/worst-traffic-cities-americ... According to this, Austin Texas is #10 on this chart. #1, LA #2, NYC #3, San Fran #4, San Jose (near San Fran) #5, Seattle #6, Miami #7, DC #8, Chicago #9, Honolulu #10, Austin *two* of the top 5 worst traffic areas in the US are in the Greater San Francisco area.

that data uses "congestion" which is the ratio of the worst traffic time to the best traffic time. If you look at average commute times austin is way down on the list.

I was looking for this comment.

Not because I know anything about Texas or California, or about traffic as a field, but because any data set - especially a list - can be used to present an argument and then be refuted due to "this detail". I see this on HN a lot and I believe that it has made me much less likely to be misled by someone toting data.

Re: Tesla’s headquarters will move to Austin

#585

Post by jillesvangurp »

muzz wrote: post #395
cjensen wrote: post #76

When CEOs move, they often move their headquarters closer to where they live. Somehow Tesla managed to survive all the problems of California until shortly after Musk moved to Texas. Folks talking about the advantages and disadvantages of California vs Texas may be overthinking this.

Elon personally potentially saving billions in taxes might have a lot to do with both of those ie his move and then the company's move. As an investor in the company, I am concerned about that (that this change was done to benefit one person rather than the company). https://www.houstonchronicle.com/business/article/Elon-Musk-...

I'm a shareholder as well. I can see the value add of a friendlier tax regime for the company, its employees, and indeed its CEO, less bureaucracy, and access to clean energy that Texas has to offer over the Bay are. I see it in terms of share holder value. Overpaying for staff, infrastructure, housing, facilities, etc. and dealing with local government that is too inept to address even the most basic challenges (housing, water management, roads, electricity, etc.) is not share holder value.

They have big expansion plans and most of that is outside of California. So, I'd say this is a good move for them. They no longer need the Bay Area investors. That was always the main reason for being there. It was critical to them just a few years ago when they were struggling to survive. But they turned a corner and are now very profitable so they can cut loose from that safely.

Tesla is now a multinational and while California is still an important market for it, they have bigger markets that they are thinking about now where they are starting to operate huge factories as well. Fremont went from being the largest Tesla factory to being one of the older and smaller ones in a few years.

Re: Tesla’s headquarters will move to Austin

#586

Post by lotsofpulp »

post_from_work wrote: post #548
bradknowles wrote: post #485

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In Austin, you’re lucky to get 1G anywhere. If Google Fiber has already laid down cable news provided service, then you will not be surprised to find that Spectrum and AT&T both are surprisingly competitive it’s each other. Otherwise, you get what little you can get and you just have to be happy with DSL because it’s still better than what you can effectively get with Spectrum, since you’re sharing that with all your…

>>>In Austin, you’re lucky to get 1G anywhere. That's depressing, especially for a US "tech hub". I'm in an irrelevant-but-dense urban area of Japan and have 1G fiber @ <$40 / month.

In the entire US, you are lucky to get fiber at all. Almost all people have a choice of only garbage asymmetric over subscribed coaxial cable with no other choice. A significant portion do not even have that. So few have fiber, that I disqualified 90%+ of the houses that came up in my searches when I was searching for a home.

Re: Tesla’s headquarters will move to Austin

#587

Post by darawk »

ant6n wrote: post #581
darawk wrote: post #525

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yep, you've got it. The most beautiful part of the whole thing is the step up in basis for the estate. When you pass on your estate, the cost basis of all your assets get "stepped up" to the current market value. This means that if he passes on his estate to his children, they can then sell the shares to repay the loan with zero tax. All this adds up to zero capital gains taxes being paid ever on the entire amount.

How does the "step up" of the cost basis happen with paying any taxes at the same time?

I'm not sure I understand the question. The assets in your estate get their cost basis reset to the current market value when your estate is passed on. That means the capital gains in his shares disappear.

That being said, the estate tax would kick in for everything over 11m, so he'd have to use other tricks to work around that limitation.

Re: Tesla’s headquarters will move to Austin

#588

Post by darawk »

tshaddox wrote: post #348
darawk wrote: post #189

Earlier quoted context omitted.

His tax situation really has nothing to do with it. If he sells his Tesla shares, he's still going to owe CA tax. But he never has to sell any Tesla shares, he can just buy hedges against them and take out loans. If you have sufficient capital assets, you never have to actual earn any "income" or generate any "capital gains" if you don't want to.

Also he could just pay whatever “high” taxes there are and I’m confident he would still have enough money to buy whatever he needs plus plenty of fun toys. He’ll be alright, I’m confident of it!

My point is just that moving because of high taxes doesn't make sense for him, even if you think he cares about the money. He doesn't have to pay it unless he wants to.

Re: Tesla’s headquarters will move to Austin

#589

Post by lotsofpulp »

exdsq wrote: post #528
pvarangot wrote: post #279

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That comparison is ridiculous, have you been to Palo Alto? It's a mansion neighborhood like Atherton. A better comparison would be with San Jose or San Mateo that are like, normal cities. Still way more expensive than Austin but it's nowhere near the price of Palo Alto or Atherton.

I live in Palo Alto and love zillowing random houses on my walk to Starbucks. Record for most expensive town house on a normal residential street is $19m. It’s insane.

Zillow and Redfin and trulia estimated values are clickbait. Only look at recent sale prices and comp sales.

Re: Tesla’s headquarters will move to Austin

#590

Post by Bellamy »

scoofy wrote: post #307
minhazm wrote: post #293

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Google maps says downtown Austin to Giga Texas is 17 miles, 24 minutes. I don't know what traffic is like in Austin but I imagine it's not nearly as bad as the bay area. I think a 25-30 min commute is pretty reasonable and most people would happily take that for much cheaper housing. The big difference is that in Austin you have the option to commute a bit for much cheaper housing. But in the bay area you could be co…

Traffic in Austin is insane. Legit insane. Definitely comparable to the Bay Area if not worse. And there is absolutely no transit alternative comparable to BART. There is a morning and evening train, but it's really only effective if you live and work exactly on the stops.

Does anyone even consider taking a bike?

If you visit Amsterdam or Copenhagen, you know what I mean. The happiness of the people, clear streets and less noice is something you can't explain, but it's better what you can imagine.

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