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YouTube to remove content that alleges widespread election fraud

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Re: YouTube to remove content that alleges widespread election fraud

#581

Post by complianceowl »

GordonS wrote: post #400

I don't like what YouTube is doing. But... What is going on in the US just now is unprecedented in modern Western democracies - we've reached "peak fake news" in the USA. Mainstream news networks like Fox have talking heads spouting venomous lies that are demonstrably and trivially proven as such. The POTUS is lying on an hourly basis (many of those lies just brazenly , ridiculously false), and has millions of people…

Prefacing your attempted justification of censorship with "I don't like what YouTube is doing." doesn't add an ounce of validity to your statement.

I am absolutely no fan of Fox News, but for you to not mention other propaganda-producing, Fake News outlets like CNN and Bloomberg is a huge hit to your credibility.

I'll openly admit I am on the conservative side of politics, but my identity isn't wrapped up in politics; that's not how I identify myself or other people. I'm surrounded by conservatives; that's my world, and guess what? There's a lot of discontent with the way election fraud claims are being handled, and despite almost every single one of them having enough firearms to supply a small militia, nobody is even remotely close to even thinking about some sort of armed resistance.

You say it's dangerous? You need to stop letting mainstream media form your perception of the world. What's dangerous is constantly race-baiting people of color like myself and white people against each other.

To people who truly love and believe in freedom, your comment is disgusting.

Wrong information must be countered and corrected by right information -- not censorship, buddy!

Re: YouTube to remove content that alleges widespread election fraud

#582

Post by sobellian »

3princip wrote: post #441

I live in a country that the US has sanctioned in the past for undemocratic election processes. Also, I'm familiar with our voting procedures and have worked on election oversight, data gathering etc. If we had an election that had a fraction of the irregularities that are surfacing in some of these problematic states, I'm pretty sure we would have been invaded by now. Jokes aside, those states are a similar populati…

The POTUS has been telegraphing this litigation for months or even years before the election. Let's not pretend that his campaign is actually reacting to sincere revelations of fraud. They were always going to dispute the election if they lost it. So many people claim evidence of massive fraud and yet every case I can find gets laughed out of court, often by Trump appointed judges, despite massive incentives to show that evidence in court. It has gotten to the point where conspiracy theorists are literally referring to nonexistent state counties in their court filings. Frankly, it is a conspiracy theory.

Re: YouTube to remove content that alleges widespread election fraud

#583

Post by x86_64Ubuntu »

SCLeo wrote: post #289
howmayiannoyyou wrote: post #110

We are very fortunate to have the algorithms, employees & management of Youtube/Google watching out for us. We're not intelligent enough to view a video and decide for ourselves what is fact v. propaganda v. entertainment. Hopefully some day we will have the same protections the CCP gives its people with even more content moderation. Thank you Google - you're the nanny the American people and the world always hoped f…

This is slippery slope fallacy. I don't think YouTube removing genuially harmful and false content is really comparable to CCP's suppression of opposing views.

Why should a private company be forced to host conspiracy theories for free?

Re: YouTube to remove content that alleges widespread election fraud

#584

Post by acdha »

dillondoyle wrote: post #506
macspoofing wrote: post #4

For God's sakes ... What underpins this need for social media companies to virtue signal about protecting 'election integrity' is the false notion that 2016 was stolen from Hillary by the Russians - a claim that had no evidential support (and no, that some trolls bought a minuscule amount of Facebook ads does not raise this claim to that level) but the entire Democratic party, with media allies, promulgated for the l…

Can you show that a significant % of the public/swing voters or sitting out 'Dems' swayed by Russia? Most Democratic political workers would tell you that Comey and the emails is the #1 factor. It amplified built in brand of Clinton corruption and Comey broke long standing policy at basically the perfect time to do perfect damage. Sure some of this was amplified by Russia but I don't know a single professional that w…

You can’t separate the two easily because the DNC email hack and “DCLeaks” front group was attributed to Russia by the U.S. intelligence community, as extensively covered in the Mueller report, and a large amount of social media activity around both email stories and other topics was conducted by the Russian Internet Research Agency. Comey had more significance but the flurry of allegations had more than minor involvement of Russian assets and people weren’t reacting to just one detail but the whole barrage. Pizzagate is still around now and that started with the Russian spearphisher who got Podesta’s emails.

Re: YouTube to remove content that alleges widespread election fraud

#585

Post by babypuncher »

cambalache wrote: post #421
GordonS wrote: post #400

I don't like what YouTube is doing. But... What is going on in the US just now is unprecedented in modern Western democracies - we've reached "peak fake news" in the USA. Mainstream news networks like Fox have talking heads spouting venomous lies that are demonstrably and trivially proven as such. The POTUS is lying on an hourly basis (many of those lies just brazenly , ridiculously false), and has millions of people…

> But... There is no "buts" regarding freedom. I dont know if you have any experience with authoritarian measures but none of them starts like "This is a bad and permanent measure for no reason"... all of them are "exceptional", "to ensure public safety" ,"only valid as long as extraordinary circumstances are present"..all of them. The democrats were claiming fraud 4 years go due to a supposed Russian influence.The e…

Claims of Russian interference in the 2016 election made by our own intelligence community and parroted by Democrats don't even remotely compare to the outright lies Trump and his lackeys are peddling about the 2020 election. You didn't see Hilary Clinton refusing to concede. Her only post-election legal action was asking for recounts in the rust belt. California's AG didn't sue Pennsylvania and Wisconsin asking SCOTUS to throw out ballots they disagreed with.

This is just bad whataboutism.

Re: YouTube to remove content that alleges widespread election fraud

#586

Post by mjklin »

cambalache wrote: post #421
GordonS wrote: post #400

I don't like what YouTube is doing. But... What is going on in the US just now is unprecedented in modern Western democracies - we've reached "peak fake news" in the USA. Mainstream news networks like Fox have talking heads spouting venomous lies that are demonstrably and trivially proven as such. The POTUS is lying on an hourly basis (many of those lies just brazenly , ridiculously false), and has millions of people…

> But... There is no "buts" regarding freedom. I dont know if you have any experience with authoritarian measures but none of them starts like "This is a bad and permanent measure for no reason"... all of them are "exceptional", "to ensure public safety" ,"only valid as long as extraordinary circumstances are present"..all of them. The democrats were claiming fraud 4 years go due to a supposed Russian influence.The e…

No “buts” except (legally):

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/False_advertising

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hate_speech

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Legality_of_Holocaust_denial

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Category:Communications_Decenc...

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Clear_and_present_danger

And probably more...

Re: YouTube to remove content that alleges widespread election fraud

#587

Post by djsumdog »

enumjorge wrote: post #259
howmayiannoyyou wrote: post #110

We are very fortunate to have the algorithms, employees & management of Youtube/Google watching out for us. We're not intelligent enough to view a video and decide for ourselves what is fact v. propaganda v. entertainment. Hopefully some day we will have the same protections the CCP gives its people with even more content moderation. Thank you Google - you're the nanny the American people and the world always hoped f…

Once again a thread about censorship invites comments that ignore the nuance of the situation. Having companies dictate what information is widely accessible is dangerous for democracy. Having the sitting president make completely baseless claims in an effort to delegitimize the results of an election because it didn’t go his way is also dangerous for democracy. That’s what we call a tricky situation. We don’t have a…

> completely baseless claims

There have been countless hearings around America. There have been election observers pushed out of counting centers. In Georgia, people were told a pipe burst, sent observers home, and then people kept counting for hours (on video).

These are NOT baseless claims! They should be investigated.

Let me ask you, if they were baseless, would YouTube even need to ban videos? They are banning them because they're afraid. I've watched hours of the hearings and looked at a lot of the information. There are serious issues with this election and they need to be investigated fully.

Re: YouTube to remove content that alleges widespread election fraud

#588

Post by amadeuspagel »

feoren wrote: post #466
macspoofing wrote: post #4

For God's sakes ... What underpins this need for social media companies to virtue signal about protecting 'election integrity' is the false notion that 2016 was stolen from Hillary by the Russians - a claim that had no evidential support (and no, that some trolls bought a minuscule amount of Facebook ads does not raise this claim to that level) but the entire Democratic party, with media allies, promulgated for the l…

It's weird to me that we still have people that still cling to the idea that censorship and curation of content is always evil and every site on the Internet should allow completely unmoderated speech, when we've seen over and over and over that such sites always devolve into festering echo-chambers of hatred and racism. Always. Every time. Not only are you conveniently ignoring that reality, but you're also ignoring…

> It's weird to me that we still have people that still cling to the idea that censorship and curation of content is always evil and every site on the Internet should allow completely unmoderated speech

No, not every site. But just as we have some public forums in the real world (not all, or even most "festering echo-chambers of hatred and racism"), we should have some on the internet.

> Not only are you conveniently ignoring that reality, but you're also ignoring the fact that humans are humans.

This reminds of arguing with objectivists who think that everything they believe flows from "A is A". I do agree that humans are humans, I'm glad we found some common ground here. Presumably you are human as well. But you are not concerned that what you believe is the result of "false information that has been carefully constructed and self-selected to misinform you and appeal to your emotions". It's only other humans who are vulnerable to this, and you need to protect them from it, for their own good.

> Stop. Just stop. You're not helping. You're not enlightened. You're part of the problem.

Re: YouTube to remove content that alleges widespread election fraud

#589

Post by jasonlotito »

cambalache wrote: post #421
GordonS wrote: post #400

I don't like what YouTube is doing. But... What is going on in the US just now is unprecedented in modern Western democracies - we've reached "peak fake news" in the USA. Mainstream news networks like Fox have talking heads spouting venomous lies that are demonstrably and trivially proven as such. The POTUS is lying on an hourly basis (many of those lies just brazenly , ridiculously false), and has millions of people…

> But... There is no "buts" regarding freedom. I dont know if you have any experience with authoritarian measures but none of them starts like "This is a bad and permanent measure for no reason"... all of them are "exceptional", "to ensure public safety" ,"only valid as long as extraordinary circumstances are present"..all of them. The democrats were claiming fraud 4 years go due to a supposed Russian influence.The e…

> The evidence was tenuous and circumstantial at best.

The evidence and conclusions were provided by more than a dozen US agencies, as well as from a bi-partisan investigation conducted in the Senate.

> The democrats were claiming fraud

"Fraud" is a strong word, especially when the Democratic candidate literally came out the same night as conceded. Sure, Russia influenced the election, I don't remember countless law suits after the election trying to change the will of the people.

> There is no "buts" regarding freedom

You say that, but Republicans are very much in favor of denying people their right to bear arms because of "buts".

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