Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Federal Judge Upholds Harvard's Race-Conscious Admissions Process

npr.org

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

581–590 of 660 posts

Re: Federal Judge Upholds Harvard's Race-Conscious Admissions Process

#581

Post by richmunk567 »

anonu wrote: post #555
richmunk567 wrote: post #522

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You are spot on. There appears to be a fair amount of evidence to support your observation: https://www.unz.com/article/why-harvard-is-right-to-discrimi...

This article is really interesting. I'm not quite sure what to make of it. it feels borderline bigoted, basing it's entire argument on some unmeasurable "return to the average". Also not sure why the parent user is posting it multiple times. Not cool...

On average, everyone returns to the average. This is about the _rate_ of cognitive development. And it's easy to measure with standard tests. Obviously there are a ton of accomplished Asians in America, its just more difficult to identify them in adolescence. There' nothing bigoted about that.

Sorry for posting it a lot, its just relevant to what I wanted to say in my other comments.

Re: Federal Judge Upholds Harvard's Race-Conscious Admissions Process

#582

Post by shard972 »

romwell wrote: post #252
habosa wrote: post #96

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As a Jewish person I feel weird seeing "whites" being broken into Jewish and non-Jewish. What about other religions? Why include religion at all? In particular with respect to Harvard and Boston I'd think Catholicism might deserve a mention if we're going to bring religion into this. In the end I think religious diversity is important but it doesn't belong in the same conversation. You can choose your religion and al…

As an atheist Jewish person, I don't agree with your definition of "Jewish". Neither did the Nazis, btw.

Oh wow, a blatant character assassination for no reason whatsoever.

Re: Federal Judge Upholds Harvard's Race-Conscious Admissions Process

#583

Post by gdy »

blhack wrote: post #161

How about: who cares? Isn’t this hacker news? Aren’t we all supposed to be hackers who are upending the existing system? How about we build our own Harvards where anybody who wants to study can come and learn whatever they want? And the network comes from being surrounded by other people who cared enough to learn. We don’t need these places anymore. We’ll find our own funding and do our own research and screw the sys…

"We’ll build our own system."

...with blackjack and hookers!

Re: Federal Judge Upholds Harvard's Race-Conscious Admissions Process

#584

Post by webgoat »

widowlark wrote: post #580
nilkn wrote: post #568

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It’s almost 2020, not 1940. We have major cities that are majority nonwhite. We have entire statewide school districts that are mostly nonwhite. We have huge metropolitan areas that are mostly nonwhite. You can walk into an expensive luxury apartment complex in an immigrant heavy city and find tons of nonwhite people.

And yet the data still shows widespread economic disparity due to discrimination

The data also shows widespread economic disparity due to geography, yet Harvard doesn't give the poor kids an extra 200 points on their SAT. If Harvard actually cared about this issue they would create additional scholarship programs that review people on a case-by-case basis rather than a blanket policy.

Re: Federal Judge Upholds Harvard's Race-Conscious Admissions Process

#586

Post by dang »

richmunk567 wrote: post #581
anonu wrote: post #555

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This article is really interesting. I'm not quite sure what to make of it. it feels borderline bigoted, basing it's entire argument on some unmeasurable "return to the average". Also not sure why the parent user is posting it multiple times. Not cool...

On average, everyone returns to the average. This is about the _rate_ of cognitive development. And it's easy to measure with standard tests. Obviously there are a ton of accomplished Asians in America, its just more difficult to identify them in adolescence. There' nothing bigoted about that. Sorry for posting it a lot, its just relevant to what I wanted to say in my other comments.

We've banned this account for using HN primarily for political and ideological battle. That is against the site guidelines and destroys the curiosity that this site exists for, regardless of what you're fighting for or against.

https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html

Re: Federal Judge Upholds Harvard's Race-Conscious Admissions Process

#587

Post by turtlecloud »

crazypyro wrote: post #52
throwawaysea wrote: post #12

This ruling is a travesty and I hope the Supreme Court overturns it when this is appealed. It is very clear that race-conscious admissions are systematically racist and discriminatory. Take a look at the distribution of students by race in the University of California system, where they're not permitted to discriminate in this manner, thanks to Prop 209 ( https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1996_California_Proposition_20..…

Harvard has a 25%+ Asian American undergrad class, (edit)~~2.5x (Harvard's is ~60% of UC's) more than the latest number listed on that wiki page, so your final statement is factually incorrect`~. I quoted wrong number. It's 25% vs 40%. https://college.harvard.edu/admissions/admissions-statistics

If Harvard did not race balance then every year the race % would be different - there should be enough of all races to pick a class of competent people. Why is it that 1 year a class can’t be primarily black or Asian? Before the lawsuit EVERY year the race ratio was almost exactly the same.

Secondly, why doesn’t Harvard just admit Asian Americans that score poorly to bring the Average down and chalk it up to amazing character?

Re: Federal Judge Upholds Harvard's Race-Conscious Admissions Process

#588

Post by turtlecloud »

wefjweokfjw wrote: post #393
throwawaysea wrote: post #12

This ruling is a travesty and I hope the Supreme Court overturns it when this is appealed. It is very clear that race-conscious admissions are systematically racist and discriminatory. Take a look at the distribution of students by race in the University of California system, where they're not permitted to discriminate in this manner, thanks to Prop 209 ( https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1996_California_Proposition_20..…

Well, to be fair, the University of California accepts more international students than Harvard, which is generally going to inflate the percentage of Asian students. Not saying this ruling isn't a detriment to Asian applicants, but probably not by as large of an amount as it would seem at first.

The data set and lawsuit excludes international students. This is primarily for asian Americans.

Re: Federal Judge Upholds Harvard's Race-Conscious Admissions Process

#589

Post by paggle »

shadowgovt wrote: post #551
legostormtroopr wrote: post #541

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Except there is only one Harvard University. You could spend billions making a new University next door that has just as high standard of teachers and facilities, but it wouldn't be Harvard. Not that being "Harvard" would make it better, but to a lot of people the prestige of the name is important. So to that effect, it is a zero sum game.

Does Harvard maintain that lauded reputation if it's known to admit a racial monoculture? Especially in, say, the technology fields, where we've seen the negative impact of such monoculture in the quality of software developed using machine learning algorithms?

All of the biggest software companies have almost no black engineers and relatively few female engineers. They still manage to make money hand over fist, looks like their software is good enough to do the job.

Re: Federal Judge Upholds Harvard's Race-Conscious Admissions Process

#590

Post by turtlecloud »

droithomme wrote: post #494
mawpmawp wrote: post #260

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's wild statement, shunted into a category based on skin color? Nobody is shunted anywhere, you are asked on the application what race are you, or if you are biracial, or if you identify as anything else. It's your choice what to put on the application. Everything is determined from your responses. Nobody is "shunted" anywhere.

Have you ever seen an application where Jewish is a racial option? I have not, yet comments here assert that it is. It makes me question the legitimacy of their data sources.

A lot of the data I believe is from the Hillel membership / Jewish org membership numbers.

It is intentionally difficult to find and requires legwork since I believe it is intentionally obfuscated.

Post reply on HN