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Tesla Software Version 10.0

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Re: Tesla Software Version 10.0

#581

Post by xeromal »

otterley wrote: post #550
marvin wrote: post #526

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Maybe you always share your car with a partner that's 25 centimeters shorter than you, requiring different settings for seat & steering weel position, and also has a different body composition that makes them want different climate control settings. It shouldn't be so controversial to claim that automatic adjustment of settings is a net UX win this this common scenario.

This problem was solved over a decade ago with memorized seating positions tied to the key fob. It wouldn’t have been too much of a stretch (pun not intended!) to memorize and set the temperature alongside the other settings using the existing system.

That's literally what the tesla does. You tie a profile to a key, card, or phone.

Re: Tesla Software Version 10.0

#582

Post by kerkeslager »

radium3d wrote: post #380
kerkeslager wrote: post #355

I want a well-put-together electric car that's completely analog from the user's perspective . There's not a single user-facing digital feature I've ever seen on a car that I wanted, and in fact most of them make things worse. Obviously there's some non-user-facing stuff, i.e. all-wheel-drive, which computerization has revolutionized. But any user-facing stuff is just awful. I want an electric car, but I don't want t…

Tesla 3 owner here. Beyond tapping up / down temperature arrows I don't ever need to touch my A/C settings and it remembers my settings when I pick my profile (and soon it will recognize me automatically) so I think it's less annoying than analog setup personally.

Okay, but you're only looking at the (very minor) difference in user experience, without looking at all you're giving up. How easy is it to repair your A/C? If you can't or don't want to repair it yourself, can you hire someone other than Tesla to do it? Is not having to turn a knob worth having your car collect a bunch of personal data on you?

In accordance with Parkinson's Law of Triviality[1], the only discussion my post has generated has been about the experience of touch screens versus knobs, without talking about the more complicated repairability and security issues. My impression of Tesla is that they understand Parkinson's Law very well, and are working hard to get the color of the metaphorical bike shed just right. That's not to say that they're getting the nuclear reactor completely wrong, it's just to say that everyone's talking about the bike shed when the nuclear reactor is way more important.

At the end of the day, what I said was ultimately my preference, and your preference is your preference, and there aren't an objective arguments we can make that will change each other's subjective preferences. I'm just frustrated that the direction the industry seems to be going will cater to what you want, and not to what I want.

[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Law_of_triviality

Re: Tesla Software Version 10.0

#583

Post by Fins »

xedeon wrote: post #340
Fins wrote: post #308

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Can we please stop with ridiculous BS about evil shortsellers? Would you believe that it's martians spreading "fud" about Tesla, if Elon says so? And that would be at least as accurate as the shorts nonsense.

> Can we please stop with ridiculous BS about evil shortsellers? Have you been living under a rock? I didn't even know about the insane short interest and the countess $TSLAQ Twitter trolls until I became a Tesla owner. Which is apparently been there since the early days. Is it BS because it does not fit your narrative? or is it a baseless claim? If so, can you please cite sources? > Would you believe that it's marti…

There is no "insane short interest" in Tesla. Just because Elon might want you to think that it is some nefarious conspiracy and not Tesla's incompetency in many aspects of making a car (pretty much anything pother than making the best available electric powertrain, really) and his personal douchebaggery that are causing problems. That canard about Tesla being the most shorted stock on the planet since the beginning of times has been debunked so many times it's not evenv interesting anymore.

I have no interest in discussing your intelligence, but but once you start bringing out "shortseller fud" your credibility goes straight out of the window. Even claiming that Elon is behaving like a jerk because he's hiding from hit squads hired by Saudi Aramco would be both more plausible and make more sense.

Re: Tesla Software Version 10.0

#584

Post by kerkeslager »

marvin wrote: post #526
epalm wrote: post #515

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Then they change the settings, and if they're a considerate human being, they change them back. If they're not, then you get to grumble a bit, change them back yourself, and consider not sharing your car with that person again. I don't think the world has lost anything substantial here. Just realized I might be a grumpy old man.

Maybe you always share your car with a partner that's 25 centimeters shorter than you, requiring different settings for seat & steering weel position, and also has a different body composition that makes them want different climate control settings. It shouldn't be so controversial to claim that automatic adjustment of settings is a net UX win this this common scenario.

Sure, but this doesn't matter much to me. You're objectively right that this fits someone's wants, but it doesn't fit my wants.

I have yet to come across a problem on an old Jeep Cherokee or Toyota Tacoma that I couldn't figure out how to fix with a little help from the internet, and I'm by no means a car expert. Sometimes the parts cost or size has shut me down, but not the complexity. An electric motor is far simpler than a gasoline engine, so it should be easier to work on, not harder. Can you fix your Tesla's A/C if it breaks? Can most mechanics fix your Tesla's A/C if it breaks?

Re: Tesla Software Version 10.0

#585

Post by kerkeslager »

mark242 wrote: post #358
kerkeslager wrote: post #355

I want a well-put-together electric car that's completely analog from the user's perspective . There's not a single user-facing digital feature I've ever seen on a car that I wanted, and in fact most of them make things worse. Obviously there's some non-user-facing stuff, i.e. all-wheel-drive, which computerization has revolutionized. But any user-facing stuff is just awful. I want an electric car, but I don't want t…

Get yourself a used Ford Focus Electric. The range is small, but it's the perfect commuter car and is the closest thing to an "analog" electric car you'll find. Ford took the high-end Titanium body and interior and grafted the electric drivetrain into it.

I don't really want a commuter car. I live in an area with lots of snow, and when there's not snow on the ground I'm often driving to areas with less-than-ideal roads (for rock climbing). The way I use my Tacoma would eat that car alive. :D

Re: Tesla Software Version 10.0

#586

Post by marvin »

kerkeslager wrote: post #584
marvin wrote: post #526

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Maybe you always share your car with a partner that's 25 centimeters shorter than you, requiring different settings for seat & steering weel position, and also has a different body composition that makes them want different climate control settings. It shouldn't be so controversial to claim that automatic adjustment of settings is a net UX win this this common scenario.

Sure, but this doesn't matter much to me. You're objectively right that this fits someone's wants, but it doesn't fit my wants. I have yet to come across a problem on an old Jeep Cherokee or Toyota Tacoma that I couldn't figure out how to fix with a little help from the internet, and I'm by no means a car expert. Sometimes the parts cost or size has shut me down, but not the complexity. An electric motor is far simpl…

We're arguing different things. I was responding to a criticism that implied the "remember your settings" feature has no value when compared to a vehicle where all settings are set with physical buttons.

The point you're arguing boils down to a difference of preferences and philosophy, which is of course perfectly fine. Not everyone has the same preferences.

Re: Tesla Software Version 10.0

#587

Post by kerkeslager »

sizzle wrote: post #492
kerkeslager wrote: post #355

I want a well-put-together electric car that's completely analog from the user's perspective . There's not a single user-facing digital feature I've ever seen on a car that I wanted, and in fact most of them make things worse. Obviously there's some non-user-facing stuff, i.e. all-wheel-drive, which computerization has revolutionized. But any user-facing stuff is just awful. I want an electric car, but I don't want t…

Why not smart assistant integration? Me (driving): Alexa/Siri set temperature to 70 degrees Alexa/Siri: temperature set to 70 degrees I would love this, already do it with my smart thermostat + Alexa skill integration.

Frankly, if you're willing to put a bug in your own car to get voice integration that's only semi-functional when you're connected to the internet, your value system is very different from mine. We can argue objective pros and cons but the real truth is we want very different things, and we're not likely to find much common ground.

Re: Tesla Software Version 10.0

#588

Post by dewski »

crististm wrote: post #474
xedeon wrote: post #422

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes: https://youtu.be/kLIBYlgsHis?t=560 That video tutorial is now outdated since there has been many UI improvements, but the steps should still be the same.

I'm more than slightly annoyed that it starts with "choose menu"!!! The demo person is constantly looking at his screen instead of in front of him.

For example, here is Audi's A/C controls in all of their new vehicles:

https://ae01.alicdn.com/kf/HTB1iETfhnSPY1JjSZPcq6xIwpXaw/ZWE...

You not only have to take a hand off the steering wheel, but also look to see which lever you want/need to press. If I'm changing the temperature I know where the dial is, but I also have to look to see what I'm setting it to.

I'm surprised people here think analog controls are a bulletproof solution to the same problems you're criticizing Tesla for. I have a hunch that if there were YouTube videos watching people change climate control settings in their car they'd not only be required to take hand off the wheel but also look down and away for a small period of time. Tesla's isn't perfect but you get to keep both hands on the steering wheel and head looking straight, but down ever so slightly.

Re: Tesla Software Version 10.0

#589

Post by marvin »

alex_young wrote: post #485
chemmail wrote: post #482

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The drive system is seperate from the screen MCU. If it crashes, the car still drives fine.

As an M3 user I can confirm. Boy is it a thrill driving a car you have no instrumentation for! You can't even see how fast you're going.

Whenever I drive, it's perfectly located in my peripheral vision and easy to check. I even feel that moving it a bit out from the center actually encourages to keep my attention on the road rather than the instruments.

Re: Tesla Software Version 10.0

#590

Post by herewego »

moduspol wrote: post #568
herewego wrote: post #565

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think you are making false assumptions. One can not drive any car without using the vehicle interface on an almost constant basis, including the Tesla. Since the Tesla only has a touchscreen for interfacing with the vast majority of the vehicle's functions, you are therefore using it constantly - that is my argument. But maybe you use cars differently than myself and those I've surveyed, e.g. music browsing, imperf…

> the Tesla only has a touchscreen for interfacing with the vast majority of the vehicle's functions False. There are voice controls, buttons on the steering wheel, the steering wheel itself, pedals, pedestals (for turn signals like other cars), etc. Even autopilot's functionality doesn't require the screen (or touching it). > music browsing, imperfect automated climate control settings, navigation, insane/ludicrous…

First, you are quoting something that I did not say. Second, I disagree that the items I listed are all a good experience using the mechanisms you highlighted and aren’t an important part of the driving experience; they are indeed “critical” (quoting your mis-quote) to the UX that leads to the choice of vehicle for myself and many others. It is disingenuous to reduce the argument down to basic controls required for vehicle movement and I think you know that.

The last thing I’ll say is this: I think it’s unfortunate that you are so invested in defending your position at all costs that you are unable to separate the argument from passive-aggressive personal attacks.

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