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I am retiring from tech to live offline

openpath.quest

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Re: I am retiring from tech to live offline

#571

Post by timcambrant »

cortesoft wrote: post #301
cybrox wrote: post #145

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you don't need to support a family and are unhappy otherwise, why not? Sure it's not 'the smart thing to do' but if it makes you happy and you're still not far worse of than most people...

Because if you are unhappy now, just wait until you are homeless

He said he was quitting tech, not retiring from work forever. I would assume if you're fed up with tech you could instead do carpentry jobs, work part time at a store, be a tour guide or whatever. Is it fair to say that he has 2 years to find a way to earn $50,000 per year? Sounds like that would be doable if you're smart and ambitious, no?

Re: I am retiring from tech to live offline

#572

Post by WJW »

overfeed wrote: post #561
robocat wrote: post #466

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> late stage capitalism versus > crunching the numbers I could have retired years ago How do you reconcile the apparent hypocrisy of your wealthiness? The stereotype is a boomer taking their winnings and then complaining about the system. I've got just enough money to start worrying that my savings will mostly be taken by my government. Perhaps it is time for me to join the old white man complainer's club (is HN that…

> How do you reconcile the apparent hypocrisy of your wealthiness? Does this specific category error have a name? I see it so frequently, it's ridiculous. Being genre-savvy/aware of the meta-game doesn't mean one can opt-out, or refuse to play. Recognizing how a game is rigged often allows one to play it better than the average person. I'm not GP, but my acknowledgement that society is unequal, and that I sometimes b…

For myself I usually call it "(not) playing to win", after David Sirlin's book (see also https://www.sirlin.net/ptw for the free web version). In it, he describes a phenomenon in competitive videogaming where some people try to forbid valid moves in an online game because they are "broken", like throws in fighting games or rush strategies in RTS games. Sirlin argues that because they recognize a powerful tool but refuse to use it, they needlessly handicap themselves. As such, they're not playing to win but playing to feel morally superior and consequently lose to those who do use all the tools the game provides.

In reasonably balanced games, it usually turns out the "overpowered" strategy is not all that overpowered and that they have huge downsides when played against people who know how to counter them. In real life, which has no requirement of being balanced, we can recognize that certain strategies ((explicitly legal and often even encouraged!) consistently work really well. Choosing not to use those strategies doesn't make one morally superior, just bad at playing the game of life.

That said, "minimizing your own odds of falling into societal cracks" often still includes caring for others around you. On a small scale, being rich but alone because everyone around you went bankrupt and/or became estranged to you is not much fun. On a bigger scale it's just good governance to make sure everyone has food, safety and entertainment, just to keep the pitchforks away.

Re: I am retiring from tech to live offline

#573

Post by WJW »

leoqa wrote: post #504
throwaway-away wrote: post #435

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Same boat, my son was born in October last year and have been back at work since February and I am already completely overwhelmed. Our plan is to wait for the second child and get another paternity leave and then I will fuck off from any corporate/enterprise job and try to do my own thing first and we'll live off menial jobs + the income from the couple of apartments we have on AirBnB. I am not planning to stay out o…

This was also my plan; hang in there for the next kid, wait for the next vest, etc. ultimately daycare is expensive, healthcare is expensive… I’m still stuck 6 years later waiting to quit but something always comes up and there’s always another vest around the corner.

Well obviously. Vesting schedules are explicitly designed the way they are to keep people around. That's their entire purpose.

Retirement is inherently a choice to earn less lifetime money and pour that time into family and other things you like doing. Waiting for the next vesting cliff is inherently a choice to earn more money and spend less time on your family.

Re: I am retiring from tech to live offline

#574

Post by latexr »

Whatever you think of the way this was announced (seems there’s as much commentary on the form as the content), what I take from it and other announcements like it is the very clear pattern that this is only happening to the good ones. The people who actually try to do good and be good and are good are the ones getting burned out and calling it quits, the hacks who do it for personal profit remain and more are coming.

It does not bode well for the future.

Re: I am retiring from tech to live offline

#575

Post by whit537 »

Hey, everyone. Thanks so much for participating in this thread! I couldn't have asked for a better "retirement party" haha. I followed along all day yesterday while wrapping up the last few things at Sentry. Right as I posted my final goodbye on Slack, a friend showed up unannounced (my latest godson, in fact). We had a wonderful visit, drinking fresh iced tea on the front porch in the sunshine. What a contrast ... and a confirmation. The evening rolled on. By the time I returned to check the Slack replies, the company 'top was locked. C'est fini.

I'm now posting this from the family laptop. (If you want to see the hand-written original, you'll have to visit. ;) I'll be using it to fulfill my obligations as an Open Source Endowment board member through August. I've turned off chadwhitacre.com, and deleted (or kicked off deletions for) Facebook, Instagram, Threads, Twitter, Bluesky, LinkedIn, Discord, and Reddit. I've deleted one Amazon account and am working on the other (I'm pretty sure my dad's last book and author page are associated with it). I've transferred the openpath.quest domain and repos to Vlad-Stefan Harbuz, who asked if he could preserve it. I also gave him softwarecommons.com, the Czarin font, and MP4s of the five Open Path episodes to reupload so I can finish deleting my YouTube channel. (Maybe I'll burn DVDs to watch offline. Can I make VHS?) My Google account will be around as long as I need email; zetaweb.com is my last domain on auto-renew. If anyone wants to buy xmin.org or gospeldesk.{com,org}, ping me on chad@ before August. That'll subsidize 10-year renewals for my dad's memorials, whitacregreek.com and singinghome.com. Those are hosted on GitHub pages, so I won't be deleting that account. I've archived my other repos. I'll lose access if someday I'm able to delete email, which won't be until I don't need Carta anymore, at least. There's probably some other stuff that will make it hard to delete email. Wish me luck. Dang's even harder, so, here, I'm stuck. ;^)

My hope with the magazine is to recover a more humane information technology, so even though I'm leaving the Internet, I'm not leaving public life. After all, all the world's a stage, to quote a sage. Whether your own performance here has been friendly or cynical, thank you for it. This whole thread is beautiful to me, and all its little details. I love you, as much as this meatstick-manipulated textarea in the virtual realm will allow, which is not much, but not none. Hopefully some day one of you, friend or foe, finds me in the physical realm where we can vibrate air instead. I would love that! Until then, keep being HN.

Re: I am retiring from tech to live offline

#576

Post by senko »

drnick1 wrote: post #427
sph wrote: post #346

Earlier quoted context omitted.

People in tech, especially from US, are so accustomed to spending $5,000/mo just to survive, that they cannot fathom one is able to live without having a tech job in San Francisco. It's a pretty sad state of affairs. I live in a first-world European country where the average salary is about €25,000 per year. My mortgage estimate is less than €300/mo. I'm not that afraid of having to supplement my income if I need to.…

> People in tech, especially from US, are so accustomed to spending $5,000/mo just to survive, that they cannot fathom one is able to live without having a tech job in San Francisco. It's a pretty sad state of affairs. Quality of life in suburban America is incredibly high relative to a "first world" country with such a low average income. From what I have seen, most families in the "European periphery" still live in…

European here. Yes, houses are smaller, apartments can be comparatively tiny. Street parking can be a challenge.

However: I got stores, cinemas, cafes, restaurants within walking distance. My kids can roam around in the neighbourhood without someone calling social service on me. I can walk anywhere in the city at any hour day or night without someone robbing me. I can cheaply purchase free range eggs and organic vegetables. Tap water is fine, actually excellent. 30hour commute is considered too long. Coast is mere 3h away, people come from all over the planet to enjoy it, I spend 5 weeks a year there, just chillin and enjoying life. I get fast, cheap internet, and order groceries, do my taxes and doctors appointment online.

Tell me again how I’m suffering without poorly insulated detached houses, HSA, spam calls, an SUV to drive myself to the bakery, school shooting drills, healthcare bills, homeless people rejected by society, and that circus you have for a government right now?

Re: I am retiring from tech to live offline

#577

Post by senko »

drnick1 wrote: post #560
Markoff wrote: post #556

Earlier quoted context omitted.

25000€ a year is basically Czech average salary I would really like to hear how is quality of life in suburban America incredibly higher ROFL owning a car certainly isn't tied to income, quite the opposite, poorer the person more cars they own in their junkyard

It's quite simple really. In a place where $5,000+ monthly incomes are common, people can afford more things, and this generally means a higher quality of life. Granted, many necessities like housing are also more expensive in high income areas, but keep in mind that American homes are generally much larger than in Europe. And things like AC and clothes dryers are taken for granted.

> And things like AC and clothes dryers are taken for granted.

Not sure where you get your impression of Europe, but if you feel amenities like these are not standard, it’s a few decades out of date.

North Europeans traditionally didn’t need AC, but everywhere where it gets hot - which is everywhere now - they got them installed. Very few buildings with integrated HVAC systems for the entire buildings tho, mostly independent units.

Re: I am retiring from tech to live offline

#578

Post by Markoff »

senko wrote: post #577
drnick1 wrote: post #560

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's quite simple really. In a place where $5,000+ monthly incomes are common, people can afford more things, and this generally means a higher quality of life. Granted, many necessities like housing are also more expensive in high income areas, but keep in mind that American homes are generally much larger than in Europe. And things like AC and clothes dryers are taken for granted.

> And things like AC and clothes dryers are taken for granted. Not sure where you get your impression of Europe, but if you feel amenities like these are not standard, it’s a few decades out of date. North Europeans traditionally didn’t need AC, but everywhere where it gets hot - which is everywhere now - they got them installed. Very few buildings with integrated HVAC systems for the entire buildings tho, mostly ind…

yeah it's funny, actually in poor Bulgaria pretty much every apartment has AC, so AC is certainly not anything to brag about, even the poorest people have it

clothes dryers are just plain stupid waste of space, consume lot of energy/money, I've had washing machine with dryer, pretty much never used dryer after seeing how long it takes to dry the clothes while wasting electricity, new washing machine I bought without dryer

Re: I am retiring from tech to live offline

#579

Post by barbazoo »

siren2026 wrote: post #237

I have been at it for 20 years now and have started to feel my time is up as well As a lot of comments here highlights, the issue is not so much the tech but the politics, constant perf reviews, re-orgs, nonsense BS that is pushed top-down. This industry is taking a toll on you. My advice for anyone reading this that is starting your career: Live simply and save a lot. When I started my career I thought I would love…

> My advice for anyone reading this that is starting your career: Live simply and save a lot

This is such great advice and really what I would suggest to anyone young in any field. A terrible thing I'm seeing is folks living a life that requires them to stay within their high paying career in whatever field they're in. Modern day slavery except it's mostly self inflicted.

Re: I am retiring from tech to live offline

#580

Post by repelsteeltje »

timcambrant wrote: post #569
repelsteeltje wrote: post #395

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well, at least the way he handless the typewriter and scribbles seems somewhat performative. If it's just a draft version, he seems capable of handling the typing hammers very professionally, adding online corrections staying within margins. Seems way more seasoned in typing, than most typist of those days. And yet, he can't find the time or patience to retype the piece without typos as a final version? I don't know…

Doing performative things is not in conflict with expressing ourselves publicly. People create art and write in various ways and they are free to do so. If he wants to announce to the world that he's leaving the Internet (which is more of a meaningful expression than doing it quietly, for sure) then he can be creative about it without it invalidating his purpose. He could have even posted a photo or a poem along with…

That's also true
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