Ireland rolls out basic income scheme for artists • Hacker News Board

Re: Ireland rolls out basic income scheme for artists

#571

Post by MisterTea » Thu, Feb 12, 2026, 3:45 PM UTC

jimnotgym wrote: post #351

There are some pretty revealing comments here. People seem to think only money has value. Then there are people who see art only as a rich person's pursuit. It can be, but it doesn't need to be. I am reminded of Daniel James also known as Gwyrosydd, his bardic name. He was a Welsh language poet, who wrote probably the greatest Welsh language song, Calon Lân (means 'a pure heart'). People throughout Wales sing this so…

> Then there are people who see art only as a rich person's pursuit. It can be, but it doesn't need to be.

They don't care about the art, only the clout it brings them in terms of hoarding a limited thing people value.

Art is a medium that is used to convey and stir emotion in the viewer. It's not currency to anyone but shallow fools.

Re: Ireland rolls out basic income scheme for artists

#572

Post by WesolyKubeczek » Thu, Feb 12, 2026, 3:47 PM UTC

limagnolia wrote: post #562

kiba wrote: post #556

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The problem with a UBI is not the UBI itself, but the fact that landlords could just raise their price. You need to solve the contradiction within the economy in order to make UBI works. The current way our taxation policy work is to tax labor and capital, which is the basis of our economy, while flinching away from taxing land, which derives much of its value from the surrounding economic activity rather than an own…

If cities allowed more supply to be constructed, landlords couldn't just raise the price.

I know of cities where real estate development is rampant, sometimes to the detriment of quality, and yet apartment prices are soaring.

Re: Ireland rolls out basic income scheme for artists

#573

Post by danparsonson » Thu, Feb 12, 2026, 3:49 PM UTC

miroljub wrote: post #502

danparsonson wrote: post #457

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You'd need to be more specific - who/what is this huge group of people you're referring to?

> You'd need to be more specific - who/what is this huge group of people you're referring to? I already explained why I don't want to say it aloud in this context. Your guess is as good as anyone's. > ... as a society, we have decided not to talk about it so we are not called racists or far right.

I'm not interested in guessing what your opinion is, I'm hoping you'll share it. I don't think you'll be unfairly judged; of course if you are actually being racist then it's not unfair for anyone to call that out. I don't feel like 'society' has decided not to talk about certain things to avoid name calling; I've personally only heard that kind of phrase coming from someone who holds a racist opinion but doesn't like the label, but I'm always opening to broadening my mind. Enlighten me!

Re: Ireland rolls out basic income scheme for artists

#574

Post by maleno » Thu, Feb 12, 2026, 3:51 PM UTC

CalRobert wrote: post #232

s_dev wrote: post #211

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Irish here. It's a cultural thing. Ireland is the only country in the world whose national symbol is a musical instrument. Art is seen as a worthwhile endeavour even if it can't necessarily support itself as a private endeavour. It's for the same reason galleries and museums are subsidised by the government. Anyone can call themselves an artist but to receive this money you would have to have a portfolio of work that…

This seems like it mostly funnels money to rich kids, to be honest. Nobody else can afford to already be an artist.

I'm an Irish artist, living in Ireland. I'm very far from a rich kid. Like most Irish artists, I make some of my living from my "artistic" work, and some from what others here might call "real work". Sometimes there's not a clear division between the two, and anyway the ratio of one to the other changes every year.

Because of the cost of living here, particularly in Dublin, there is no way that the Basic Income would provide me with anything like what most people here would consider a decent standard of living. (It would currently leave me with about €200 left over every month, after I pay just my rent. That's before any bills or groceries or anything.)

Plenty of people find a way to continue to make art that other people value, even if the cost of living continues to spiral ever upwards. This payment is simply a buffer to make making art a little easier, for a fraction of the many people who contribute to the social, cultural, and intellectual life of this country. For some it pays their rent or mortgage, for some it pays for childcare so they have time to work, for some it facilitates research or purchase of materials, for some it allows them a workspace outside their home.

It's not perfect, as no public arts funding is perfect but, to me, the kind of cheap cynicism displayed in this comment comes from a place of deep ignorance and bitterness.

Re: Ireland rolls out basic income scheme for artists

#575

Post by CGMthrowaway » Thu, Feb 12, 2026, 3:53 PM UTC

Schlagbohrer wrote: post #367

jimnotgym wrote: post #351

There are some pretty revealing comments here. People seem to think only money has value. Then there are people who see art only as a rich person's pursuit. It can be, but it doesn't need to be. I am reminded of Daniel James also known as Gwyrosydd, his bardic name. He was a Welsh language poet, who wrote probably the greatest Welsh language song, Calon Lân (means 'a pure heart'). People throughout Wales sing this so…

When Nirvana first moved from their small Washington town to Seattle, they were able to pay their rent + everything else from working minimum wage jobs for 2 weeks a month. They had time to practice music and pursue their art. In an era where working a full time job is not enough to pay the cost of living, arts and culture no longer exist except as hobbies for rich kids. Seattle successfully exterminated their entire…

Citation needed. "Cobain thought Seattle was too expensive a place to live. He couldn’t even afford his Olympia apartment, and was evicted for not paying rent while he was recording Nevermind.”[1] "They supported themselves through food stamps, sleeping on porches."[2]

[1]https://www.seattletimes.com/entertainment/music/that-magic-...

[2]https://www.livenirvana.com/interviews/9307rh/index.php

Re: Ireland rolls out basic income scheme for artists

#576

Post by ryanjshaw » Thu, Feb 12, 2026, 3:53 PM UTC

komali2 wrote: post #471

ryanjshaw wrote: post #467

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I also wonder why the tax payers who care can’t contribute directly to a fund, and keep government out of entirely.

Then it would be a popularity contest and depend on the artists' ability to market themselves in a capitalist space. The one with the best TikTok channel would get the money. That doesn't lead to having diverse, interesting, and challenging art.

How does the government solve this problem? Why can’t a private organization replicate that? How was art produced previously without the existence of these programs?

Re: Ireland rolls out basic income scheme for artists

#577

Post by RansomStark » Thu, Feb 12, 2026, 3:55 PM UTC

Loudergood wrote: post #547

Supernaut wrote: post #527

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Nicely set out. I completely agree with you. I'm also pretty certain - and I say this both as a lover of the arts and as a taxpayer - that I will see no benefit whatsoever in my life, or to society in general, from the works produced under the aegis of this programme. You know what would have been a worthwhile use of that €114 MM? Improving the pay and conditions of our naval personnel. That way, the nation might now…

Every gun that is made, every warship launched, every rocket fired signifies, in the final sense, a theft from those who hunger and are not fed, those who are cold and are not clothed.

In this case isn't it more that: Every sculpture that is made, every picture drawn, every bed left unmade, in the final sense, a theft from those who hunger and are not fed, those who are cold and are not clothed.

From where I'm sitting, this is theft, its forced wealth redistribution, from people that are potentially already struggling,to people that choose to slum it as artists. Its not even means tested, this really will result in money transferring from those on the edge of poverty to rich art school kids.

There's currently 16,000 homeless / at risk people in Ireland, including 5000 children [0]. I can think of at least one better use for that money.

[0] https://www.irishtimes.com/ireland/social-affairs/2025/11/28...

Re: Ireland rolls out basic income scheme for artists

#578

Post by _heimdall » Thu, Feb 12, 2026, 3:55 PM UTC

tokai wrote: post #563

_heimdall wrote: post #388

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Killing the idea of basic income would be a good thing. It will never work and would leave a society in much the same situation as other past attempts at Marxism.

Basic income is not Marxism. Marxism is against basic income. Getting a basic income is almost the opposite to getting the actual value of your labor. I write this as someone against Marxism. You should read up on things, and not just let your biases dictate how you understand things.

Basic income is very much a step towards Marxism. Its solidly in the vein of moving from what one earns to what one needs. It empowers the state to decide what we need and to allocate those resources. And personally I see no way the government could control such a program without eventually taking direct control over means of production.

I'm also not sure why you assume I haven't read up on this topic. We may disagree, but its extremely dismissive to assume your view is right and I must simply be uninformed.

Re: Ireland rolls out basic income scheme for artists

#579

Post by lbreakjai » Thu, Feb 12, 2026, 3:57 PM UTC

closewith wrote: post #485

jmmcd wrote: post #435

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You didn't read the article. The scheme gave positive return on investment.

> It also recouped more than the trial's net cost of 72 million euros ($86 million) through increases in arts-related expenditure, productivity gains and reduced reliance on other social welfare payments, according to a government-commissioned cost-benefit analysis. I'd love to see the breakdown on this, because in my experience with Government comms, if it was a straightforward economic win like an FDI or industrial…

This sentence sounds like "We saved 1000€ on benefits thanks to this 1500€ totally not a benefit payment!"

Re: Ireland rolls out basic income scheme for artists

#580

Post by BSDobelix » Thu, Feb 12, 2026, 3:59 PM UTC

jimnotgym wrote: post #550

BSDobelix wrote: post #412

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>Or it divides them into people that create cultural wealth and people who create mere monetary wealth. That's what i meant with the potatoes, the government pays for the field with the rare potatoes, and the standardized potatoes make wealth. >So you do agree that art should be supported by government I see, so how would you do it? With free housing (art community's), tax free stuff (for small to medium sales etc) l…

But giving housing or tax breaks needs lots of admin. Isn't that less efficient? Giving housing forces people to live in certain places. What if you are a traveling musician, you might be better off with a van. It is like the Victorian view of giving charity. 'Don't give them money, give them food', like the people don't know what they need.

>But giving housing or tax breaks needs lots of admin. Isn't that less efficient?

Art community's are most always self managing, i would argue finding out who makes art is much more complicated.

>Giving housing forces people to live in certain places.

No one is forced to take free housing or being an artist, if you want something for free you have to play by rules.

>like the people don't know what they need

True, but why are people who are artist different from anyone else, that's my critique. Why is creating art more important then preserving art, being a scientist, a rare-potato-farmer, a retro-game-preserver...or a small town politician?