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We mourn our craft

nolanlawson.com

571–580 of 918 posts

Re: We mourn our craft

#571

"They can write code better than you or I can, and if you don’t believe me, wait six months." They've been saying that for years. Stop believing it.

I tried out Claude code for the first time today, and I was a little bit disappointed after all the comments I’ve been reading about it. I didn’t so much notice a speed difference as I did just not having to think very hard while I was working compared to writing everything myself.

Perhaps I’m too opinionated / a micromanager.

Re: We mourn our craft

#572
post #420

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Good for you. But there are already so, so many posts and threads celebrating all of this. Everyone is different. Some of us enjoy the activity of programming by hand. This thread is for those us, to mourn.

You're still allowed to program by hand. Even in assembly language if you like.

Imo, it's allowed theoretically, as a hobby, but not really as a practice. This is what the blog is about.

Re: We mourn our craft

#573

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So when you "learned software development and practiced the slow, methodical process of writing and debugging software", it wasn't about code? I don't get it. Yes, building useful things is the ultimate goal, but code is the medium through which you do it, and I don't understand how that cannot be an important part of the process. It's like a woodworker saying, "Even though I built all those tables using precise craf…

Not the GP I feel some of that energy. The parts I most enjoy are the interfaces, the abstractions, the state machines, the definitions. The code I enjoy too, and I would be sad to lose all contact with it, but I've really appreciated AI especially for helping me get over the initial hump on things like: - infrastructure bs, like scaffold me a JS GitHub action that does x and y. - porting, like take these kernel patc…

But this just makes me feel like it's literally more ABOUT the code than less. The comment I replied to makes it seem like "code" and "solving humanity's problems" are two different things, when in reality, one leads to the other (if we assume you're working on good products, etc.).

It's one thing to have your approach where you're using AI to help w/ the code, but it's totally another to pretend like "code" is not something you were ever interested in, so it's okay for the AI to write it while you're busy "solving problems," which doesn't make a lot of sense to me.

Re: We mourn our craft

#574

I started programming over 40 years ago because it felt like computers were magic. They feel more magic today than ever before. We're literally living in the 1980s fantasy where you could talk to your computer and it had a personality. I can't believe it's actually happening, and I've never had more fun computing. I can't empathize with the complaint that we've "lost something" at all. We're on the precipice of somet…

> golden age of computing I feel like we've reached the worst age of computing. Where our platforms are controlled by power hungry megacorporations and our software is over-engineered garbage. The same company that develops our browsers and our web standards is also actively destroying the internet with AI scrapers. Hobbyists lost the internet to companies and all software got worse for it. Our most popular desktop o…

> Where our platforms are controlled by power hungry megacorporations and our software is over-engineered garbage.

So similar to IBM in the 80s. Time for a scrappy little startup to disrupt the industry.

Re: We mourn our craft

#575

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>It was, for me, never about the code. Then it wasn't your craft.

No true programmer is excited for the future.

What is the definition of a true programmer.

Maybe the age of programmers is over and this is the age of builders.

Re: We mourn our craft

#576
About 20 years ago I realised the extreme immaturity of IT field. The market was fragmented and you could literally become billionaire from your basement (80's), from an office (90's) etc. It was at the stage of car industry of the beginning of the past century. Since then the IT market has matured a lot so that a handful of companies formed an oligopoly and are thriving with no possibility of threat from isolated developers. In the following years the startup landscape will be dead, everyone will be bought up and even the computer devices will become sealed boxes with controlled buttons. Having a browser open might be a hack.

Re: We mourn our craft

#577
It isn't about the tools or using them, it's about the scale. The scale of impact is immense and we're not ready to handle it in a mutitude of areas because of all the areas technology touches. Millions of jobs erased with no clear replacement? Value of creative work diminshed leading to more opportunities erased? Scale of 'bad' actors abusing the tools and impacting a whole bunch of spheres from information dispersal to creative industries etc. Not even getting into environmental and land-use impacts to spaces with data centers and towns etc (again, it's the scale that gets ya). And for what? Removing a huge chunk of human activity & expression, for what?

Re: We mourn our craft

#578

I do not mourn. For my whole life I’ve been trying to make things—beautiful elegant things. When I was a child, I found a cracked version of Photoshop and made images which seemed like magic. When I was in college, I learned to make websites through careful, painstaking effort. When I was a young professional, I used those skills and others to make websites for hospitals and summer camps and conferences. Then I learn…

> Now, I get to make beautiful things by speaking, guiding, and directing a system which is capable of handling the drudgery while I think about how to make the system wonderful and functional and beautiful. For how long do you think this is sustainable? In the sense of you, or me, or all these other people here being able to earn a living. Six months? A couple of years? The time until the next-but-one Claude release…

For your custom definition of sustainable, perhaps not.

but this is definitely generally sustainable. by 2030 we're fully agentic coding for everything, and it's going to sustain.

Re: We mourn our craft

#579

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Loop it. Use another agent (from a different company helps) to review the code and documentation and call out any inconsistencies. I run a bunch of jobs weekly to review docs for inconsistencies and write a plan to fix. It still needs humans in the loop if the agents don’t converge after a few turns, but it’s largely automatic (I baby sat it for a few months validating each change).

To translate your answer: - “You’re not spending enough money” - “You’re not micromanaging enough” Seriously?

[flagged]

Re: We mourn our craft

#580
post #458

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"The only way to get this before was to read a ton of books and be knowledgable or talk to someone who was" Did you have trouble with this part?

This seems like a hostile question.

Yeah, sure, it can be perceived like that. The message I'm responding to shows a blatant disregard for millenia of scriptural knowledge traditions. It's a 'I have a pocket calculator, why should I study math' kind of attitude, presenting itself in a celebratory manner.

To me it is reminiscent of liberalist history, the idea that history is a constant progression from animalistic barbarism to civilisation, and nothing but the latest thing is of any value. Instead of jumping to conclusions and showing my loathing for this particular tradition I decided to try and get more information about where they're coming from.

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