Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Meta torrented & seeded 81.7 TB dataset containing copyrighted data

arstechnica.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

571–580 of 981 posts

Re: Meta torrented & seeded 81.7 TB dataset containing copyrighted data

#571

Post by qup »

Timon3 wrote: post #470
qup wrote: post #345

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How do you suggest making them smaller? For instance, what if google was still just serving search results w/ ads, and they never expanded that. How would you make them smaller?

Then they'd already be smaller, so there's no reason to make them smaller. Or am I misunderstanding your question?

Okay, they would be smaller, but you said "big corporations should not be able to exist" and they would already be a big corporation with just search--they started this way.

Or, just to follow it through, let's say "WidgetBoss LLC" makes a new Widget that every single human has to have, they become the biggest company ever by making one widget. What will you do to make them smaller? Why?

I have a big problem with Google & Meta, and I can understand arguments about those companies. But not just "big companies" as a generality.

But that's how everyone speaks now. "Literally every billionaire is evil and exploiting blah blah blah"

Re: Meta torrented & seeded 81.7 TB dataset containing copyrighted data

#572

Post by RobotToaster »

adamsocrat wrote: post #32
RobotToaster wrote: post #24

Before I decided my opinion on this I need to know their ratio.

Article states: Meta also allegedly modified settings "so that the smallest amount of seeding possible could occur"

In that case, throw the book at them.

Re: Meta torrented & seeded 81.7 TB dataset containing copyrighted data

#573

Post by mrtesthah »

gizmo wrote: post #37

Based on the encyclopedic knowledge LLMs have of written works I assume all parties did the same. But I think there is a broader point to make here. Youtube was initially a ghost town (it started as a dating site) and it only got traction once people started uploading copyrighted TV shows to it. Google itself got big by indexing other people's data without compensation. Spotify's music library was also pirated in the…

Don’t forget the original developers of Skype also created Kazaa first.

Re: Meta torrented & seeded 81.7 TB dataset containing copyrighted data

#574

Post by peterbonney »

The more I learn about how AI companies trained their models, the more obvious it is that the rest of us are just suckers. We're out here assuming that laws matter, that we should never misrepresent or hide what we're doing for our work, that we should honor our own terms of use and the terms of use of other sites/products, that if we register for a website or piece of content we should always use our work email address so that the person or company on the other side of that exchange can make a reasonable decision about whether we can or should have access to it.

What we should have been doing all along is YOLO-ing everything. It's only illegal if you get caught. And if you get big enough before you get caught then the rules never have to apply to you anyway.

Suckers. All of us.

Re: Meta torrented & seeded 81.7 TB dataset containing copyrighted data

#575

Post by 6510 »

arp242 wrote: post #543
johnebgd wrote: post #340

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I rooted for Uber to smash the Taxi cartels. Let us not forget that Taxi Cartels were also insidious beasts. Taxi drivers abused their walled garden with their price gouging by taking longer routes, refusal to take a credit card, and extremely poorly maintained fleets of vehicles. I have had mostly good experiences with Uber, whereas I had experiences that mostly bordered on general condescension toward me whenever I…

It really screwed over a lot of regular working-class people. In some European cities getting a taxi license was a serious monetary investment. People took our huge loans for this. This was now suddenly worthless. It's like being told your very expensive university education is no longer accredited, but the student loan still exists. kthxbye. I'm not saying the existing systems were always good (they weren't), but yo…

I always tell the story of this restaurant 18 km from my house. If I order their cheapest 6 euro hamburger they deliver it for free within 30 minutes. If I take a taxi to the restaurant I may have to wait for an hour and it costs about 100 euro and another 100 to get back.

Re: Meta torrented & seeded 81.7 TB dataset containing copyrighted data

#576

Post by IncreasePosts »

_Algernon_ wrote: post #183
yoavm wrote: post #58

We all like hating big corporations, especially Meta, and people seem to use this as an opportunity to advocate for punishing them. I think it's wiser to advocate for changing our IP laws.

We're sick of the double standards. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aaron_Swartz#United_States_v._... https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aaron_Swartz#Death While Aaron Swartz was bullied to suicide, these corporations will walk free and make billions. I say give every tech CEO the Swartz treatment, then change the law.

Swartz committed suicide because he was mentally ill. He also attempted suicide multiple times in his life while not being "bullied".

If he was acting rationally and came to the conclusion that dying was better than spending X years in jail, he would have committed suicide after sentencing, not before any trial had even happened.

Re: Meta torrented & seeded 81.7 TB dataset containing copyrighted data

#577

Post by theatomheart »

soheil wrote: post #498
wcfrobert wrote: post #481

Earlier quoted context omitted.

VC and startups are fundamentally about disruption. You can't make an omelette without breaking a few eggs (laws). The incumbent players are not going to sit still and let things be "disrupted". A common response is to make sure the public knows about the broken eggs. I would say youtube, Google, Spotify, Uber, doordash, etc. all have made my life much better.

You don't know a world without them so you actually have no idea if they have made your life compared to that world much better or much worse. How your life was at the time is irrelevant.

100%

Re: Meta torrented & seeded 81.7 TB dataset containing copyrighted data

#579

Post by echoangle »

zelphirkalt wrote: post #540
echoangle wrote: post #532

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But the license restriction would have to apply both to the publisher and the customer. If I go to the bookstore, buy the book, make a scan, and train an LLM with it, how would you enforce your license as an author? The customer never knew that he shouldn’t have been allowed to train LLMs. Edit: I think I misunderstood the original comment, I thought the idea was to sell books and restrict use for LLM training. If we…

Whether you make a scan of it or not, the license applies to the IP, I guess (IANAL). Whether the shop makes a scan should not affect you as the buyer of the actual book. What does the scan have to do with you? Whether the author learns about that scan and perhaps training of some LLM using the scan or not, does not change the legality of it.

But the license doesn’t apply to me as a customer if I can’t be expected to even notice it. If I buy a book in a bookstore, no one would assume that training LLMs on it would be explicitly forbidden. And adding a note to the book would probably not be binding because no one is expected to read the legal notice in a book.

Re: Meta torrented & seeded 81.7 TB dataset containing copyrighted data

#580

Post by AnthonyMouse »

burningion wrote: post #398
johnebgd wrote: post #340

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I rooted for Uber to smash the Taxi cartels. Let us not forget that Taxi Cartels were also insidious beasts. Taxi drivers abused their walled garden with their price gouging by taking longer routes, refusal to take a credit card, and extremely poorly maintained fleets of vehicles. I have had mostly good experiences with Uber, whereas I had experiences that mostly bordered on general condescension toward me whenever I…

This argument ignores the fact that there were other alternatives to Uber at the time, ones that didn't break the law! Believe it or not, there were multiple ride hailing apps on the iPhone, but none were as great at accumulating capital or breaking the law without recourse.

The laws they allegedly broke were the taxi medallion cartel laws, which were the things keeping taxis terrible by limiting supply and competition. And those laws in general apply to the drivers rather than the ride hailing service. There is also a lot of ambiguity there, e.g. if you have a ride sharing service where people go on the app to find people to carpool with on a trip they'd be making anyway and then contribute gas money, is that a taxi service?

But the taxi services obviously hated the competition and waged a continuing media campaign to paint the renegades as the villains.

Post reply on HN