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macOS Sonoma is available today

apple.com

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Re: macOS Sonoma is available today

#571

Post by chuchana »

tacker2000 wrote: post #497
cglong wrote: post #188

So it goes... Warning: You are using macOS 11. We (and Apple) do not provide support for this old version. It is expected behaviour that some formulae will fail to build in this old version. It is expected behaviour that Homebrew will be buggy and slow. Do not create any issues about this on Homebrew's GitHub repositories. Do not create any issues even if you think this message is unrelated. Any opened issues will be…

Yea the homebrew dev team is pretty user hostile tbh. The more you read their github, the more you realize how insufferable and arrogant they are. It leaves a very bad impression. Also, if you are not going along in the upgrade rabbit race, homebrew gets really annoying and actually in your way at some point. I see myself moving to macports soon, if brew gets worse and the stability of my setup is compromised (lots o…

Another alternative that might be worth looking into is the Nix package manager.

Re: macOS Sonoma is available today

#572

Post by MichaelZuo »

cztomsik wrote: post #432
chatmasta wrote: post #250

I wish Apple would separate the updates of their bundleware from their OS. Some of the major updates have meaningful changes to the underlying OS (gatekeeper, SIP, etc.), but others - like this one - are primarily changes to frills like Messages, Notes, Safari and other Apple-native apps that I don't even use. I have no problem with Apple bundling these apps and making them work seamlessly together, and I don't even…

I have similar feelings. Apple did a wonderful job with M1/M2, but on the software side, I have mixed feelings. Xcode is a mess, and Swift UI is not a complete replacement for Cocoa. And on the OS side, I feel like Apple is creating features that I instantly disable because they do the exact opposite of what I want.

Is SwiftUI supposed to be a complete replacement of Cocoa in 2023? I thought that was a nebulous goal for the distant future?

Re: macOS Sonoma is available today

#573

Post by wlk »

dmt0 wrote: post #427
aeyes wrote: post #288

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You know what would be even better? If you could reliably uninstall all this junk or not even install it at all. Every time I hit some button on my keyboard and the Music app opens asking me to create an account I am reminded how hostile all commercial operating systems are.

You absolutely need this: https://github.com/tombonez/noTunes

Alternatively run:

  launchctl unload -w /System/Library/LaunchAgents/com.apple.rcd.plist

Re: macOS Sonoma is available today

#574

Post by viraptor »

dncornholio wrote: post #548
gnicholas wrote: post #368

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Oh man, it gets worse than that. After updating to iOS 17 the other day, I said to my phone "play OverCast" (my podcast app). It used to start playing from that app. This time, it started playing a band called Overcast, and told me I had just started a 7 day free trial of Apple Music. What the actual fuck.

How is this "It gets worse"? iOS has to assume what you mean with play OverCast. Maybe there are other people that wanted the device to play the band? This is such an edge-case which is easily solved by further specifying your prompt.

It knows a) whether you have overcast installed and when was it last used, b) whether you added the overcast band to your favourites or ever explicitly played one of their songs. I'm sure there's some tiny section where the the extra prompt would be useful, but they could be so much better than that.

Re: macOS Sonoma is available today

#575

Post by callmeal »

Hammershaft wrote: post #463
cztomsik wrote: post #432

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have similar feelings. Apple did a wonderful job with M1/M2, but on the software side, I have mixed feelings. Xcode is a mess, and Swift UI is not a complete replacement for Cocoa. And on the OS side, I feel like Apple is creating features that I instantly disable because they do the exact opposite of what I want.

Apple's hardware is incredible but the software is increasingly grating for any kind of power usage. Xcode is frustrating, the permissions system is flagrantly designed for Apple's self interest, window, monitor, and app management is rife with ancient bugs and half baked design decisions.

>Apple's hardware is incredible

I used to think the same, but I had to sell off the 2016 macbook pro because the keyboard was unusable, my 2019 macbook pro has already gone back for stuck arrow keys a year ago, and now the left command key is randomly sticking, which is really annoying because you never know which shortcut key will be triggered.

Compared to my 2010 macbook pro which was used without any repairs for close to 8 years.

Unless you all are buying new apple devices every year or two, I don't see how the "apple hardware is incredible" claim can be substantiated.

Re: macOS Sonoma is available today

#576

Post by azangru »

throwaway2990 wrote: post #545
chatmasta wrote: post #250

I wish Apple would separate the updates of their bundleware from their OS. Some of the major updates have meaningful changes to the underlying OS (gatekeeper, SIP, etc.), but others - like this one - are primarily changes to frills like Messages, Notes, Safari and other Apple-native apps that I don't even use. I have no problem with Apple bundling these apps and making them work seamlessly together, and I don't even…

Messages, notes, Safari. All awesome. Can you imagine installing crap like chrome, ever notes, or fake e2e what’s app?

> Can you imagine installing crap like chrome

I can. Great dev tools, and usually is ahead of other browsers in implementing web apis.

What Safari team presented at WWDC this year regarding PWAs as something revolutionary has been available in Chrome for years.

Re: macOS Sonoma is available today

#577

Post by lifthrasiir »

sph wrote: post #447
pedalpete wrote: post #422

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How do you figure? Windows had 7, 8, skipped 9, 10, 11, and now 12 is coming. Windows thought they'd never do a major update again, and tried to hold on to the 10 label, but then realized that wouldn't work. So 11 is a bit of a branding stumble, but we know, it came after 10.

You are conveniently ignoring any Windows release before 7.

But Windows never used a separate name for minor versions, so there are only 6 exceptions (and hopefully no more). And a half of them are year numbers.

Re: macOS Sonoma is available today

#578

Post by MilaM »

walteweiss wrote: post #542
MilaM wrote: post #514

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Completely agree. I have two perfectly good but now unsupported 5K iMacs from 2015 and 2017 in my household, both don't get any more upgrades. Heck, I would even pay up to 100 EUR/USD for longer support. But that's probably not a viable business case for Apple anymore.

Have you tried to install some Linux distro (like Fedora or Ubuntu) on it? If your workflow allows it, of course. I found how well Linux works on my relatively old Apple hardware. And I can use it most of the time, just need to learn some new tools, as many I’m familiar with are macOS only.

I know my way around Linux, as a server OS at least. The issue with switching is more about my previous investment in buying and learning dozens of third-party apps. I also must say that I value the integration between macOS and iOS a lot.

Once my (i)Macs stop receiving security updates though, I might try a Linux distro, just to give them a second life.

Re: macOS Sonoma is available today

#579

Post by pyr0hu »

jbc1 wrote: post #551
pyr0hu wrote: post #178

Earlier quoted context omitted.

For myself, peace of mind. Previously I installed them over an existing system, never had any issues. I have a repo for my dotfiles and install scripts so i can set up my system in like an hour

Any tips to setting up macOS dotfiles? I set up a new Mac today and was going to go that route but after trying to do a diff of "defaults read" and seeing that its thousands of lines largely unrelated to macOS I gave up and changed the obvious things using the settings menu and now just have to deal with all the other minor differences as they popup.

I can't help with that sorry, I keep the Mac settings on default as they are usually works for me, dotfiles only have terminal/vim/ssh/git settings :|

Re: macOS Sonoma is available today

#580

Post by MilaM »

breakfastduck wrote: post #549
MilaM wrote: post #514

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Completely agree. I have two perfectly good but now unsupported 5K iMacs from 2015 and 2017 in my household, both don't get any more upgrades. Heck, I would even pay up to 100 EUR/USD for longer support. But that's probably not a viable business case for Apple anymore.

Have you explored https://github.com/dortania/OpenCore-Legacy-Patcher ? I have used it before and, in my experience and everyone else I know who has used it, the vast majority of time the newer versions run absolutely fine with no issues. Occasionally some newer features don't work, but I'd but confident that 2015/2017 iMacs would be able to run the latest version no problem.

I used Dosdude's patches to install Mojave on a 2011 Mac mini. That worked well. Thanks for mentioning OpenCore-Legacy-Pather. I have it on my radar, just didn't have the time to look into it more thoroughly.
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