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Scientists believed Covid leaked from Wuhan lab, but feared debate could hurt

telegraph.co.uk

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Re: Scientists believed Covid leaked from Wuhan lab, but feared debate could hurt

#571

Post by palebluedot »

roenxi wrote: post #446
cortic wrote: post #398

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Happened in the UK as well, Boris (and to be fair the WHO) told us masks were counter productive. That they might get you to stand closer to people and touch your face more, increasing your chances of getting Covid.. All presumably to save a mask shortage; But we know, and they should have known, that the public doesn't buy the same kind of masks that our NHS buys and there never was going to be any shortage. This en…

> It lead to some number of deaths, probably 10s of thousands in the UK Is there solid evidence anywhere that masks are important one way or the other? While it is plausible that a mask could prevent an infection in an encounter, I've not yet seen anyone waving something conclusive around that masks prevent infections over the course of a pandemic. I've managed to avoid the coronavirus for 2 years now and as far as I…

Something to note, is that while it is possible we might all eventually contract COVID (or its variants), there is real benefit in contracting it as late as possible, and not being among the first group that gets it. The vaccines greatly blunt the severity of illness, but even outside of vaccines our treatment regimes are better for the hospitalized.

So if wearing masks pushes your infection date out to when vaccines are available (and you get vaccinated), it is not unreasonable to assume the inverse (that not wearing masks led to earlier infections and thus worse outcomes, and death)

Re: Scientists believed Covid leaked from Wuhan lab, but feared debate could hurt

#572

Post by Ntrails »

cortic wrote: post #398
enriquto wrote: post #324

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Once government officials and scientists gaslight us about what they think they should, how does one know they wouldn't for anything at all they decide to? For me it was the masks. The masks were my tipping point. At some point at the beginning of the pandemic they said that the disease was totally not airborne and that masks were useless. I remember vividly president Macron (a person that I respected before that)…

Happened in the UK as well, Boris (and to be fair the WHO) told us masks were counter productive. That they might get you to stand closer to people and touch your face more, increasing your chances of getting Covid.. All presumably to save a mask shortage; But we know, and they should have known, that the public doesn't buy the same kind of masks that our NHS buys and there never was going to be any shortage. This en…

Note that we are still spending a fortune globally on enhanced cleaning regimes and special anti viral detergents to prevent an airbourne virus getting onto our hands.

Re: Scientists believed Covid leaked from Wuhan lab, but feared debate could hurt

#573

Post by chrisjc »

systemvoltage wrote: post #20
perihelions wrote: post #6

> "Professor Andrew Rambaut, from the University of Edinburgh, also said that furin cleavage site “strikes me as unusual”." > "He added: “I think the only people with sufficient information or access to samples to address it would be the teams working in Wuhan.”" This pair of quotes has a completely different meaning from the original quote it sliced up: > "I am also agnostic on this – I do not have any experience of…

The article shouldn’t have quote this person in the first place - there are plenty of serious investigations into the lab leak theory from reputable virologists. I recommend Alina Chan’s new book: Viral. This clarification also masquerades as a clarification of something important. This person quoted by the tabloid is irrelevant here. In fact this article does more damage to the credibility of lab theory than otherwi…

Regarding Alian Chan, she and her co-author appeared on the Hidden Forces podcast a few months back and it's a pretty good listen to anyone unable to squeeze a book into their busy lives.

https://hiddenforces.io/podcasts/lab-leak-hypothesis-alina-c...

Re: Scientists believed Covid leaked from Wuhan lab, but feared debate could hurt

#574

Post by xdennis »

nicoburns wrote: post #507
baobabKoodaa wrote: post #462

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> There seemed to be genuine uncertainty early on in the pandemic Among the civilian population, perhaps. Not among politicians and health officials. At least Fauci, WHO, and Finnish health authorities HAVE come out afterwards and admitted that they lied about masks to conserve them for health personnel.

To be fair, that's not an unreasonable concern for them to have. Masks running out for healthcare professionals would have been an absolute disaster.

If you can lock up the entire population in their homes you can ban the sale of masks to non-medical personnel. It was always an excuse.

Re: Scientists believed Covid leaked from Wuhan lab, but feared debate could hurt

#575

Post by [deleted] »

vasco wrote: post #241

You know this effect, when you've been reading the news for years, and finally your favorite source has a story about something you studied or worked on, and you realize how low quality or outright wrong it is? The spell is broken and you realize how little they know about anything they write. Once government officials and scientists gaslight us about what they think they should, how does one know they wouldn't for a…

[deleted]

Re: Scientists believed Covid leaked from Wuhan lab, but feared debate could hurt

#577

Post by chimprich »

Wiseacre wrote: post #560
chimprich wrote: post #474

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> At least Fauci, WHO, and Finnish health authorities HAVE come out afterwards and admitted that they lied about masks This is not true. I think Fauci etc. admitted that a reason masks weren't recommended early on was partly to conserve masks. That's quite different from the claim that they actively lied about them.

"Seriously people- STOP BUYING MASKS! They are NOT effective in preventing general public from catching #Coronavirus" - Surgeon General, Feb 29, 2020 Please stop spreading misinformation.

I am not spreading misinformation. Please don't throw accusations around.

Previous Surgeon General Jerome Adams is not the same person as Fauci.

I'm not in the USA, but looks like your surgeon general in Feb 2020 was not an ideal choice for the post. He sounds like a political Trump appointee.

Even so, the full tweet read:

"Seriously people- STOP BUYING MASKS!

They are NOT effective in preventing general public from catching #Coronavirus, but if healthcare providers can't get them to care for sick patients, it puts them and our communities at risk!"

...so it sounds like he was quite upfront about the idea that mask use was partly being discouraged to avoid pressure on sourcing masks for medical professionals.

Re: Scientists believed Covid leaked from Wuhan lab, but feared debate could hurt

#578

Post by matheusmoreira »

enriquto wrote: post #324
vasco wrote: post #241

You know this effect, when you've been reading the news for years, and finally your favorite source has a story about something you studied or worked on, and you realize how low quality or outright wrong it is? The spell is broken and you realize how little they know about anything they write. Once government officials and scientists gaslight us about what they think they should, how does one know they wouldn't for a…

> Once government officials and scientists gaslight us about what they think they should, how does one know they wouldn't for anything at all they decide to? For me it was the masks. The masks were my tipping point. At some point at the beginning of the pandemic they said that the disease was totally not airborne and that masks were useless. I remember vividly president Macron (a person that I respected before that)…

Happened in my country as well. In the beginning of the pandemic when there were a lot of unknowns, authorities made blatantly incorrect statements and decisions and even contradicted one another. People stopped trusting the government, the doctors, the news. Even now they're saying thay vaccines are risk-free which is quite simply factually wrong, they have a favorable risk/benefit ratio but the risks are not null.

No wonder there are conspiracy theories all over the place. News are disinformation, you can't trust anything you read and uncertainty is at an all time high. People no longer trust these authorities but they still need to make sense of the world so they start looking for patterns. Sometimes they see things where there's nothing and sometimes they're right. I have a lot of sympathy for these people.

Re: Scientists believed Covid leaked from Wuhan lab, but feared debate could hurt

#579

Post by [deleted] »

vasco wrote: post #241

You know this effect, when you've been reading the news for years, and finally your favorite source has a story about something you studied or worked on, and you realize how low quality or outright wrong it is? The spell is broken and you realize how little they know about anything they write. Once government officials and scientists gaslight us about what they think they should, how does one know they wouldn't for a…

[deleted]
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