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More Americans are saying they’re ‘vaxxed and done’

theatlantic.com

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Re: More Americans are saying they’re ‘vaxxed and done’

#571

Post by powerslacker »

efficax wrote: post #497
TimTheTinker wrote: post #376

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I know someone who almost quit a great job because they were mad about a vaccine mandate from their employer. [...] That is what failing the marshmallow test looks like. Or perhaps it's a matter of personal principle. Personal conscience and conviction used to be held sacred in the US ... to the point that conscientious objectors wouldn't be forced to fight in wars (they could be assigned to work as medics in Army…

When your "matter of principle" is avoiding a vaccine you're rationalizing an irrational choice through the mask of a "principle". There's no principle involved (personal liberty? do you also refuse to pay taxes, drive without a license, etc. freedom is a complicated thing)

One principle would be the belief that the US federal government has not been granted the power to mandate a vaccination. Many people opposed to vaccination in the US believe that states, municipalities, and private organizations can enforce such a mandate but that the federal government cannot. As for not taking the vaccine there is the principle of prudent decision making and informed consent: that each individual has the right to decide what is best for their health even if they are wrong. For example, you might choose to be a lifelong tobacco smoker. The current scientific narrative says that smoking tobacco is bad for your health - but at the end of the day it is a decision of personal conscience whether or not you choose to smoke.

Re: More Americans are saying they’re ‘vaxxed and done’

#572

Post by seneca »

I, personally, find it amazing that so many people were willing to sacrifice nearly two years of their quality-of-life to fight a virus that wouldn't hurt most of them. I know everyone is doom and gloom about covid, but I'm actually pretty impressed with how much the typical person (outside of political manipulation and coercion) was willing to sacrifice for others.

If you had asked me in early 2020 how long it was possible to keep this up, I'd have guessed 6 months or so. Lament all you want that people are dropping their vigilance, or about how effective any of it actually was, but I'm generally pretty impressed with how far the "common man" was willing to go.

Re: More Americans are saying they’re ‘vaxxed and done’

#573

Post by iam-TJ »

newsclues wrote: post #73
peregren wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The vaccine may have kept you out of ICU. It doesn't seem logical to change to a "let the chips fall where they may" based on this experience.

It doesn’t make sense that individuals can do everything to be safe and the the hospital of all places is where they get sick. Dwell deeply on that. The hospital is incapable of keeping people safe from Covid. All the masks, social distancing and testing, and you catch Covid at the hospital.

In mid 2020 in the UK, The National Health Service (NHS) began introducing "green" and "ultra-green" pathways, and designating zones or entire hospitals as 'green' (CoVid-19 free) sites. 'Green' and 'ultra-green' refer to CoViD-19 prevention measures in the 14 days preceding non-emergency admissions and the status of zones (or entire sites) at the hospital during and after treatment.

This was to ensure non-emergency admissions could continue without risking infection.

Re: More Americans are saying they’re ‘vaxxed and done’

#574

Post by bb123 »

fourstar wrote: post #506
bb123 wrote: post #197

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Let the chips fall where they may == “I survived with no consequences so I don’t care what happens to anyone else”

Yes, I believe this is called checks notes survival of the fittest.

No it’s called checks notes being a selfish asshole.

Re: More Americans are saying they’re ‘vaxxed and done’

#575

Post by 0xbadcafebee »

CedarMills wrote: post #431

I'm not vaxxed - but want to be. I tested positive for COVID now a second time last week and taking a few days off to be safe. This time it felt a lot easier to go through so I assume it's Omicron. First time around in July 2020, I was in bed for a day and couldn't smell anything for about a month. My partner on the other hand has no desire for us to get vaxxed because they know people personally who have died after…

> they know people personally who have died after getting the shots

I don't think that's possible...

Re: More Americans are saying they’re ‘vaxxed and done’

#576

Post by valachio »

gilbetron wrote: post #522
TimTheTinker wrote: post #376

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I know someone who almost quit a great job because they were mad about a vaccine mandate from their employer. [...] That is what failing the marshmallow test looks like. Or perhaps it's a matter of personal principle. Personal conscience and conviction used to be held sacred in the US ... to the point that conscientious objectors wouldn't be forced to fight in wars (they could be assigned to work as medics in Army…

I think you're inventing a past that didn't exist. Were this pandemic to strike in the 70s or 80s (or earlier), we would undoubtedly have given people little choice to be vaccinated, but we also probably wouldn't have forced people nearly as much. Today we are stuck with these people running around talking about their freedom, when one of the main reasons for government is public health.

I think if this pandemic struck in the 70s or 80s, it would have been shook off as a moderately more dangerous version of the flu, and there would have been no lockdowns or anything like that. Life would go on as normal until natural herd immunity is achieved.

Re: More Americans are saying they’re ‘vaxxed and done’

#577

Post by twblalock »

Animats wrote: post #541

We still don't know if the omicron variant leads to "long COVID".[1] We'll know some time in February. That has a big effect on what to do next. Omicron-specific vaccines are in test. Moderna's should be out in Fall 2022. Pfizer claims March 2022.[2] The next generation in vaccine technology is the US Army / Walter Reed Medical Center broad-spectrum vaccine. This should protect against all COVID and SARS variants.[3]…

> The next generation in vaccine technology is the US Army / Walter Reed Medical Center broad-spectrum vaccine. This should protect against all COVID and SARS variants.[3] That's in Phase I safety testing, with about 75 volunteers. If that works, the problem is solved.

Sure, until the next variant.

The problem of the spread was mostly solved by vaccines before Omicron, at least for people who got the vaccines. Then Omicron came along and it can break through the vaccines much easier than Delta or other variants.

If we develop a vaccine for Omicron, some other variant is likely to come along and break through that vaccine too. Omicron was far more mutated than Delta. Are we just supposed to hope that doesn't happen again? Is is possible for a vaccine to protect against all possible future variants?

We can't keep a state of emergency in place and wait for one new vaccine, after another, endlessly. When does it end?

Let's say we do have a magic bullet vaccine that protects against all present variants, and all possible future variants: wouldn't a significant number of people refuse to take it, as they have refused to take the vaccines we have now?

Re: More Americans are saying they’re ‘vaxxed and done’

#578

Post by neuronic »

gilbetron wrote: post #460
PragmaticPulp wrote: post #332

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We all know that most people get COVID and then get over it, but using a few neutral anecdotes to deny the other issues is like trying to invalidate global warming because the weather isn’t hot where you live. It’s not about comparing all of our anecdotes.

It's the opposite, actually. People worried about Covid with kids are the ones saying that there is no global warming because it isn't hot by them. Statistics are backing up how little effect Covid has on kids (fortunately) - it is anecdotes that are scaring people.

? Consider that SARS-CoV-2 has been shown to increase risk for newly diagnosed diabetes in children: https://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/volumes/71/wr/mm7102e2.htm

It's clearly a very systemic disease affecting almost all organs and long term effects are impossible to tell right now (as opposed to the vaccine btw which cannot by definition create random effects some years later).

Re: More Americans are saying they’re ‘vaxxed and done’

#580

Post by CountDrewku »

bb123 wrote: post #197
EMM_386 wrote: post #14

I'm double vaxxed and boosted and just spent 4 days in the hospital with Covid. I actually entered the hospital without Covid and got it while I was in there. They had the entire place divided into separate wings and I had to be transferred between them. 103 degree fever, pulse 130, was pretty awful but came out of it fine. I, too, am done with all of it. Let the chips fall where they may now.

Let the chips fall where they may == “I survived with no consequences so I don’t care what happens to anyone else”

How does anything he does from here on out have any consequence on other people's decisions?

Did you just entirely dismiss what he said about catching it?

It is not his responsibility to protect you or anyone else. YOU can stay home and isolate if you can't handle being out. Stop putting your burden on everyone else. You (and your ilk) have no right to demand protection from others while putting yourself in harms way.

"I can't handle my own health anxiety so I'm going to make sure everyone makes ME feel better regardless of how it affects their lives"

You're the selfish one in this situation.

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