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A search engine that favors text-heavy sites and punishes modern web design

search.marginalia.nu

571–580 of 735 posts

Re: A search engine that favors text-heavy sites and punishes modern web design

#571
post #100
post #81

Earlier quoted context omitted.

IMHO, that is a trendy claim in HN with little evidence.

You want evidence? Search for a plumber/tradesperson in your area THEN try to find rational discourse about your options. There are literally 100s of results of websites remixing a small set of data, presenting it to you, and asking you to buy something to see more, when you know there is nothing behind the scenes. This type of engine would punish these sites, in theory, and may turn up a discussion in some forum, ne…

well it displays a map of plumbers in my area, is it not useful? Besides do you remember what it was displaying before "it became useless"? This whole thread is full of hand wavy claims with pretty much no good examples about how Google actually became worse in time. Hence my point.

Re: A search engine that favors text-heavy sites and punishes modern web design

#572

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I’m not against a stemmer, actually, just against the aggressive concordances (?) that Google now employs, like when it shows me X in Banach spaces (the classical, textbook case) when I’m specifically searching for X in Fréchet spaces (the generalization I want to find but am not sure exists); of course Banach spaces and Fréchet spaces are almost exclusively encountered in the same context, but it doesn’t mean that o…

I thought you could fix that by enclosing "BRST" in quotes, but apparently not. DuckDuckGo (which uses Google) returns a couple of results that do contain "BRST" in a medical context, but most results don't contain this string at all. What's going on?

I’m not certain what DDG actually uses (wasn’t it Bing?), but in my experience from the last couple of months it ignores quotes substantially more eagerly than Google does. For this particular term, a little bit of domain knowledge helps: even without quotes, brst becchi, brst formalism, brst quantization or perhaps bv brst will get you reasonable results. (I could swear Google corrected brst quantization to best quantization a year ago, but apparently not anymore.) Searching for stuff in the context of BRST is still somewhat unpleasant, though.

I... don’t think anything particularly surprising is happening here, except for quotes being apparently ignored? I’ve had it explained to me that a rare word is essentially indistinguishable from a popular misspelling by NLP techniques as they currently exist, except by feeding the machine a massive dictionary (and perhaps not even then). BRST is a thing that you essentially can’t even define satisfactorily without at the very least four years of university-level physics (going by the conventional broad approach—the most direct possible road can of course be shorter if not necessarily more illuminating). “Best” is a very popular word both generally and in searches, and the R key is next to E on a Latin keyboard. If you are a perfect probabilistic reasoner with only these facts for context (and especially if you ignore case), I can very well believe that your best possible course of action is to assume a typo.

How to permit overriding that decision (and indeed how to recognize you’ve actually made one worth worrying about without massive human input—e.g. Russian adjectives can have more than 20 distinct forms, can be made up on the spot by following productive word-formation processes, and you don’t want to learn all of the world’s languages!) is simply a very difficult problem for what is probably a marginal benefit in the grand scheme of things.

I just dislike hitting these margins so much.

Re: A search engine that favors text-heavy sites and punishes modern web design

#573
You can add this to Firefox as search engine option by right clicking on the URL and selecting "Add Marginalia". From there, setting it as your default search engine is done from the "Settings" panel as with other predefined search engines.

I'm experimenting with using it as my default ...

Re: A search engine that favors text-heavy sites and punishes modern web design

#574
post #95
post #90

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You're downvoted but in my experience I have never really been burned by this Google-decline

"I haven't seen a black swan, ergo it's not real." I've been burned by this decline in the past. From creepy results i.e. first suggestion before typing was something I spoke near the Android and I never searched for before; to not finding what I was searching for before successfully, Google has started declining.

It would be nice if you provided a few real examples so that we would see how Google was so fantastic and found everything magically but then went to shit.

Re: A search engine that favors text-heavy sites and punishes modern web design

#575

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think you need to approach it more like grep than google. It's a forgotten art, dealing with this type of dumb search engine. Like if you search for "How do I make a steak", you aren't going to get very good results. But a better query is "Steak Recipe", as that is at least a conceivable H1-tag.

This is exactly how I prefer to use my search engines.

I searched like this all my life and always got expected results.

But just a week ago I found out that these "how", "what" questions give better and faster results on Google.

Re: A search engine that favors text-heavy sites and punishes modern web design

#576

If the website is targeted towards international audience then its nice to have the first page links to content in english. All the four links in the main page https://www.marginalia.nu/ have links to non-english content which is not useful. Disclaimer: I am not a native english speaker. English is my second language.

Yeah my main site is a bit of a disorderly mess. It started as a Swedish blog, but I've since added a few services aimed at a global audience. Haven't quite figured out how to unify it all just yet.

Re: A search engine that favors text-heavy sites and punishes modern web design

#577

Earlier quoted context omitted.

what I really want is a true AI to search through all that and figure out the useful truth. I don't know how to do this (and of course whoever writes the AI needs to be unbiased...)

>whoever writes the AI needs to be unbiased...) I'm not sure the idea of a sentient being not having a bias is meaningful. Reality, once you get past the trivial bits, is subjective.

I didn't say the AI should be unbiased, just whoever writes it.

I want an AI that is biased to the truth when there is an objective one, and my tastes otherwise. (that is when asked to find a good book it should give me fantasy even though romance is the most popular genre and so will have better reviews)

Re: A search engine that favors text-heavy sites and punishes modern web design

#578

Are there any technical infos about the search engine? Found some information here https://memex.marginalia.nu/projects/edge/about.gmi Author said they threw it together on consumer hardware. How big is the index? (TB used or entries) how is it realised? I'm pretty much interested in this since I myself am crawling some pages for my own "search index". Oh and thx for making and posting. Added it as a keyword to firef…

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Re: A search engine that favors text-heavy sites and punishes modern web design

#579
post #534
post #322

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The context matters. I'd happily read "Top 10" lists on a website if the site itself was dedicated to that one thing. "Top 10 Prog Rock albums", while a lazy, SEO-bait title, would at least be credible if it were on a music-oriented website. But no, these stories all come from cookie-cutter "new media" blog sites, written by an anonymous content writer who's repackaged Wikipedia/Discogs info into Buzzfeed-style copy…

I'm not sure I agree with your example. It seems to me it is the exact same as a "Top ten drinks to drink on a rainy day" list. There's simply too many good albums and opinions differ, so a top ten would -just like the drinks- end up being a list of the most popular ones with maybe one the author picks to stir some controversy or discussion. In my opinion the world would be a smarter place if Google ranked all such s…

Google won't rank them low because they actually do serve an important purpose. They're there for people who don't really know what they want specifically, they're looking for an overview. A top 10 gives a digestible overview on some topic, which helps the searcher narrow down what they really want.

A "Top 10 albums of all time" post is actually better off going through 10 genres of popular music from the past 50 years and picking the top album (plus mentioning some other top albums in the genre) for each one.

That gives the user the overview they're probably looking for, whether those are the top 10 albums of all time or not. It's a case of what the user searched for vs what they actually really want.

Re: A search engine that favors text-heavy sites and punishes modern web design

#580

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I thought you could fix that by enclosing "BRST" in quotes, but apparently not. DuckDuckGo (which uses Google) returns a couple of results that do contain "BRST" in a medical context, but most results don't contain this string at all. What's going on?

I’m not certain what DDG actually uses (wasn’t it Bing?), but in my experience from the last couple of months it ignores quotes substantially more eagerly than Google does. For this particular term, a little bit of domain knowledge helps: even without quotes, brst becchi , brst formalism , brst quantization or perhaps bv brst will get you reasonable results. (I could swear Google corrected brst quantization to best q…

It would not be a difficult problem if they allowed the " " operator to work as they claim it does, or revive the + operator.
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