Earlier quoted context omitted.
He’s asking specifically about Coinbase. Referencing how “most companies” do things isn’t relevant to his question. And can you explain to me why one is absolutely required to publicly vocalize their stance on the George Floyd issue? How is not wanting to speak on the topic in the workplace equivalent to being racist?
Seems like an application of the "white silence is violence" principle. Vox (among others) wrote a piece on it: https://www.vox.com/2020/6/3/21278245/antiracist-racism-race...
‘Tokenized’: Black Workers’ Struggles at Coinbase
571–580 of 717 posts
Re: ‘Tokenized’: Black Workers’ Struggles at Coinbase
#572Earlier quoted context omitted.
> Armstrong took public stance that he wanted Coinbase to focus on crypto space stuff. I don't think that he would have taken that public stance if he didn't feel that the company was being distracted internally by racial justice issues. It being a fair response is highly dependent on those internal conversations. And the NY Times reports that prior to this conversation there was a public meeting where Black employee…
Well, I don't know what is going on in Coinbase. But the NYT has in the past overplayed the race card with no evidence. Now I'm happy to agree that the retention rate of black people at Coinbase raises some questions. But the NYT, having asked those questions, came up with no particular evidence of racism. The major piece of evidence that these issues are substantially due to race is that the NYT felt it warranted a…
Re: ‘Tokenized’: Black Workers’ Struggles at Coinbase
#573Earlier quoted context omitted.
Racism is endemic in the US. It was founded with the notion that black people were basically livestock. We've slowly and fitfully moved away from that, but the problem is far from over. With any company we should assume that both personal and systemic bias are present. Which is why well-run companies work to counter that.
> Racism is endemic in the US. It was founded with the notion that black people were basically livestock. The existence of slavery in the past isn’t driving the current race issues in the US so much as fallout from much more recent segregation policies. Nobody alive today was a (or was born to) a slave and the majority of the states that make up the United States were not even part of the country during the civil war…
Re: ‘Tokenized’: Black Workers’ Struggles at Coinbase
#574Earlier quoted context omitted.
> It's intended to mollify any concerns of well-meaning whites that POC might actually really be upset with racial discrimination, and actually want significant change beyond superficial proposals. First, you have no idea of my intent, because I didn't tell you. Second, what you allege to be my intent is not my intent. Third, conceding for the sake of argument that you were right about my intent, why is it that the m…
Support for "defund the police", both the harsh slogan and the actual policy of reallocating some funding to social services, is dramatically higher among POC than whites so I don't think your analysis that "those who want radical change appear to be overwhelmingly white and particularly non-black" is correct. https://morningconsult.com/2020/06/17/defund-the-police-comm...
If you ask people whether they want the police presence in their communities to stay the same or increase, large majorities agree. Only 19% of black Americans want police presence to decrease.[3]
And yet none of this is inconsistent. If the problems in predominantly non-white urban areas are at least in part crime problems that the police aren't solving, it makes sense for those citizens to want to take money from the police, whom they perceive to not be doing their jobs. At the same time, these same people probably would prefer the police to just do their jobs in the first place.
[1]https://abcnews.go.com/Politics/64-americans-oppose-defund-p...
[2]https://news.gallup.com/poll/315962/americans-say-policing-n...
[3]https://news.gallup.com/poll/316571/black-americans-police-r...
Re: ‘Tokenized’: Black Workers’ Struggles at Coinbase
#575Earlier quoted context omitted.
Could you show me this list of racists you're referring to, with regards to this HN thread and the dangers of disputing the racism of Coinbase's management?
This is an odd sort of response. Shouldn't the people claiming that HN is chock full of racism be the ones enumerating exactly which users are engaging in racism and exactly what behaviors they're doing that promote racism? All I see are exceedingly vague accusations, most of which seem to operate from particularly uncharitable assumptions that equate any disagreement as another manifestation of racism. Ironically, t…
Lists that usually do exist in private tend to be ones like “Don’t work for X company/person” which have a plethora of motivations that may or may not have anything to do with discriminatory behavior. But these are circulated and composed by people at the bottom rather then the top so nobody gets fired: the biggest risk here is you lose out on talent.
Re: ‘Tokenized’: Black Workers’ Struggles at Coinbase
#576Earlier quoted context omitted.
If you know zero Black people and work with zero Black people it’s very easy to come to the conclusion that there is no racism against Black people. If there was you’d see it!
This comment is too snarky for my taste but the main thrust of the message is spot on. When I've taken the time to ask black friends and black professionals in my industry about their experience, it's very clear that they deal with an extra level of complications and hardships compared to me. And it's not "my one black friend was a victim of racism this one time." It's just generally harder to get a job. It's just ge…
Re: ‘Tokenized’: Black Workers’ Struggles at Coinbase
#577Earlier quoted context omitted.
> You've got a bit to learn about Tibet, HK, Xinjiang ( a muslim region), and soon Taiwan Or, you've got to read to the end of the sentence: > Mostly because China didn't conquer a bunch of neighbors and create a name for the resulting state distinct from “China” That last part matters.
You know China doesn't refer to themselves as China, right? China is Portugese in origin. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Names_of_China
Re: ‘Tokenized’: Black Workers’ Struggles at Coinbase
#578Reading through the comments as black person is depressing. Many of the comments question whether the accusations are even true or collusive attack because of an unfounded accusation that black people tend to be SJWs (stereotyping). Others blame affirmative-action, bad schools, etc. (classic misdirection). Some even venture into the possibility that a black person complaining about being passed over for promotion mig…
Systemic racism is insidious, for so many reasons, and one of them is that it is not always overt. I believe the aggrieved commenters reacting to SJW boogeymen are not ‘racists’, in the sense that they are not consciously discriminating against people different from themselves. But voicing racism is only the tip of the iceberg! Systemic racism is baked into the system, that’s what makes it systemic!
Some of the important questions we (white // male // straight // what have you, fill in your own) need to ask ourselves are like:
How many Black friends do I have? (Nowhere near as many as White friends. That makes intuitive sense: almost everyone in my building is White, same for my job, most of my friends’ friends are White too... But what choices do I make on a daily basis that reinforce that? What different choices could I make to actually expand the range of people I have a chance to interact with?)
How can we better address inequality? (I have a doctorate and I’ll admit it, I’m a bit of a snob, and I’m proud of what I’ve accomplished. My strong preference is to hire based on merit: I’ve worked with incompetent people, unfortunately; and I would be pissed if I wasn’t rewarded for my own merit. But there’s a lot of backstory that got me here: private schools, SAT prep classes, I wasn’t bullied, my own computer, not having to have a job to support my family, not being sick, my native English language skills, I’m handsome and charming and tall and well educated and know lots of lingo and have shared experiences with most hiring managers I’ve met—all of these things helped me a lot to get to where I am now. Systemic racism comes into the picture because there are real social structures that have prevented Black and other minority communities from having access to these same resources. Just a few off the cuff examples: Jim Crow, urban food deserts, underfunded public schools, shitty computers at the public library. Merit hiring seems to me a lot less fair when I consider friends of mine who don’t have that ‘merit’ because of factors that were determined far out of their control.)
What would it be like for me to feel uncomfortable or unwelcome or unappreciated at my job? (Technical customer calls are always a boys club, and I’m good at banter w Midwestern ag tech b2b customers. But shit, I sure notice when they mispronounce a coworker’s name, or start a call w our group of men and women as ‘well, gentlemen’, or crack a dick pun. And it makes me sad to imagine what it would feel like to be the odd one out.)
Systemic racism isn’t going away, or easy to fix. We all ought to start giving some real thought to the unconscious choices we make that contribute to tech feeling like a blanket unwelcome industry for a whole lot of people. Smart, kind, creative, strong people, passionate people, worthwhile people.
———
Edit to add that there were supposed to be emojis sprinkled throughout there, which made clear when I was joking...so you should assume the best in me throughout ;D
Re: ‘Tokenized’: Black Workers’ Struggles at Coinbase
#579> One Black employee said her manager suggested in front of colleagues that she was dealing drugs and carrying a gun, trading on racist stereotypes. Another said a co-worker at a recruiting meeting broadly described Black employees as less capable. Still another said managers spoke down to her and her Black colleagues, adding that they were passed over for promotions in favor of less experienced white employees. The…
A job in a competitive industry is probably the first area where a lot of people first see social promotion end as younger more capable people surpass them. This is going to be especially true for people who have received the benefits of affirmative action up until this point in their lives.
Re: ‘Tokenized’: Black Workers’ Struggles at Coinbase
#580I've spoken to multiple people employed at tech companies that believe they were 'token' hires, I can summarize their thoughts as thinking the situation was "awful". Biased hiring practices are in quite a few cases hurting the people they aim to help.
It’s an unfortunate consequence of diversity-driven hiring practices. Another is that applicants who would’ve gotten hired on their own merit are prejudged as diversity hires.