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Zig → Rust porting guide

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Re: Zig → Rust porting guide

#561

Post by kennykartman »

CupricTea wrote: post #478
kennykartman wrote: post #371

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Thank you, Jarred, for your work. It’s unfortunate to see so much backlash toward legitimate research. Bun is often seen by some as “the flagship project for zig” - especially among those frustrated with rust who want zig to "win over rust" for whatever reasons. At the end of the day, you should do what makes the most sense for your project and your circumstances, regardless of the language or tools involved. Persona…

>who want zig to "win over rust" for whatever reasons I don't understand why this mentality is so common. Zig and Rust are both fine languages with markedly different design goals and they can coexist.

Honestly, I don't know. I think it's because of frustration, but the community attitude is part of it. I experienced first hand people frustrated with Rust moving to Zig and finding other people to pick onto Rust and finding fertile ground (especially if moderators and heads of the community let this kind of behavior continue).

Re: Zig → Rust porting guide

#563

Post by throwaway2037 »

bouk wrote: post #367
2colours wrote: post #363

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think the question still deserves a proper answer.

No, open-source maintainers don't owe you anything if you don't pay for it

I have said the same many times here on HN. This in/famous blog post really changed my view: "Open Source Maintainers Owe You Nothing": https://mikemcquaid.com/open-source-maintainers-owe-you-noth...

Re: Zig → Rust porting guide

#564

Post by anymouse123456 »

kigiri wrote: post #291
Petersipoi wrote: post #167

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Bun is the largest project written in zig. And it isn't close. Bun is bigger than zig itself. Seems like zig isn't mature enough to handle Bun's needs, so I don't blame them at all for looking for off ramps. Only time will tell if rigidity from the zig team is worth the cost of losing Bun. It might be.

It is definitly worth it, and moving to rust because compile times are too slow ? This can't be the main reason for the switch

Indeed. Rust compile times are shockingly bad, especially compared to Zig.

Re: Zig → Rust porting guide

#565

Post by saagarjha »

qurren wrote: post #477
saagarjha wrote: post #411

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is what it means to work on a popular project, unfortunately.

You also don't have a duty to read or respond to the social media flames. Just do the work you want to do. If people get worked up about experimentation, that's their problem, not yours.

It’s not your problem until it becomes your problem.

Re: Zig → Rust porting guide

#566

Post by mehdix »

norman784 wrote: post #272
andkenneth wrote: post #100

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They recently tried to upstream an improvement to zig, but were prevented from doing so because zig has a hard and fast "no AI code" rule. Whether you think this response is trying to put pressure on zig or whether they're just moving for practical reasons is up to you. It's probably a bit of both.

Not only because the AI part, here's a discussion [0] about it [0] https://ziggit.dev/t/bun-s-zig-fork-got-4x-faster-compilatio...

That reply was educational indeed. Thanks for sharing.

Re: Zig → Rust porting guide

#567

Post by tracker1 »

psychoslave wrote: post #555
tracker1 wrote: post #529

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Less than the impact of people who can't be bothered to remember basic historical facts or directions in terms of hitting Google services dozens of times a day across the population. Probably less than the impact of having dozens/hundreds of actual developers, each with a dedicated computer running for months/years in what it would take for a similar effort. If you want to go live in the woods and farm/hunt for yours…

Isn't b it same to emit doubts that the resources required to find and access webpages or use a GPS is causing at scale the same ecological impact as everyone selling the world by the token. Though that might be wrong, of course, then doubts should be addressed with proper reasoning, not aggressive rejection which would be a call to run with a blind fold. Having people working together at some goal is not not going t…

I'm rejecting the pedantry of the premise altogether. YOU don't know the sources of energy used for the data centers in question... you aren't responsible and in a position to change anything... you are making statements to a negative assumption from the start and in such a hostile manner that any reasonable person would probably just ignore you. (I'm not always the most reasonable person)

As for social structures in creating software... the social structures around creating software shouldn't be a goal... software serves to scratch an itch or serve a purpose... and that purpose can even be social or entertainment... but the creation of the software itself doesn't need to serve any other purpose and if it can be done via automation, or partly automation, all the better.

As to going into hunter/gatherer mode... have you tried? My brother isn't even online and regularly hunts and fishes... so did my dad. They weren't wealthy people and still managed to get by. A lot of people do and did through history... because most people wouldn't be willing to do it... I realize that some countries and regions are more populated... but there's plenty of space in the US to achieve this kind of lifestyle.

For that matter, there's absolutely very little standing in your way if YOU want to take on the goals of creating cleaner energy or pairing with "responsible" data centers.

But I really think you're just virtue signaling and grand standing in order to try to shame others because you feel guilty for things you aren't actually responsible for.

Re: Zig → Rust porting guide

#569

Post by qurren »

saagarjha wrote: post #565
qurren wrote: post #477

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You also don't have a duty to read or respond to the social media flames. Just do the work you want to do. If people get worked up about experimentation, that's their problem, not yours.

It’s not your problem until it becomes your problem.

It only becomes your problem if you choose it to be your problem.

Re: Zig → Rust porting guide

#570

Post by baranul »

Capricorn2481 wrote: post #134

April 26th - Bun announces they used AI to fork Zig so they could make an optimization for a 4x improvement April 27th - Zig contributor mlugg clarifies why the specific optimizations Bun did were ill advised and wouldn't have been accepted in Zig, regardless of AI use [1] May 4 - Bun is looking into Rust as an alternative. This, to me, seems like total whiplash. Has anyone at Bun made a statement on why they're maki…

Zig is a pre 1.0 language, subject to many breaking changes and has thousands of (stranded) issues on its GitHub.

It was always a risky proposition to use Zig, unless those persons were philosophically committed to help the language develop or die-hard fans. If not, them jumping to some other language, should not be so big of a surprise.

They may come to the conclusion that Zig is incapable of delivering on its promises or is deficient at satisfying their requirements.

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