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Statement by Denmark, Finland, France, Germany, the Netherlands,Norway,Sweden,UK

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Re: Statement by Denmark, Finland, France, Germany, the Netherlands,Norway,Sweden,UK

#561

Post by tsoukase »

maxloh wrote: post #165

I wonder how the current events in Greenland will impact the safety and sovereignty of Taiwan. The US is Taiwan’s most important military ally, even if that relationship remains unofficial. It is also the most critical power in the First Island Chain. If the US stopped being a global superpower, countries like Japan and South Korea might not be willing to aid in defending Taiwan on their own.

Taiwan is a completely different situation with other priorities. It's on the other side of the globe and just one more remote interest like Israel. It's there not to directly improve US's security, like Greenland does, but to suppress China's.

Re: Statement by Denmark, Finland, France, Germany, the Netherlands,Norway,Sweden,UK

#562

Post by hulitu »

EastLondonCoder wrote: post #252

This isn’t really about Greenland’s strategic value; it’s about the category error. You can trade goods, sign treaties, and negotiate basing rights. You can’t “buy” a people or their sovereignty especially when they don’t consent. That’s why Europe responds with process and principle: normalize coercion-as-bargaining among allies and you’re reviving a pre-1945 model of politics Europe built institutions to prevent. I…

> You can’t “buy” a people or their sovereignty especially when they don’t consent

Who said they don't consent ? There was no referendum. /s

Re: Statement by Denmark, Finland, France, Germany, the Netherlands,Norway,Sweden,UK

#563

Post by hairofadog »

tim333 wrote: post #555

Latest - Trump is writing to Norway, blaming his not getting the nobel prize: >Dear Jonas: Considering your Country decided not to give me the Nobel Peace Prize for having stopped 8 Wars PLUS, I no longer feel an obligation to think purely of Peace, although it will always be predominant, but can now think about what is good and proper for the United States of America. >“Denmark cannot protect that land from Russia o…

It really is. We’ve put children with emotional problems in charge of the U.S. military and economy. Shameful and heartbreaking. I hope we can recover and rebuild alliances but I think that will be a multigenerational task.

Re: Statement by Denmark, Finland, France, Germany, the Netherlands,Norway,Sweden,UK

#564

Post by seszett »

jimbohn wrote: post #268
maxloh wrote: post #165

I wonder how the current events in Greenland will impact the safety and sovereignty of Taiwan. The US is Taiwan’s most important military ally, even if that relationship remains unofficial. It is also the most critical power in the First Island Chain. If the US stopped being a global superpower, countries like Japan and South Korea might not be willing to aid in defending Taiwan on their own.

IMO, China will get back Taiwan without firing a single shot, the US is slowly de-risking itself from it and will eventually make Taiwan redundant. After seeing how the US is "helping" Ukraine, will the Taiwanese think fighting an all-out war with allies like this is worth it? China doesn't have the same genocidal intentions russia has towards Ukraine, so less reasons for people to fight it out Edt: would love some a…

> will the Taiwanese think fighting an all-out war with allies like this is worth it?

What example do you know of a democratic country collectively "accepting" invasion by a dictatorship because being free is "not worth it"?

I can't really come up with anything.

Re: Statement by Denmark, Finland, France, Germany, the Netherlands,Norway,Sweden,UK

#565

Post by yetihehe »

bflesch wrote: post #559
yetihehe wrote: post #539

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Hard right wingers are a small minority. There also exist people that can change their opinion. If you don't engage with hard right wingers, a lot of people won't see ant counter-arguments and will be convinced that hard-right way is the majority view, is the right way, and will flock to that way of thinking. Engaging with right wingers on public forum is necessary, so that their voice is not the only one heard.

We're all underestimating the sheer number of people in russia who have a "career" in a while-collar job in some propaganda unit. It's a good way to work at the army but not having to actually fight at the front. They pose as citizens of European, African, Asian or American countries online and try to steer discussion to subvert the local society. The Twitter location reveal showcases that it has an immense scale. Th…

> We're all underestimating the sheer number of people in russia who have a "career" in a while-collar job in some propaganda unit.

Yes, and there are more Russians than Ukrainians, yet somehow they can't overcome a smaller country in 4 years. Trolls want you to give up in countering them. Their work is about pushing propaganda AND demoralising people so that they give up fighting. When you think "why bother", they won.

Re: Statement by Denmark, Finland, France, Germany, the Netherlands,Norway,Sweden,UK

#566

Post by rsynnott »

drysine wrote: post #117
United857 wrote: post #52

Despite all the talk about military action, the fact is that Europe is one of the main trading partners of the US and holds a substantial share of US debt. Any invasion would be economic suicide, and I think even Trump realizes this.

>holds a substantial share of US deb That's the EU's problem, not Trump's)

There's an aspect of mutually assured destruction; Europe could crash the dollar, but at _huge_ cost.

Re: Statement by Denmark, Finland, France, Germany, the Netherlands,Norway,Sweden,UK

#567

Post by rsynnott »

TurdF3rguson wrote: post #492
someNameIG wrote: post #482

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Deutsche Bank made a statement recently that Europe holds about double what the rest of the world does combined in US bonds and equity.

Sure but we were talking about just debt. Also the "rest of the world" is basically just China. I don't think it's a shocker that China isn't interested in betting on US companies.

Nah, China only holds about 600bn these days. Besides European sovereign holdings, most of the rest would be non-sovereign.

Re: Statement by Denmark, Finland, France, Germany, the Netherlands,Norway,Sweden,UK

#568

Post by cogman10 »

scoofy wrote: post #495
consumer451 wrote: post #442

US voters, please be aware that this bill has been introduced in the House. Maybe call you reps to voice support? Democracy is not dead yet. > Bipartisan Legislation Prohibiting a U.S. Invasion of a NATO State Introduced https://hoyer.house.gov/media/press-releases/bipartisan-legi...

The vast majority of folks this message will reach are in tech heavy cities… almost all of which have Democratic Party representatives. It’s honestly just very difficult to communicate with Republican parts of the country on open, reddit-like social media.

Republican politicians are ignoring their constituents.

It's quiet depressing, because a large number of them know they'll be just fine regardless what they do.

We, in Idaho, recently had a school voucher program rammed through even though a huge number of people called to oppose it. Like 90% against 10% for. They still signed it into law.

It's all very disheartening.

Re: Statement by Denmark, Finland, France, Germany, the Netherlands,Norway,Sweden,UK

#569

Post by drysine »

azan_ wrote: post #40
drysine wrote: post #6

[flagged]

[flagged]

>fighting poorest country in the Europe

You are conveniently forgetting ~400 billion dollars[0] of Western military and economic aid to the Ukraine which is ~60% of the Lend-Lease program[1] during the last World War. So in some way this war is comparable to the WW2 with the Germany being on the wrong side of history again.

[0] https://www.cfr.org/articles/how-much-us-aid-going-ukraine

[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lend-Lease

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