Dutch government takes control of Chinese-owned chipmaker Nexperia • Hacker News Board

Re: Dutch government takes control of Chinese-owned chipmaker Nexperia

#561

Post by instig007 » Tue, Oct 14, 2025, 2:51 PM UTC

mschuster91 wrote: post #379

itopaloglu83 wrote: post #133

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Everybody is a fan of free access and capital markets, until a foreign entity purchases something of importance. It’s a continuation of recent trends and closing markets. Nobody in their sane mind would allow a company like ASML or the likes to be purchased by competitors. But the irony is that when a non-European entity were to do something like this, e.g. nationalize their oil or mining etc. industry or a firm, the…

> Everybody is a fan of free access and capital markets, until a foreign entity purchases something of importance. The problem with China is that the "free access" was always one-sided as we did not insist on reciprocity - not for the Internet, not for tourism, not for companies, not for goods. We gave China everything - we allowed their people to study at our universities, we allowed their tourists, we gave them vir…

> We gave China everything - we allowed their people to study at our universities, we allowed their tourists, we gave them virtually full access to our economic market

I'm impressed by their generosity (whoever you're referring to as "we"). Did they also allow the Chinese to win Math Olympiad trophies at some point?

Re: Dutch government takes control of Chinese-owned chipmaker Nexperia

#562

Post by notlisted » Tue, Oct 14, 2025, 2:58 PM UTC

user_7832 wrote: post #308

bgnn wrote: post #88

A bit of history: Nexperia was formed because back in 2017 (if I remember correctly) Qualcomm wanted to buy NXP. So NXP wanted to look more attractive to Qualcomm shareholders and sold its more low-tech business unit to Chinese investors. That acquisition didn't go through because of the tensions between US and China during the first Trump admin. NXP has been trimming fat since its formation from Philips Semiconducto…

> NXP has been trimming fat since its formation from Philips Semiconductors Honestly it appears to me that Philips themselves have just been losing talent/marketshare/I'm not even sure what, causing their gradual decline. The Philips I grew up with was an electronics powerhouse. Today apart, from their healthcare department (and maybe their slightly overpriced lighting department via Signifify), they don't seem to be…

Philips 'unalived' any chances for massive future revenues when they killed off Natlab (in spirit, not just in name). Philips Natlab was the Bell Labs of the Netherlands, even Europe perhaps.

In 1989 Philips introduced a new financing structure that required Natlab to secure two-thirds of its budget through contracts with Philips' product divisions. This marked a major change from its prior model, where funding came directly from the corporate board.

Anything that wasn't "commercially viable" according to the penny-polishers with MBAs was abandoned. The dumbest move ever. Fundamental research can't be outsourced, and never has immediate commercial value.

Re: Dutch government takes control of Chinese-owned chipmaker Nexperia

#563

Post by brazukadev » Tue, Oct 14, 2025, 3:10 PM UTC

like_any_other wrote: post #557

DeH40 wrote: post #352

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That’s a common misconception, but it's factually incorrect. European companies can, and do, acquire and control companies in China. The legal framework and the reality on the ground show a very different picture. 1. The Law Explicitly Allows It: China's Foreign Investment Law (effective since Jan 1, 2020) clearly states that foreign investors are permitted to acquire the shares, equity, or other similar interests of…

I stand corrected. China has recently opened up (wisely only recently, protecting its native industries until they are able to compete globally). Yet the fact remains it is fiercely protective (as it should be. If only EU and US followed its example), and pursues an explicit, government-supported policy of taking over first local, then global markets: China imposes more trade and investment barriers, discriminatory t…

Europe and US are fiercely protective of their companies if you are from Latin America, Africa or Asia, they just can't do the same against China

Re: Dutch government takes control of Chinese-owned chipmaker Nexperia

#564

Post by og_kbot » Tue, Oct 14, 2025, 3:13 PM UTC

teekert wrote: post #551

daan-k wrote: post #454

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Some new information has just emerged in the Dutch press. According to a just published article by the NRC newspaper [0], the owner wanted to use Nexperia's funds to finance another business (WingSkySemi) which was in financial trouble. He would have done this by making Nexperia place large orders for wafers it did not need. The article mentions Nexperia only requiring $70-80 million in wafers, while Nexperia would h…

This Dutch article also adds a lot more context, what the Dutch government did starts to make more and more sense and would for sure be something the Chinese would have intervened in if the situation were reversed. [0] Update: Looks like China has retaliated: [1] [0] https://tweakers.net/nieuws/240304/nexperia-ceo-bevoordeelde... [1] https://nos.nl/artikel/2586411-china-legt-chipfabrikant-nexp...

[dead]

Re: Dutch government takes control of Chinese-owned chipmaker Nexperia

#565

Post by RobotToaster » Tue, Oct 14, 2025, 3:13 PM UTC

corimaith wrote: post #547

RobotToaster wrote: post #485

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Then someone should take the case to the WTO Appellate Body(0), unfortunately Trump and Biden have blocked appointments to it since 2019, so WTO rules cannot be enforced. (0) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Appellate_Body

There are a million ways to cheat trade, the WTO was created to handle small disputes, not large structural imbalances. International Law was highly flawed in that regard owing back to Bretton Woods. But of course it benefits everyone at the expense of deficit countries, so why change or truly address the literature. Appealing to international law today as such is just appealing to entrenched interests. But the matte…

> Under a multilateral Bancor System which Chinese economists themselves advocated back in 2009

I had to look that up and this stood out

> U.S. Secretary of the Treasury Timothy Geithner expressed interest in the idea of greater use of SDRs as a reserve. However, he was criticized severely for this in the United Statess, and the dollar lost 5 cents against the euro in exchange markets following his statements. He and President Barack Obama shortly afterwards backtracked Geithner's comments.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bancor#Proposed_revival

I'm beginning to see a pattern of which country is blocking any progress here.

Re: Dutch government takes control of Chinese-owned chipmaker Nexperia

#566

Post by slipnslider » Tue, Oct 14, 2025, 3:16 PM UTC

tinco wrote: post #473

daan-k wrote: post #454

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Some new information has just emerged in the Dutch press. According to a just published article by the NRC newspaper [0], the owner wanted to use Nexperia's funds to finance another business (WingSkySemi) which was in financial trouble. He would have done this by making Nexperia place large orders for wafers it did not need. The article mentions Nexperia only requiring $70-80 million in wafers, while Nexperia would h…

I am sort of surprised we even have an arm of government quick and authoritative enough to be able to intervene here. I always assumed the government would just let any frogs boil.

I am too. Although it appears computer and computer machinery, like chips amongst others, are the 2nd largest export[1]. I'm guessing these types of companies are very important to economic stability within the country and economic posturing in outside the company in global trade.

[1] https://www.worldstopexports.com/netherlands-top-10-exports/

Re: Dutch government takes control of Chinese-owned chipmaker Nexperia

#567

Post by hearsathought » Tue, Oct 14, 2025, 3:19 PM UTC

amai wrote: post #362

As long as western companies cannot freely buy companies in China the reverse shouldn't be possible, too. Business with dictatorships must stop as soon as possible. In fact it should be forbidden. Nothing good comes out of that. I hope we will see more moves like this from democratic governments.

> As long as western companies cannot freely buy companies in China the reverse shouldn't be possible, too.

Western countries aren't allowed to freely buy companies in western countries either.

> Business with dictatorships must stop as soon as possible.

Why? Business is business.

> Nothing good comes out of that.

What nonsense. You should check the wealth generation the past few decades. Had to take you seriously when you espouse such nonsense.

> I hope we will see more moves like this from democratic governments.

You seem to have a bizarre and naive notion that this is a "democracy" issue. If china was a democracy, we'd have the exact same problem. Heck, you could make an argument that a democratic china would be far more aggressive it would be subject to populism. Russia is a democracy and it is fighting a war with another democracy. Most of the conflicts around the world are between democracies actually. I know the democracies you don't like, you just conveniently label "dictatorships". But saying so doesn't make it so.

The problem isn't democracy vs autocracy. It's a matter of power. White vs non-white. It's the fight over 500 years of established geopolitical order. It's why the fight isn't between the US and china. It's between "the west" and china.

Re: Dutch government takes control of Chinese-owned chipmaker Nexperia

#568

Post by like_any_other » Tue, Oct 14, 2025, 3:22 PM UTC

adrian_b wrote: post #382

motorest wrote: post #289

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> It would be foolish to sell off a great value like ASML or others that adds incredible value. But one should also not get mad when other countries do it, because they see their industries as valuable things as well. This reads like a straw man argument. No one gets mad when other countries do it. At most, you see complains of protectionism being unilaterally imposed while benefitting from your competitor's openness…

China has the right to protest, because nowadays the Chinese companies are not "subjected to the same type of treatment". There is a huge difference between establishing from the beginning clear rules that set limits to foreign investment, like in China, and changing the rules afterwards, after luring foreign investors, and then taking ownership of their assets, like for Tik Tok and Nexperia. Obviously I agree that U…

China also protested when tariffs were floated and any kind of non-retroactive protectionism was proposed. Framing this as only being a problem because the "rules were changed afterward" is deceptive (as is implying that China has "clear" rules). In any case, this Dutch government takeover was done on the basis of a law from 1952, so no, the rules were not changed after "luring" investors (who retain ownership and can still sell their shares, they were not expropriated, so they lose no money).

Re: Dutch government takes control of Chinese-owned chipmaker Nexperia

#569

Post by [deleted] » Tue, Oct 14, 2025, 3:35 PM UTC

tinco wrote: post #473

daan-k wrote: post #454

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Some new information has just emerged in the Dutch press. According to a just published article by the NRC newspaper [0], the owner wanted to use Nexperia's funds to finance another business (WingSkySemi) which was in financial trouble. He would have done this by making Nexperia place large orders for wafers it did not need. The article mentions Nexperia only requiring $70-80 million in wafers, while Nexperia would h…

I am sort of surprised we even have an arm of government quick and authoritative enough to be able to intervene here. I always assumed the government would just let any frogs boil.

[deleted]

Re: Dutch government takes control of Chinese-owned chipmaker Nexperia

#570

Post by corimaith » Tue, Oct 14, 2025, 3:36 PM UTC

RobotToaster wrote: post #565

corimaith wrote: post #547

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There are a million ways to cheat trade, the WTO was created to handle small disputes, not large structural imbalances. International Law was highly flawed in that regard owing back to Bretton Woods. But of course it benefits everyone at the expense of deficit countries, so why change or truly address the literature. Appealing to international law today as such is just appealing to entrenched interests. But the matte…

> Under a multilateral Bancor System which Chinese economists themselves advocated back in 2009 I had to look that up and this stood out > U.S. Secretary of the Treasury Timothy Geithner expressed interest in the idea of greater use of SDRs as a reserve. However, he was criticized severely for this in the United Statess, and the dollar lost 5 cents against the euro in exchange markets following his statements. He and…

Yeah, the US was wrong there and in Bretton Woods. But unless if this an exercise in nationalist polemics, that doesn't change the fact that China is the prime violator in such a system by virtue of their surplus, not the USA which runs a deficit.