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Microsoft is officially sending employees back to the office

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Re: Microsoft is officially sending employees back to the office

#561

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ohio senator introduces 25% tax on companies that outsource jobs overseas - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=45146528 - September 2025 https://www.moreno.senate.gov/press-releases/new-moreno-bill... https://www.moreno.senate.gov/wp-content/uploads/2025/09/The...

This would be very helpful for American jobs.

Call your Congressional reps, ask them to cosponsor.

Re: Microsoft is officially sending employees back to the office

#562

Earlier quoted context omitted.

RTO mandates are about many things, but actual business value of being in the office to the business doing the mandate is low on the list. Among the things it is about: (1) Executives with emotional attachment to certain leadership styles that are enabled by physical presence, (2) Interest in the investor class for the commercial real estate market. The business impacted may not be invested in it, but the businesses’…

It is hilarious that people think the second largest company on the planet, with a market cap over $5 trillion, spends even one second worry about the profit margins of commercial real estate companies, makes any decisions based on that, or is somehow cowed by their alleged political power despite being much, much, much smaller than Microsoft.

Consider the networks of friends and acquaintances the top-level decision makers are likely to be part of. Talking about how they're divesting big corporate dollars from the real estate market probably wouldn't make them more popular at cocktail parties.

Re: Microsoft is officially sending employees back to the office

#563
post #389
post #351

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They are going lose everyone soon as hiring picks up. Short sighted.

Are they though? Do you see any legitimate opposition to the big tech companies forming from recently laid off employees? If there's no alternative for people to work for then if the job market improves people are just going to go back to the same companies. So, are these people who feel spurned by the big tech companies getting together and starting competitors to bring them down?

Lol you can't outcompete microsoft or google.

Re: Microsoft is officially sending employees back to the office

#564

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You missed the people more productive at home because they have less overall life stress, no pain of commute, disabilities which make commute painful or hard, etc. And I suspect that’s a *LOT* more people than you’re giving credit. To be very clear, I’m in that group, and probably so. Several engineers I’ve worked with are in that group, as well. I suspect it’s actually quite common in software.

I honestly don't think this shows in the data. As a software engineer, I really want to believe it, but I think we're prone to confusing well-being with productivity. We feel better about the work, but if you try to quantify it in any imaginable way, it's not there. Not in launch velocity, not in the number of pull requests, not the number of design docs created, bugs fixed, etc... Of course, all of these metrics are…

For what it's worth, my old job was quantifying it in meaningful ways and we *were* revealing, statistically, to be incredibly productive.

And in my own analysis: PRs, test coverage, "story points finished", lines of code written, etc. I was more productive working from home on a reduced hour schedule than I had been working on a strict, high-hours one, too.

Re: Microsoft is officially sending employees back to the office

#566
post #68

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't think this is what you're saying but when I've seen debates over choice the pattern I've sen is: 1) The people who feel more engaged at home can stay home, those who feel more engaged at work can go there 2) The latter group fails to feel engaged at work due to everyone being home. They complain. In other words, they weren't missing being in the office. They were missing being in the office *with others*. Whi…

Yeah it’s tricky because there’s often a senior/junior dynamic here. Junior people really do benefit from structure and in person mentorship. They also tend to have worse home office setups and more free time. Whereas senior people tend to have families and nicer home offices, so understandably they don’t want to commute in. I’m sympathetic to both and realistically I don’t think management is acting in good faith. B…

So do LLMs, but Microsoft doesn’t have any problems with copilot existing.

Re: Microsoft is officially sending employees back to the office

#567

This is going to lead to these abstract discussions of subjective perceptual "productivity" as it always does, but by the actual economic definition of labor productivity, revenue per employee, Microsoft has gone from $143 billion with 163,000 in 2020 ($877,000 per head) to $282 billion with 228,000 ($1.24 million per head) so far this year. They've become the 2nd largest company in the world by market cap, in large…

That's a 14% difference when taking inflation into account.

Re: Microsoft is officially sending employees back to the office

#568
In some sense you can guess the demographics of this site based on their reaction to various things. This particular comment section reveals that few startup people inhabit this site and it’s mostly /r/technology 2.0.

Interesting. Everyone here is an employee.

Re: Microsoft is officially sending employees back to the office

#569
post #469

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The funny thing is, I get more done at the office than at home. And if I’m dressed professionally, I get more done and I get better responses from others than when I’m wearing shorts and a tee shirt. I’d prefer to work from home wearing pajamas but I can sympathize with why my employer wants me in the office and may even have a dress code. Be glad you didn’t work in the development office of a bank in the 1990s, you’…

>>Be glad you didn’t work in the development office of a bank in the 1990s, you’d be expected to wear a suit and tie to work. Priorities matter. I worked for a India IT services firm that mandated neck ties. They would even enforce it with fines. Eventually we saw the whole company had been reduced to these cosmetic pedantry about neck ties, badge-in/out times etc. Nobody every got anything done, because this was all…

Were bow ties acceptable? What about Bolo ties?

Re: Microsoft is officially sending employees back to the office

#570
post #527

Earlier quoted context omitted.

RTO mandates are about many things, but actual business value of being in the office to the business doing the mandate is low on the list. Among the things it is about: (1) Executives with emotional attachment to certain leadership styles that are enabled by physical presence, (2) Interest in the investor class for the commercial real estate market. The business impacted may not be invested in it, but the businesses’…

It’s just (3)

Two things about backdoor layoffs. Mostly its about who. When its corporate dictat, those most likely to leave are those with other options, ie the best talent. So sure a business might save on severances in aggregate, but it doesn't get to decide on who, but simple statistics show it will be the best who move on. So a demoralised and increasingly mediocre workforce is then faced with a much tougher hiring environment with unfillable positions and the downward cycle continues, destroying customer value and reputation to a far greater degree than any temporary layoff savings. All for what exactly, control? Its the C-suites that should be being marched out the door.
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