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AMD CEO sees chips from TSMC's US plant costing 5%-20% more

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Re: AMD CEO sees chips from TSMC's US plant costing 5%-20% more

#561

If that is the cost of keeping the value within the western economies, we should pay. Plain and simple. I'd even argue it's cheap.

Cheap? 20% increase in cost of BoM equals at least ~100% increase for customer. Would you pay twice for AMD components? What would market do?

Presumably they would also accept a lower margin on these, so maybe not 100%.

Re: AMD CEO sees chips from TSMC's US plant costing 5%-20% more

#563
post #464

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The thing about autocracies, there is nobody to stop an obviously wrong decision (for example, Russian invasion of Ukraine).

Yes, because in Western democracies we were very successful at stopping invasions such as Iraq x2, Afghanistan, Vietnam, Korea, etc.

I mean Vietnam was stopped? And Afghanistan? Korea the US never started.

Re: AMD CEO sees chips from TSMC's US plant costing 5%-20% more

#564

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is not an easy inference. For this inference to be true , you have to know how much of the expense goes to salaries . Also, you have to give credit to tsmc to be world class which enables them to control prices, it may not translate across industries

Its a pretty easy inference for anyone who has mfg experience. The amount you pay per worker versus the quality of work you get back is STARKLY different between US and Taiwanese companies.

As in better or worse? The Taiwanese have been making most of our chips for quite a while. Americans are not naturally more gifted individuals, most manufacturing skills are transmitted from one worker to the next.

Re: AMD CEO sees chips from TSMC's US plant costing 5%-20% more

#565
post #364

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ah yes, Taiwán - that famously stable nation with no existential threats to its very existence. I don’t think this is an “if” situation, but rather a “when”. There is no question in my mind - it’s simply too attractive to China. It may not come through all out war, but they will eventually claim what they feel is theirs. They operate on much more manageable time scales.

What is interesting is if the world is not that reliant on Taiwan chips anymore would China really care that much about Taiwan?

China has wanted Taiwan long before they fabbed semiconductors. It's a matter of ego and nationalism, not economics.

It's also political: China hates that there's a Western-style democracy full of "Chinese rebels" on an island 80 miles from their doorstep. They also don't like the cozy relationship between the Taiwanese and US militaries.

Re: AMD CEO sees chips from TSMC's US plant costing 5%-20% more

#566

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What special quality do "western" countries have that makes it a moral obligation to purchase from them over others? Why is it a moral good to keep value from the others?

Trust.

After the Snowden disclosures, not sure about that.

Re: AMD CEO sees chips from TSMC's US plant costing 5%-20% more

#567

Earlier quoted context omitted.

China is not interested in Taiwan for the chips. They want it back since they believe Taiwan is part of China.

Taiwan also believes they are (part of) China

It's more complicated than that, and I think many people in Taiwan (even some in government), especially younger folks, wouldn't really think that way anymore. While it's dicey to say so, many would support full independence.

Re: AMD CEO sees chips from TSMC's US plant costing 5%-20% more

#568

If that is the cost of keeping the value within the western economies, we should pay. Plain and simple. I'd even argue it's cheap.

Yeah customers won't pay more willingly for something this abstract. You can use tariffs but then everyone pays more.

Re: AMD CEO sees chips from TSMC's US plant costing 5%-20% more

#570

If that is the cost of keeping the value within the western economies, we should pay. Plain and simple. I'd even argue it's cheap.

Cheap? 20% increase in cost of BoM equals at least ~100% increase for customer. Would you pay twice for AMD components? What would market do?

What is the alternative?
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