Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

The correct amount of ads is zero

manuelmoreale.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

561–570 of 611 posts

Re: The correct amount of ads is zero

#561

Post by int_19h »

Cthulhu_ wrote: post #95
ballooney wrote: post #72

Earlier quoted context omitted.

He does pay for prime. The fact that they have done a bait-n-switch and now _still_ show you adverts, despite you paying, is reprehensible.

But here's the thing: the subscription is not being cancelled. Amazon tries it, gets some people grumbling, but their bottom line is not affected and in fact goes up from this move because in addition to subscribers they also get ad revenue. A vocal minority doesn't outweigh hard numbers in this case. But that's one of the causes of enshittification, everything becoming metrics-driven.

Ah, the wonders of platform-exclusive content.

Re: The correct amount of ads is zero

#562

Post by int_19h »

arrowsmith wrote: post #162
HeatrayEnjoyer wrote: post #107

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But it is not possible to use it without creating a Google account. I should not need to sign in to watch videos, especially when that makes all efforts at avoiding tracking null.

I get why you might not want to create a Google account, but how is it even possible to operate without one? I'm genuinely astonished by people who are able to get by in 2024 without having ever created an account on Google.

What do you need one for, if you're not in the Google ecosystem?

Just about the only thing I can think of is Google Docs. But if you need that for work, chances are you're using your work account for that, not your personal one.

Re: The correct amount of ads is zero

#563

Post by int_19h »

mgraczyk wrote: post #216
arrowsmith wrote: post #181

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you grew up in Europe, I promise that when you visit the US for the first time, you will be SHOCKED by America's advertising standards (or lack of them.) Advertising is everywhere, everywhere, everywhere, everywhere, to an extent far beyond what you're used to from home. Posters, billboards, fliers, TV commercials, product placement, celebrity endorsements - you can barely step outside without being bombarded by y…

You get used to it in a few days, and it's part of the reason why businesses grow so much faster in the US (especially online). People who want your product find out about it much faster. For example I buy SaaS, and the way I hear about most tools are ads. I choose what to buy via references and evaluation, but ads are often how to get things on my radar. Without Ads, I would have bought worse software in the past

Why do you need ads for that? Why doesn't your research for things that you buy not start with looking up the list of all prominent contenders in that niche?

Re: The correct amount of ads is zero

#564

Post by mgraczyk »

int_19h wrote: post #563
mgraczyk wrote: post #216

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You get used to it in a few days, and it's part of the reason why businesses grow so much faster in the US (especially online). People who want your product find out about it much faster. For example I buy SaaS, and the way I hear about most tools are ads. I choose what to buy via references and evaluation, but ads are often how to get things on my radar. Without Ads, I would have bought worse software in the past

Why do you need ads for that? Why doesn't your research for things that you buy not start with looking up the list of all prominent contenders in that niche?

Where is the list? And what if I don't know the category exists?

Re: The correct amount of ads is zero

#565

Post by mgraczyk »

tolciho wrote: post #522
mgraczyk wrote: post #216

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You get used to it in a few days, and it's part of the reason why businesses grow so much faster in the US (especially online). People who want your product find out about it much faster. For example I buy SaaS, and the way I hear about most tools are ads. I choose what to buy via references and evaluation, but ads are often how to get things on my radar. Without Ads, I would have bought worse software in the past

You got used to blocking all ads back in the "punch the monkey" days, while also wondering about the externalities of flyers put under car windshield wipers, many of such flyers ending up in the drains and gutters as you walked around the unwalkable America. Perhaps America would be less a miserable place with fewer ads? You remarked to a coworker that it would be a great justice if a Porta Potty truck overturned ont…

I don't understand what you're trying to say here

Re: The correct amount of ads is zero

#566

Post by int_19h »

XCSme wrote: post #337
XCSme wrote: post #334

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think that's a good point, and it does make me doubt my initial comment. One issue now, on a world without ads, is what incentive would also those actors have to provide you with that information? Search engine, review websites, YouTube channels, etc. Of course, we could pay them for this information. They could also have affiliate links, but doesn't then it become an ad? I think we hate ads now simply because they…

Another example is computer games. I got No Man's Sky recently because it was discounted on Steam, and I always wanted to try it. I would consider the pop-up you get when you launch steam, and the discounts showed in the store to also be "ads". I am enjoying the (still buggy) game so far.

If you want to buy a specific Steam game on discount, you can just add it to watchlist and get a notification when it has one.

If you want to buy some random games because they are discounted, you can just go to the corresponding section in the Steam store.

The point of the popup is to distract you from whatever you're doing right now to get you to make an impulse purchase, as opposed to a well-researched one. That's exactly how people end up with Steam accounts that have literally hundreds of never-played games in them.

Re: The correct amount of ads is zero

#567

Post by int_19h »

akoboldfrying wrote: post #12
nox101 wrote: post #11

Disagree. Would I like zero ads? Yes, do I think a company should be required to offer a zero ad service for money? No. If you don't like that they have ads even if you pay then don't use the service. People still subscribe to newspaper even though they are full of ads. They paid money, they got an ad full paper. People still subscribe to cable TV even though it's full of ads. People still buy magazines (paid for the…

Hard agree (with you, that is). It's just another case of people confusing "What I personally want" with "What actually leads to a sustainable business/ecosystem". I honestly think people get confused about this because we are so accustomed to getting what we want.

There's no "right to have a sustainable business", sorry.

Re: The correct amount of ads is zero

#568

Post by int_19h »

amaurose wrote: post #201
miki123211 wrote: post #192

To me, being anti-ads is being anti-poor, plain and simple. The advertising model makes the rich subsidize services for the poor, and I think that's a very good thing, and many people underappreciate the extend to which it happens. On that note, I'm somewhat annoyed that we're culturally ok with people who use online services and block ads, and yet we're not ok with people who ride on public transit and don't buy tic…

Who defines what is culturally OK? I ask because in my book, using an ad blocker regularily is worse then skipping the occasional public transport ticket. I don't even know why. But I definitely dont give ad blcoker people that much slack. If you want the ads gone, PAY or stop using the service. Hiring a virtual bodyguard to bully your way through cyberspace is somehow weird to me.

Society collectively decides what is culturally okay.

If ad blocker use is widespread and most people don't see a problem with it even if they don't use one themselves, it is culturally okay.

Re: The correct amount of ads is zero

#569

Post by int_19h »

fastball wrote: post #312
oneeyedpigeon wrote: post #285

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is just a general point about globalisation and selling to different markets. Obviously, a YouTube subscription should cost a Liberian a proportional amount, not the same as a wealthy US citizen. Do YouTube advertisers make as much money from the average Liberian as they do from the average American?

YouTube is a US company with US costs. It might not be worth it to provide the service at a rate that Liberians can afford. The reason they do so now is because the ad-driven model allows them to extract a lot more value out of the US (or other more affluent) customers than those people would reasonably be willing to pay for.

One wonders if there's be a lot more local competitors to services like YouTube in an ad-free world, then. Where the revenues would boost the local economy rather than US.

Re: The correct amount of ads is zero

#570

Post by int_19h »

9o1d wrote: post #80

Dear friends! I am a simple programmer. I had a website in 2009, where I posted useful articles. I had a small ad block, which allowed me to pay for my expenses. When users began to install ad blockers en masse, the number of ad views dropped significantly and I had to close the site. Now I have no job and I am very poor. I want to thank those people who not only do not want to pay for good service, but also install…

I'm willing to pay for valuable content and services. I pay for online search and email, for example.

I'm not willing to look at ads. If the product or service that you have to offer is not sustainable without ads, I'm perfectly fine with it not existing at all.

Post reply on HN