SBF Arrested by Bahamian Authorities • Hacker News Board

Re: SBF Arrested by Bahamian Authorities

#561

Post by Galanwe » Tue, Dec 13, 2022, 3:11 AM UTC

flykespice wrote: post #509

dahdum wrote: post #320

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I haven’t seen any evidence Alameda itself committed any crime, only that they were terrible traders and lost many billions on margin through FTX, who gave them special treatment for collateral. SBF then tried to bail them out with FTX customer funds since he owned both. I think Ellison will get off scot free since she only controlled Alameda, and not entirely. Her crimes are probably minor and worth forgiving for he…

Didn't she admit that only she, SBF and the cofounder were aware that the funds were taken from costumers to fund their illiquid investiments? Many news outlets reported this. She participated on the crime

She doesn't even need to be aware to be accountable and prosecuted. Most regulated activities have a requirement of _means_ rather than _outcome_. i.e. She is as much in breach for not setting up the means by which she should have known, than actually knowing.

Re: SBF Arrested by Bahamian Authorities

#562

Post by testfoobar » Tue, Dec 13, 2022, 3:11 AM UTC

ksherlock wrote: post #76

esturk wrote: post #43

Now we'll see if having both parents who are Stanford Law Professors, and possibly many other legal minded connections, will save him from going to jail.

Per today's WSJ article, they're currently in the Bahamas with him. https://www.wsj.com/articles/sam-bankman-frieds-parents-were...

His father was a paid employe. Quoting the WSJ article about his parents:

"Joseph Bankman and Barbara Fried remained by Mr. Bankman-Fried’s side—as legal advisers, one person familiar with the matter said, but mainly as parents to a son who is in deep trouble.

Before FTX’s collapse, Mr. Bankman was a paid employee of the company for almost a year. He joined his son in meetings with Washington policy makers, expanded its philanthropic endeavors and helped connect his son to at least one major investor. And when Mr. Bankman and Ms. Fried visited their son in the Bahamas, where FTX is based, the company provided a place for them to stay."

Re: SBF Arrested by Bahamian Authorities

#563

Post by siftrics » Tue, Dec 13, 2022, 3:12 AM UTC

maxbond wrote: post #549

siftrics wrote: post #528

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes, I think borders violate basic human rights and needlessly destroy lives and families. Your argument that crypto is consuming too much opportunity cost is completely valid. But why fight against something that offers hope for the misfortunate?

What about people suffering brownouts because their electricity is being stolen for mining, or people losing their shirts in ponzi schemes? What about the people and companies being extorted by ransomware? Do you say to the people who've been harmed by cryptoassets, "sorry, this is for the greater good, there are hypothetical refugees who may find this useful?"

The utilitarian slant is interesting. I can understand why some people think crypto is a net negative at the moment. The set of businesses adjacent to true, on-chain applications is rife with fraud. Thousands of people have died, maybe even millions have lost life savings.

But I ask you an analogous question: what do you say to the people suffering any crime that was aided by free, encrypted communications on the internet?

I'm not using this as a fool-proof argument that the utility of crypto is positive. I do not know the true answer. I think it's positive but I acknowledge it very well could be negative.

To me, blockchains enable the basic human right of having ultimate authority over your own assets. You can choose whether attempting to circumvent your government is worth it. In most cases, it's not. But I like giving all human beings that option.

Re: SBF Arrested by Bahamian Authorities

#564

Post by singleshot_ » Tue, Dec 13, 2022, 3:13 AM UTC

jcampbell1 wrote: post #424

mediaman wrote: post #289

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Depends how much they needed her cooperation, which will determine how much of a deal she got, if any. If they wanted her cooperation, but didn't absolutely need it, they may have struck a cooperation deal in which she still sees some prison time, but a lot less than she would have after a full prosecution. My gut says that because he was so sloppy in implicating himself, that DOJ may not have strictly needed her, an…

There is zero chance she was offered a deal. She is cooperating voluntarily in hopes of leniency. Deals screw her credibility on the stand. She will negotiate a deal when all the cases are over.

This is not correct. Plenty of would-be defendants take deals to testify. Negotiating a deal after you testify is a ridiculous idea and if it has ever happened once, I would love to hear the story.

Re: SBF Arrested by Bahamian Authorities

#565

Post by TacticalCoder » Tue, Dec 13, 2022, 3:14 AM UTC

jusonchan81 wrote: post #481

So now I’m wondering who else will SBF take down with him. There is a pretty good chance he has knowledge of similar situations in Binance or Tether. This should be an interesting trial.

> I haven’t seen any evidence Alameda itself committed any crime

Three very rich crypto millionaires (or billionaires?) have died mysteriously in the past weeks. One, 30 years old, in his sleep. One in a helicopter which blew (not far from where I live) after a mysterious passenger cancelled his flight at the last minute. And another one who drowned (after having tweeted that "they" were after him).

If SBF has dirt on people, I think there's a very real possibility he got the message clear.

Re: SBF Arrested by Bahamian Authorities

#566

Post by dvngnt_ » Tue, Dec 13, 2022, 3:14 AM UTC

notch656a wrote: post #547

notdonspaulding wrote: post #522

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Justice is what happens when people are held accountable for the wrong things they've done. Nothing about justice requires that punishment be meted out in strict accordance with the demographic breakdown of a population except insofar as wrong things are done in strict accordance with the same demographic categories. Maybe you're assuming that to be the case, but I don't think you'll find any evidence to support such…

Exactly. If black people disproportionately are in prison, maybe that's just justice.

uh...

Re: SBF Arrested by Bahamian Authorities

#567

Post by axpy906 » Tue, Dec 13, 2022, 3:16 AM UTC

samhuk wrote: post #366

axpy906 wrote: post #278

Earlier quoted context omitted.

He is more like a Bernie Madoff than an Epstein.

Bernie Madoff was a bit before my time. Was he heavily involved with politics/political figures, to the degree of SBF?

Re: SBF Arrested by Bahamian Authorities

#568

Post by bongoman37 » Tue, Dec 13, 2022, 3:17 AM UTC

tomp wrote: post #145

dereg wrote: post #104

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's clear Caroline Ellison has turned against him. Stephanie Avakian, former SEC enforcement chief, is representing her in NY. I'm guessing they wouldn't have been able to file charges this quickly without Caroline becoming a cooperating witness.

Hm... does that mean she gets away scot-free? Not sure that's fair, she seems very complicit.

No post body was provided.

Re: SBF Arrested by Bahamian Authorities

#569

Post by qeternity » Tue, Dec 13, 2022, 3:18 AM UTC

yalogin wrote: post #501

I wonder if this is because he is incorporated in the Bahamas. May be in the US it would have taken for ever or may be never. Bahamas probably had a reputation to uphold and so arrested him. I mean, moved fast and arrested him.

Not sure if satire…but they arrested him due to a pending extradition request by the US.

Re: SBF Arrested by Bahamian Authorities

#570

Post by crystaln » Tue, Dec 13, 2022, 3:19 AM UTC

Galanwe wrote: post #536

dahdum wrote: post #320

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I haven’t seen any evidence Alameda itself committed any crime, only that they were terrible traders and lost many billions on margin through FTX, who gave them special treatment for collateral. SBF then tried to bail them out with FTX customer funds since he owned both. I think Ellison will get off scot free since she only controlled Alameda, and not entirely. Her crimes are probably minor and worth forgiving for he…

I think you grossly underestimate the amount of regulation Caroline is subject to. At the very least she will be deemed unfit or proper, which means she will be barred from any financial activity for the years to come. On top of that, as a MOO & RO she will be professionally and personally liable to millions in fines, and most likely jail time. Negligence _is_ a crime, a lack of means _is_ a crime, a lack of knowledg…

She was in charge a hedge fund. Hedge funds are allowed to trade badly and lose money. It happens all the time. There is a VERY high bar for negligence. Alameda Research was also located in the Bahamas. Did Alameda even have outside investors? It was basically SBF's family office. Caroline isn't likely to be liable for much unless she knowingly conspired to commit crimes.