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1Password 8 will be subscription only and won’t support local vaults

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Re: 1Password 8 will be subscription only and won’t support local vaults

#561

Between this and the Electron news, is Troy Hunt (haveibeenpwned creator) still going to endorse 1Password as his recommended password manager?

Well, it would be really strange if he didn't endorse his sponsor.[1] [1] https://www.troyhunt.com/have-i-been-pwned-is-now-partnering...

More recently, he also joined their board of advisors last year[1].

Have a TON of respect for the man, just a little surprised/disappointed these recent moves happened under his watch and would love to hear his unedited take on it all.

[1] https://www.troyhunt.com/ive-joined-the-1password-board-of-a...

Re: 1Password 8 will be subscription only and won’t support local vaults

#562

1Password used to be native on the Mac, and now it's an Electron app. I'm not going to be using 1Password for this reason, and I encourage you to do the same. Subscription business models and non-native apps are hallmarks of rot by VCs. Dump them!

I recently cancelled Evernote after 12 years of paying for it due to their new Electron client. I've been using 1Password since 2008 and I'll be doing the same thing. I have tolerated the UI regressions and even subscription with version 7, but Electron is just unacceptable for what was once an amazing Mac app that put Apple's apps to shame.

Similar here, I started using 1Password pretty early too. One of the main selling points for me: The nice, fast and native UI and the ability to keep my store local and sync it however I want.

The only wish I had over the years(and I would have gladly paid for an additional license): a linux client, even CLI would have been fine. I'm not sure which year they started, but what they pushed instead was the announcement of online sync and other things I did not care about, at some point it became hard to even find the regular version on their website.

This was when I slowly started moving to alternatives. With the move to electron and this anouncement here I'm happy that I moved away a few years ago and their clear signal that I am not the kind of customer they have any interest in anymore.

Re: 1Password 8 will be subscription only and won’t support local vaults

#563
post #365

Earlier quoted context omitted.

KeePass ( https://keepass.info/ ) with something like Nextcloud ( https://nextcloud.com/ ) or any other solution for syncing password databases across devices. Let's Encrypt SSL/TLS certificates are free, as is Apache/Nginx/Caddy to reverse proxy Nextcloud or any other solution (if a web based interface is needed). You might also need something like ngrok ( https://ngrok.com/ ) for publically accessing the instance i…

This reads like that notorious HN comment about it being trivially easy to roll your own Dropbox. Our time has value. Good UI has value. How much time is saved by just using a service like 1Password versus the design, setup, maintenance, and ongoing use of a system like you suggest with all those individual pieces?

For a moment I felt that perhaps I should add clarification about how I'm not trying to dismiss the cloud solutions (as in the notorious Dropbox comment), but instead am attempting to provide one of the many libre setups to answer the parent question, but in the end didn't get around to it.

My time probably isn't as valuable as that of the many people here (about 5x less earnings on average in Latvia when compared to places like US), therefore it definitely makes sense for me to upskill myself in any way possible, especially if I get usable software out of it.

But if you take the container based approach, there is almost no administration to be done:

  First, install Docker: https://docs.docker.com/engine/install/ubuntu/#installation-methods (about 10 minutes, varies by distro)
  Personally, i use Docker Swarm, but that's just a few more init commands and Docker Compose works as well: https://docs.docker.com/compose/install/ (about 5 minutes)
  Then, set up something like Caddy for a reverse proxy: https://hub.docker.com/_/caddy (probably 20 minutes)
  And then, set up Nextcloud: https://hub.docker.com/_/nextcloud (probably 20 minutes)
  Lastly, install KeePass from the previously mentioned links and put the password DB in the synced folder (probably 10 minutes)
  Ngrok, DNS challenges etc. might be necessary depending on the setup, but are not usually required for most regular VPSes.
  Backups and updates should also be taken care of, but full VPS backups are mostly standard and you can just bump the container tag every month.
As for the UI, i agree in principle, but not in this case. KeePass has good UI and I'd argue that you don't need a team of UI and UX developers to keep track of some usernames and passwords (and maybe certificate files).

Furthermore, I'd argue that most of the cloud offerings are actually problematic because not all of them let you download the data as files. In contrast, KeePass works with files (much like SQLite) and therefore, if you'd prefer to use SD cards or Samba or NFS or whatever instead of VPSes to somewhat decrease the attack surface, or simply use tools that you know, then you can do that. Want Syncthing instead of Nextcloud? Go ahead!

I'm putting emphasis on this because the line of thinking that we need web SaaS platforms for everything is dangerous - it makes you think that the problem is more complicated than it actually is. Whereas in reality some people probably get away with using password protected spreadsheets (don't do this). The problem is complicated only from a security perspective. That's it.

The cloud solutions excel at convenience and things like browser plugins and it's good that they're offering options for the less technically inclined folk, but they're far from the only option.

Re: 1Password 8 will be subscription only and won’t support local vaults

#564

I have the last non-subscription version on my Mac, PC and phone. They sync through Dropbox. The chrome extensions stopped working a few years ago so I got into the habit of just manually searching, cutting and pasting my passwords, and saving new ones. I don’t even think about it and it’s very easy. Paying $3/month to have it automatically populate the user name and password fields isn’t worth it for me, especially…

The main 1password extension for chrome stopped working with the standalone app, but the original extension is here under a different name: https://chrome.google.com/webstore/detail/1password-extensio...

I use it dozens of times a day and it works great. It's not as nice as the modern one that works with the subscription/hosted service but it'll certainly be better than what you're currently doing to muddle through.

Re: 1Password 8 will be subscription only and won’t support local vaults

#565

Earlier quoted context omitted.

so getting to know how to do things by yourself is a waste of time?

I know exactly how to do it, I've tried out what has been described above. I've got a lab for stuff I want to tinker with, but a password manager is seen as an "essential service" to me like e-mail and music. I'd much prefer to pay a bit per month and have a team of professionals deal with it if the servers go down. If at the end of the day my home server breaks and I want to get on and watch Amazon Prime/Netflix/wha…

That's a fair point! But depending on your setup, it's also possible to replicate the password database file to every single device of yours on the network.

Currently doing just that, if any of my servers go down, i can still access all of my passwords on my desktop, on my laptop, on my tablet, on my phone or on my backup servers. Of course, provided that i have KeePass or a mobile app installed and know the master password.

Oh and I do manual backups to SD cards just to be sure every month. I'm not sure how I'd do that with a cloud service where in a sense their entire company (and my network connection to it) is a single point of failure. If my internet connection goes down, how would I log in to my selfhosted software in my homelab over LAN, without being able to access the passwords?

Re: 1Password 8 will be subscription only and won’t support local vaults

#566

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I only have the iOS non-subscription version and am happy with it. Is this going away? It allows me to use the vault on all of my iOS devices and that’s sufficient.

It's not going away any time soon, the app is still available for MacOS and the browser extensions work just fine. Eventually they will stop supporting them but that'll just mean at some point in the future a MacOS/firefox/chrome update will break the existing app and they won't fix it. That might be 2 months from now or it might be 2+ years.

And once that happens, you may no longer be able to access your passwords.

Re: 1Password 8 will be subscription only and won’t support local vaults

#567
Well, f** 1Password then.

I am currently still using them, but once my current apps are no longer supported, whenever that might happen, I will move to another solution rather than paying a subscription for the privilege of storing my data with them.

Re: 1Password 8 will be subscription only and won’t support local vaults

#568
post #365

Earlier quoted context omitted.

KeePass ( https://keepass.info/ ) with something like Nextcloud ( https://nextcloud.com/ ) or any other solution for syncing password databases across devices. Let's Encrypt SSL/TLS certificates are free, as is Apache/Nginx/Caddy to reverse proxy Nextcloud or any other solution (if a web based interface is needed). You might also need something like ngrok ( https://ngrok.com/ ) for publically accessing the instance i…

This reads like that notorious HN comment about it being trivially easy to roll your own Dropbox. Our time has value. Good UI has value. How much time is saved by just using a service like 1Password versus the design, setup, maintenance, and ongoing use of a system like you suggest with all those individual pieces?

Except, you didn't need to roll your own. 1PW used to support Dropbox - it's how I still use it.

And specifically you only need the DB free tier to store a 1PW vault, so the only cost was paying for the 1PW client (which I am more than happy to pay for on major version updates, as long as it is not a subscription).

1PW removed functionality that existed, with goal (or at the very least the effect) of locking users into their own cloud platform with a new monthly bill.

Re: 1Password 8 will be subscription only and won’t support local vaults

#569
post #178

Also a stand-alone user since 1pw4. This news finally got me to try pass, the command-line utility. https://www.passwordstore.org/ The format is plain text. You can git control your password repo. You can organize into directories, etc. It has an extension architecture; you can have it generate otps, for example. You can have specific passwords unlock with more than 1 key, if you want to do eg. family or business sha…

I was reading through the comments wondering why so many technically capable people are paying for a password store service when passwordstore works nicely in the space and gives you some comfort in knowing how it works. I highly recommend pass. My set up is as follows: - setup the key, share the private key to other devices who are going to use the same pass store; - use syncthing to sync my passwords between device…

For me it’s more about trust. I’d rather trust a company with decades of experience this area than a bunch of random developers that published different unvetted apps on various app stores.

And technically, Syncthing doesn’t really seem viable on mobile last time I looked (and also has the problem of 3rd party apps instead of official ones).

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