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Brave launches 1.0

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Re: Brave launches 1.0

#561

Post by hinkley »

alwillis wrote: post #500
hinkley wrote: post #160

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You had me... > Brave ads show up as a notification in your operating system outside of the page. and then you lost me. Hitting people with notifications is an escalation of ad hostility, not a reduction.

Actually, it’s a reduction because the ads are in categories you are interested in, which is done on your machine via machine learning. Right now, you don’t have to interact with ads to get paid, though that may change in the future. It’s way less intrusive than pop-ups and full screen interstitials, which I hate. Disclaimer: I’ve been a Brave user/tester for a while. Edit: if you decide to opt-in, you decide how man…

But I don’t need to buy more stuff. I’ve already got that handled.

Re: Brave launches 1.0

#562

Post by dksf »

HeavyStorm wrote: post #494
aiyodev wrote: post #439

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The point a lot of people miss is that advertising doesn't just convince you buy new things. Many advertisements are designed to make you feel good about the products you already buy so you won't consider trying the alternatives. When you grab a bottle of dish soap off the shelf, do you select the same one each time because you prefer it for reasons you can't quite articulate or do you grab whatever's cheapest becaus…

I was about to disagree until I read your example. You're right - I buy a lot of stuff for reasons that aren't grounded in reason, and, although I usually relate to stuff such as "my Mom used to have this one at home when I was a kid", well, who knows if that's the actual reason or just some justification from my mind.

Think about the lifetime value the advertiser who influenced your mom is earning!

Re: Brave launches 1.0

#563

Post by denkmoon »

arghwhat wrote: post #334
cyborgx7 wrote: post #267

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I already decided my Ad participation. I block ads, and want the advertising industry to die. This does not seem like a value add to me.

Yes, this is a perfectly sensible stance, which of course requires you to actively pay for content instead, either through brave or some other program. I'm sure you're not just expecting content creators to make stuff for you full-time entirely for free. Ads should die, but it requires consumers to realize that they need to pay for content one way or another.

"Content creation" is oversaturated. I'm willing to pay for the content I consume, but it is evidently true that most people are not - and I don't blame them. Would you really pay for a Logan Paul video? Without ad revenue, many lowest common denominator content creators (and other parasitic scenarios like "instagram influencers") go away. I fail to see that as a bad thing.

Re: Brave launches 1.0

#564

Post by askafriend »

HeavyStorm wrote: post #494
aiyodev wrote: post #439

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The point a lot of people miss is that advertising doesn't just convince you buy new things. Many advertisements are designed to make you feel good about the products you already buy so you won't consider trying the alternatives. When you grab a bottle of dish soap off the shelf, do you select the same one each time because you prefer it for reasons you can't quite articulate or do you grab whatever's cheapest becaus…

I was about to disagree until I read your example. You're right - I buy a lot of stuff for reasons that aren't grounded in reason, and, although I usually relate to stuff such as "my Mom used to have this one at home when I was a kid", well, who knows if that's the actual reason or just some justification from my mind.

This is the realm most Car Ads fall under.

Their purpose isn't to randomly convince someone to spend $20-30k on a brand new vehicle.

The purpose is to convince people who've already bought the car that they made the right decision and to feel good about it - and to rave about their new exciting, big purchase to their friends/family.

Re: Brave launches 1.0

#565

Post by leftyted »

CameronBarre wrote: post #438
leftyted wrote: post #398

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> That really isn't an argument worth taking seriously. I think it is. I've used Google search, gmail, youtube, and Google docs since they've existed. I've paid $0 for them. My understanding is that these services are paid for by ads but I've had an ad blocker most of that time. If everyone started using an ad blocker, what would happen to Google/those services? I don't know, but I feel uneasy about the fact that ser…

>My understanding is that these services are paid for by ads but I've had an ad blocker most of that time. Google makes money by collecting behavioral data generated by its users, which it then uses in the form of raw materials to create products for its actual paying customers: advertisers. Whether you're using an ad-blocker or not, you're still contributing to the advertising machine by using its products, you can'…

Either way, indirectly or not, Google makes money from people looking at ads. What would happen to "advertisers" if everyone blocked ads? Would the whole industry collapse? It's hard for me to see how that wouldn't affect Google.

Re: Brave launches 1.0

#566

Post by wpietri »

deanCommie wrote: post #396
wpietri wrote: post #352

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That really isn't an argument worth taking seriously. Much of the web would be fine. Another chunk of it would have to shift more toward existing revenue sources. And some would have to develop new revenue sources. The only thing that would be particularly at risk is stuff funded exclusively with display ads, but where users don't care enough about it to support it. Or, put differently, we'd lose sites that people do…

> TV is doing better than ever as a medium. Why? Because a lot of us are now paying directly for the things we like. I think the same thing would happen with the web. What are you on about, TV is essentially dead as an over-the-air/cable-bundle medium. The only reason "TV" survived, is because it was reimagined by streaming services who charge a monthly fee. That model has certainly been going through a golden age, b…

That's an interesting fantasy, but I see no evidence that people will go from paying happily for content to refusing to pay for anything. People have been paying for video for a hundred years, and there's no reason to think the business will die now that technology has drastically decreased distribution costs, lowered production costs, and increased quality.

Re: Brave launches 1.0

#567

Post by wpietri »

leftyted wrote: post #398
wpietri wrote: post #352

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That really isn't an argument worth taking seriously. Much of the web would be fine. Another chunk of it would have to shift more toward existing revenue sources. And some would have to develop new revenue sources. The only thing that would be particularly at risk is stuff funded exclusively with display ads, but where users don't care enough about it to support it. Or, put differently, we'd lose sites that people do…

> That really isn't an argument worth taking seriously. I think it is. I've used Google search, gmail, youtube, and Google docs since they've existed. I've paid $0 for them. My understanding is that these services are paid for by ads but I've had an ad blocker most of that time. If everyone started using an ad blocker, what would happen to Google/those services? I don't know, but I feel uneasy about the fact that ser…

Yes, Brave's approach is interesting. No, there's no reason to think that Google will have a problem finding other ways to fund services that people like and use. They already charge people for Docs, Gmail, and YouTube. Search is funded by non-display ads, which most ad blockers don't bother with because their relevance means people like them.

Re: Brave launches 1.0

#568

Post by dang »

sneak wrote: post #376
BrendanEich wrote: post #226

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You turned on Brave Rewards at some point, it seems. If you want to tip and contribute anonymously but not get ads, just turn off ads (upper left of rewards settings).

Did you fix that issue yet where you were fraudulently claiming that you could receive tips for any content creator on the web but those sent to creators that hadn’t signed up went to Brave instead?

Please don't post in the flamewar style to HN. If people show up here to discuss their work and get harangued, what incentive do they have to show up at all? If we allow commenters to disincentivize that, HN will be less interesting and worse.

It's fine to ask a good-faith question or make a good-faith critique. It's not fine to cross-examine.

https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html

Re: Brave launches 1.0

#569

Post by onyva »

judah wrote: post #13

I've been using Brave rewards, both as a user and a content maker. It's really great, and I feel this may be a reasonable alternative to the invasive trackers+ads we have today. For the uninitiated, Brave lets users opt-in to Brave rewards: - You set your browser to reward content creators with Basic Attention Token (BAT). You set a budget (e.g. 10 BAT/month), and Brave distributes it the sites you use most, e.g. if…

if you care about privacy you’d be better off with Mozilla Firefox. Brave is just a Trojan horse for Eich’s ambition to replace google as an ad broker. With a meaningless market share it’s not likely but still, it’s important to know what Brave is about, and it’s not about the users.
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