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SAT to Add ‘Adversity Score’ That Rates Students’ Hardships

nytimes.com

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Re: SAT to Add ‘Adversity Score’ That Rates Students’ Hardships

#561

Post by kornsh3ll »

kaitai wrote: post #477
zasz wrote: post #405

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As a fellow Asian whose parents also sacrificed a lot, I'm sympathetic, but I would urge you to consider a couple things: 1. Like it or not, plenty of families in America have had it worse than you had, and would not find it at all impressive that you have never gone on a vacation or eaten out. 2. You should save your anger for the huge number of spots saved for legacies and athletes. Being the child of alumni means…

Lots of great points to consider here and I'll boost number (2). I'm struggling not to say something unforgivably cynical here.... .... ...so let's say this: getting the 4.8% of Americans who are of Asian descent to spend their time crapping on the 12.7% of Americans who are black, or even better spend extra time crapping on the 6% of college students who are black and at 'good' universities, is just wonderful for le…

It’s quite anti Semitic of you to attribute this to white & Jewish over-representation in universities.

Whites and Jews are successful in colleges because they come from cultures that value hard work. They deserve every spot that they get

Re: SAT to Add ‘Adversity Score’ That Rates Students’ Hardships

#562

Post by [deleted] »

Apocryphon wrote: post #535
aabajian wrote: post #522

I'll play devil's advocate. I went to a public high school that served a large area (it's Rim of the World High in Southern California in case anyone is curious). It's the only high school in the mountains, and services "poorer" areas like Crestline and "wealthier" areas like Lake Arrowhead. To my knowledge, I was one of the only honors kids from Crestline. My morning consisted of getting up at 5:30 am and taking a 4…

Through the college admissions essay

[deleted]

Re: SAT to Add ‘Adversity Score’ That Rates Students’ Hardships

#563

Post by spamizbad »

fiblye wrote: post #530
spamizbad wrote: post #511

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> And for private universities it's a big blow to the institution's reputations for all but the most objectionable speakers. Numerous private universities (Christian schools in particular) enforce strict student code of conduct rules that severely limit the student body's freedom of expression as to way to enforce religious or secular compliance. And it doesn't hurt their reputation but instead is an integral compone…

Let me preface by saying I disagree with everything you say, but I still think you have the right to say it. Universities are meant to be institutions of learning. Learning isn’t always comfortable. Some long held truths turn out to be wrong at some point. What we all think is true or right right now could completely reverse in a decade. Letting people speak especially when it’s against your morals is important for l…

I generally agree, but here's a concern I have:

The student body is going to have its own set of values, some of which may challenge the prevailing norms of society or the university itself. Should a university ignore, nurture, or challenge the views of its students? I feel like, as a student, you should be allowed to pick. Because depending on the issue, or the individual, the answer may change.

For example, at one time Gen-Xers and Millennials were significantly more tolerant of homosexuality than society overall (they still are, but society has largely come around). Did universities do them a disservice by either nurturing or ignoring these views, rather than intellectually challenging their pro-gay marriage views?

Re: SAT to Add ‘Adversity Score’ That Rates Students’ Hardships

#564

Post by [deleted] »

jachee wrote: post #188
remote_phone wrote: post #170

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I already talked to my wife about this. I would retire, we would divorce, and I would rent a shitty apartment in East Palo Alto all the while living in our house. If they think they can boil my kids into a single number without bothering to find the context of who my kids are then I will game it to as much as possible. I don’t know why my family should be punished because my wife and I worked our asses off to get ahe…

How is giving underprivileged people a leg up "punishing" anyone? Privileged people need to start recognizing their inherent pre-rigging of the system. For those in power, equality feels like oppression.

[deleted]

Re: SAT to Add ‘Adversity Score’ That Rates Students’ Hardships

#565

Post by [deleted] »

fuzz4lyfe wrote: post #165
rhegart wrote: post #131

Equality of opportunity over outcome for me. Now Asians will be discriminated against secretly. My family sacrificing vacations and eating out for 12 years (literally ate out 5x max) to afford to live in a good school district shouldn’t penalize us. My dad commuted 4 hours daily instead of moving...I’m getting pushed further and further to the right.

>I’m getting pushed further and further to the right. Maybe not, it feels like to me that the Overton window[0] has been sliding left. My views on freedom of speech made me a 'leftist commie' when I used them to defend South Park and Eminem now most often I'm accused being 'alt-right' by those who disagree with those same views. [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Overton_window

[deleted]

Re: SAT to Add ‘Adversity Score’ That Rates Students’ Hardships

#566

Post by rmah »

Apocryphon wrote: post #542
deogeo wrote: post #213

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> A poor asian community that sends their kids to after school schools and does very well as a whole will suddenly fight themselves without the boost that others at that economic level might have. They'll also be punished for having established a low-crime neighborhood and learning english, since crime level and english as second language are also factors in the adversity score. Of course, no single one of them is en…

Who's to say that their lower-income status doesn't out-weigh the other factors you're describing?

The student's family's income is not taken into account for the adversity score.

Re: SAT to Add ‘Adversity Score’ That Rates Students’ Hardships

#567

Post by ryanobjc »

remote_phone wrote: post #551
ryanobjc wrote: post #536

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So, some kids from crappy schools and neighborhoods will get into college, when they might not otherwise, presumably taking the place of you/your children, who have “made solid decisions” and “worked my ass off for 30 years” who deserve it more? Because you/they worked harder? Ok. Cool. Just want to make sure I understand.

People who work hard deserve the fruits of their labor, regardless of their economic status. I have no problems with economically disadvantaged hard working people getting into great colleges, I have problems with equally hardworking people being disadvantaged because their parents are successful.

Wouldn’t you agree that two people who achieve the same score on the test may not have worked equally hard? If someone scored the same as your child, except they didn’t have good security, good quality schools, parents that could help them, etc, I would say that they in fact worked much harder than your children.

And by the logic of “those who worked harder deserve it more”, well I think you see where this is going.

If anything this adversity score IS making things more fair because it’s providing light to the extra challenges someone might have had and thus who indeed worked harder at it.

Re: SAT to Add ‘Adversity Score’ That Rates Students’ Hardships

#569

Post by Apocryphon »

manfredo wrote: post #546
spamizbad wrote: post #532

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Some people don't even consider applicants from BYU, and other heavily religious universities because they don't want to reward such institutions. That's just religious discrimination cloaked in something less intolerable: academic elitism. HBCUs probably face a similar problem: should we abolish or enforce strict racial quotes on them because there are racists who will toss a resume with Howard University on it? >…

> That's just religious discrimination cloaked in something less intolerable: academic elitism. I don't necessarily agree with tossing such resumes in the garbage, but it is evidence that universities that enforce religious dogma on their students do suffer a hit to their reputation because of that. > how do you explain the strong performance (and reputation) of private institutions vs. "state schools"? Not every pri…

I think the both of you are conflating a multitude of separate topics. Private schools tend to have strong reputations because of legacy reputations, and wealthy alumni funding. Freedom of speech is unlikely to be related. Berkeley and Stanford are both examples of very famous schools with distinct (and sometimes contrasting) cultures. They do not necessarily correlate to supporting/not supporting freedom of speech. (Berkeley was home to a Free Speech Movement in the 1960s: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Free_Speech_Movement) Aggressive protest is part of the Cal student body culture, and the behavior of students is not reflective of the actual college administration's actions restricting or upholding free speech.
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