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Apple Engineers Its Own Downfall with the Macbook Pro Keyboard

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Re: Apple Engineers Its Own Downfall with the Macbook Pro Keyboard

#561

Post by [deleted] »

Arn_Thor wrote: post #211
acomjean wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think they'll gradually improve the keyboard. It won't be great but it will be good enough. like the "don't hold it that way" antenna gate problem and the phone bending problems.. They'll fix.. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IPhone_4#Antenna https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IPhone_6#Chassis_bending Honestly, its hard to get off the mac ecosystem though. I have a macbook pro, and am starting to look at linux laptops. Th…

As someone who'd been in the Mac ecosystem and paid the price in time and expense of leaving for a PC a few years back, I'm starting to lean back toward the Mac side. The amount of fiddling and headaches I'm dealing with on Windows is just a huge waste of time. Had to reinstall all my programs after a recent Windows update ruined the OS.

[deleted]

Re: Apple Engineers Its Own Downfall with the Macbook Pro Keyboard

#562

Post by coldtea »

nostalgeek wrote: post #552
coldtea wrote: post #521

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I honestly don't understand all these quality sacrifices just to make things thinner. It makes the product actually feel somewhat cheap and brittle. It's easy: every time people had the chance to buy thinner or thicker products, they flocked to the thinner ones. The complaints are random outliers around the internet, but the actual Apple's sales numbers (record years after record years and reduced sales for thicker…

> It's easy: every time people had the chance to buy thinner or thicker products, they flocked to the thinner ones. You'll need to back up that statement with factual sources, because clearly all Apple decisions aren't always backed by marketing studies because all their products are not always that successful. I personally don't believe what you just said. Counter example: bigger screens.

>You'll need to back up that statement with factual sources, because clearly all Apple decisions aren't always backed by marketing studies because all their products are not always that successful.

What marketing studies? I'm talking about marketing results. Their ever thinner laptops remained at the top of best selling laptops in their price class -- selling several times more than the closest competitor ever since Jobs came back to Apple in 1999.

Re: Apple Engineers Its Own Downfall with the Macbook Pro Keyboard

#563

Post by coldtea »

dsego wrote: post #539
coldtea wrote: post #521

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I honestly don't understand all these quality sacrifices just to make things thinner. It makes the product actually feel somewhat cheap and brittle. It's easy: every time people had the chance to buy thinner or thicker products, they flocked to the thinner ones. The complaints are random outliers around the internet, but the actual Apple's sales numbers (record years after record years and reduced sales for thicker…

Linus?

Yes

Re: Apple Engineers Its Own Downfall with the Macbook Pro Keyboard

#564

Post by coldtea »

jamespo wrote: post #534
coldtea wrote: post #521

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I honestly don't understand all these quality sacrifices just to make things thinner. It makes the product actually feel somewhat cheap and brittle. It's easy: every time people had the chance to buy thinner or thicker products, they flocked to the thinner ones. The complaints are random outliers around the internet, but the actual Apple's sales numbers (record years after record years and reduced sales for thicker…

Linus Torvalds?

Yes

Re: Apple Engineers Its Own Downfall with the Macbook Pro Keyboard

#565

Post by coldtea »

throwaway2048 wrote: post #551
coldtea wrote: post #521

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I honestly don't understand all these quality sacrifices just to make things thinner. It makes the product actually feel somewhat cheap and brittle. It's easy: every time people had the chance to buy thinner or thicker products, they flocked to the thinner ones. The complaints are random outliers around the internet, but the actual Apple's sales numbers (record years after record years and reduced sales for thicker…

you are confusing coincidence with causation, there is no evidence that apples record sales numbers (which seem to be at an end anyhow) have much to do with making things thinner to the point of fragility.

It doesn't have to "do with it". It's enough that "it" didn't cause any backslash, and instead we've seen ever raised sales volumes...

Re: Apple Engineers Its Own Downfall with the Macbook Pro Keyboard

#566

Post by j45 »

microtonal wrote: post #426
paulriddle wrote: post #390

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I am currently using this horrible keyboard. Hate this thing. Before I've been using a mechanical keyboard, but coworkers complained that it was too loud. I like loud keybords. The sound is so pleasant and satisfying I want it to be even more intense. I want to feel vibration every time I hit the key. And when I hit enter I want there to be a minor earthquake. This apple trash keyboard doesn't have Shift+Insert. The…

The Microsoft Sculpt Ergonomic Keyboard does not have loud switches, but feels much better than the Magic Keyboard. Only the function keys are not great.

+1, the sculpt keyboard and even mouse are my daily drivers at both desks and very well priced.

After a quick key remap on MacOS and a bit of muscle memory adjustment on finger placement that was well with it, my typing speed hasn't suffered and hands are happy. I do wish MS made Mac drivers. No Mac keyboard can hold a candle to this kbd.

I tried the my much more expensive kinesis freestyle with the trimmings - it was nice but too slow to type on because of the keys.

The dream keyboard would be a MS sculpt cut in half like a kinesis freestyle 3, maybe with apple keys that work, and wireless halves.

Re: Apple Engineers Its Own Downfall with the Macbook Pro Keyboard

#567

Post by nostalgeek »

coldtea wrote: post #562
nostalgeek wrote: post #552

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> It's easy: every time people had the chance to buy thinner or thicker products, they flocked to the thinner ones. You'll need to back up that statement with factual sources, because clearly all Apple decisions aren't always backed by marketing studies because all their products are not always that successful. I personally don't believe what you just said. Counter example: bigger screens.

> You'll need to back up that statement with factual sources, because clearly all Apple decisions aren't always backed by marketing studies because all their products are not always that successful. What marketing studies? I'm talking about marketing results. Their ever thinner laptops remained at the top of best selling laptops in their price class -- selling several times more than the closest competitor ever since…

> What marketing studies? I'm talking about marketing results. Their ever thinner laptops remained at the top of best selling laptops in their price class -- selling several times more than the closest competitor ever since Jobs came back to Apple in 1999.

we're talking about phones here, not laptops and correlation is not causation, you didn't demonstrate what you state as a fact.

Re: Apple Engineers Its Own Downfall with the Macbook Pro Keyboard

#568

Post by giancarlostoro »

rbanffy wrote: post #506
microtonal wrote: post #426

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The Microsoft Sculpt Ergonomic Keyboard does not have loud switches, but feels much better than the Magic Keyboard. Only the function keys are not great.

The ergonomic/natural/arc keyboards are, by far, the best products Microsoft ever sold. I do love the Apple trackpads, however. There is no better way to work on a Mac. As for my Linuxing, I have a Unicomp "Battleship" (PC122 keyboard) that's loud as hell, but has the best feel since the beam spring keyboards God added to the IBM 3270's when it made them in the 6th day.

Trackball is way better than any trackpad for me. I have three Microsoft Ergonomic keyboards. Two of the Surface ones and one of their cheaper ones which is about $20 at a BestBuy.

Re: Apple Engineers Its Own Downfall with the Macbook Pro Keyboard

#569

Post by bitofhope »

seanwilson wrote: post #411
tracer4201 wrote: post #342

I honestly don't understand all these quality sacrifices just to make things thinner. It makes the product actually feel somewhat cheap and brittle. The same thing confuses me with smartphones. Everyone keeps making these bacteria and finger print magnets thinner... the minute you drop it, it's shattered or unuseable... and so then you're buying a case to protect it from scratches and shatter... so what's the point o…

> I honestly don't understand all these quality sacrifices just to make things thinner. It makes the product actually feel somewhat cheap and brittle. I never understood this. I read often in reviews about how the weight of something makes it feel more expensive and "premium". For something you're carrying around all the time, you want it to be light and manufacturing something light is usually going to be more expen…

Do I want it to be light? Sure, I wouldn't want to carry a brick of tungsten with me, but something the weight of two or three iPhones isn't much of an encumbrance even to people much physically weaker than me.

Re: Apple Engineers Its Own Downfall with the Macbook Pro Keyboard

#570

Post by tjoff »

coldtea wrote: post #521
tracer4201 wrote: post #342

I honestly don't understand all these quality sacrifices just to make things thinner. It makes the product actually feel somewhat cheap and brittle. The same thing confuses me with smartphones. Everyone keeps making these bacteria and finger print magnets thinner... the minute you drop it, it's shattered or unuseable... and so then you're buying a case to protect it from scratches and shatter... so what's the point o…

> I honestly don't understand all these quality sacrifices just to make things thinner. It makes the product actually feel somewhat cheap and brittle. It's easy: every time people had the chance to buy thinner or thicker products, they flocked to the thinner ones. The complaints are random outliers around the internet, but the actual Apple's sales numbers (record years after record years and reduced sales for thicker…

"Not just some "vacuous" "non-technie" users either (as the stereotype says)."

Actually, Linus comes off to me as particularly non-techie. He obviously cares about it enough to get the work done but couldn't care about it more than that. Not even the OS (outside of the kernel) is of any interest to him (dissing debian because he thinks the installer is too cumbersome etc.).

Compare the MacBook Air with the lenovo x-series at the time and it's quite hard to see what the air actually brought to the market except for first in class non-replaceable batteries and few external ports.

You've always been able to get silent computers, but Linus doesn't have the interest to research them.

Nothing wrong with that, but very "non-techie".

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