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The 'papers, please' era of the internet will decimate your privacy

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Re: The 'papers, please' era of the internet will decimate your privacy

#551

Post by wartywhoa23 »

monssooon wrote: post #481
vlian2088 wrote: post #332

Earlier quoted context omitted.

only for a short while longer. US, EU, China, and Russia are all on the same page about you-vill-ovn-nothing-und-you-vill-be-happy kind of future, and they will bully the rest of the world into compliance.

It is such a sick idea. But i cant really figurer out if they want to force this on us or they just anticipate that type of poverty will become normal for the new "middle class" and they want to make everyone accept it with some "crisis argumentation".

> if they want to force this... or they want to make everyone accept it with some "crisis argumentation".

False dichotomy, both parts are equivalent.

Re: The 'papers, please' era of the internet will decimate your privacy

#552

Post by edot »

ike2792 wrote: post #547

While obviously requiring real-world ID verification will reduce privacy, is there really any actual privacy left on today's internet? Every company from your ISP to Google to every vendor you shop at can read your browser fingerprint and IP address, which in most cases is enough to uniquely identify you. For serious privacy-concerned users there are ways around all of this but the vast majority of internet users don…

If everyone else jumps off a bridge, do you want to be forced to jump off a bridge?

Re: The 'papers, please' era of the internet will decimate your privacy

#553

Post by pastel8739 »

Epa095 wrote: post #320
pastel8739 wrote: post #202

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This doesn’t stop the scheme the parent proposes, where adults install some proxy on their device and challenges are responded to on the parent device. Then the private key never leaves the parent device and all the child device has is the proxy software, which could be set up to not log any identifier of the key that it used

I agree, but this is also clearly a increased barrier. Going back to OPs comment that perfection is impossible, the goal is to raise the bar, I would say that this is more than good enough.

Sure, but the comment I am responding to is arguing that there is a way around pressures towards a traceable token, so you can prosecute the person sharing their credentials. This is not the case.

Re: The 'papers, please' era of the internet will decimate your privacy

#554

Post by wartywhoa23 »

monssooon wrote: post #483
Tangurena2 wrote: post #425

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No. Tor does most of this and the number of users is trivial.

Could tor become forbidden?

Sure. It's completely unreachable in Russia without some other tunnel to reach Tor network.

Re: The 'papers, please' era of the internet will decimate your privacy

#555

Post by thomastjeffery »

andrewla wrote: post #68
j2kun wrote: post #21

There are at least some technological solutions here, such as anonymous credentials. [1] Modern versions of this technique allow one to associate metadata (like a proof of age exceeding a threshold) in such a way that the verifier can't even correlate repeated requests across users. Governments that are serious about age verification and individual privacy (which, doubtful they truly are) should agree on a protocol a…

The article talks about the possibilities of malicious cloning of these tokens by third parties, but fails to identify the much more common use case, and one that makes this scheme useless for age verification. It's one thing to be concerned about someone stealing my credential, but another to prevent the transfer of these credentials, especially if they are limited use credentials. The entire point of age verificati…

Even more significant than the means are the ends. Why does my government get to decide what is appropriate for children?

This sounds a lot like what governance is supposed to be, but there is a critical difference. It's one thing for our society to agree generally on categories that are inappropriate for children, to encode those into law, and to enforce those laws. The difference is, enforce to whom?

Children are victims, not perpetrators. Age verification restates a child's role as perpetrator. This is the premise that I find unacceptable.

Re: The 'papers, please' era of the internet will decimate your privacy

#556

Post by wartywhoa23 »

flenserboy wrote: post #117

There will be your internet-connected computer which will be assumed to be compromised, & which little, if anything of use will be kept on, & then there will be the airgapped system you do work on, which will probably be the last trusted version of a Linux distro you have multiple copies stashed away of. It will be a very old-fashioned experience, & moving/sharing data will become a dicey business.

An airgapped system to be used just outside of the FOV of the government thin client's camera, with a hair glued to the power button to detect covert physical intrusions in the owner's absence.

In which book did I encounter a similar setup? Let me recall..

Re: The 'papers, please' era of the internet will decimate your privacy

#558

Post by wolvoleo »

izacus wrote: post #533
wolvoleo wrote: post #222

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah. Didn't you find your dad's dirty VHS tapes when you were young? I'm sure most of us did. And we turned out fine. And no, porn isn't more extreme these days either. I remember seeing bukkake, golden showers etc on borrowed tapes and hacked pay TV. BDSM existed back then too. And I had some pics of a girls face surrounded by male members and their output. Never once did I think this would be a normal thing to do…

> Yeah. Didn't you find your dad's dirty VHS tapes when you were young? I'm sure most of us did. And we turned out fine. Were they delivered to you in truckload volumes every day, including tapes recording executions, child molestation, foreign political propaganda, domestic political propaganda and misleading advertisements? Every day, any day, unlimited quantities? Including giving your phone number to any stranger…

Kids won't see these things unless they go looking for them and most of those things will not be under age verification anyway. And misleading advertisement has been a thing of forever and it's not going to go away becasuse too many rich people make money off it.

This is really a matter of parents not giving their kids devices to access the internet until they are ready for what is there.

And I've never seen executions or child molestations in my life. It's not like this is so easy to come across.

Also I'm not a millennial.

Re: The 'papers, please' era of the internet will decimate your privacy

#559

Post by wartywhoa23 »

sscaryterry wrote: post #10

This just legitimises the existing practices. They already know who you are.

Hilarious.

So if they know, then why all the fuss and the the need to enforce ID on the Internet? Just for the heck's sake?

Ah, that's for legitimization. In other words, "by producing your digital ID, you herein fully acknowledge the fact that you're a slave to the system in which all we knew about you illegaly, is now known legally"?

Re: The 'papers, please' era of the internet will decimate your privacy

#560

Post by KaiserPro »

sethammons wrote: post #383
KaiserPro wrote: post #371

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> That's not the problem governments are solving. They're solving the problem of convincing the public it's a good idea to end the anonymity of internet use. I'm really sorry, but that's giving politicians far to much credit for being able to plan ahead. Look at both the UK and the USA. The UK's just yeeted its PM because he had the personality of a block of cheese. The USA is currently inches away from shooting peop…

> its about who can track you and why. I'd much rather a list of times I access a site that required age verification being stored by the government, than every single fucking page I looked at tracked by google/meta. It is about what abuses can happen from that info. Google could sell your data. The government can imprison you. You don't think Trump wouldn't try to collect info on his opponents and weaponize the DOJ…

> You don't think Trump wouldn't try to collect info on his opponents and weaponize the DOJ against them?

He already is, and if he really wants, can compel google et al to pony up the data. But thats an argument against big tech, rather than age gating.

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