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Bun support is now limited and deprecated

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Re: Bun support is now limited and deprecated

#551

Post by illiac786 »

maxloh wrote: post #12

I understand their decision. How could the maintainers understand their codebase if most of it was not directly written by them? It is impossible to review the entire rewritten codebase. There are just too many lines of code, 1 million lines to be exact [1]. [1]: https://github.com/oven-sh/bun/pull/30412

How much of the windows code has been written by its current maintainers? Little.

I feel this argument is not valid, especially for large code bases.

Documentation and code quality is what is important, not who wrote the code.

Re: Bun support is now limited and deprecated

#552

Post by xeonmc »

sinpif wrote: post #535
thatxliner wrote: post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

it's funny how the readme still says "written in Zig"

Maybe it should say "designed in Zig" because most of the work & thinking was done using that language. The rewrite has no such history.

Is that the new "Designed by Apple in California" equivalent of "Made in China" euphemism but for vibecodes?

Re: Bun support is now limited and deprecated

#554

Post by hurfdurf »

5G_activated wrote: post #190

Who was actually using yt-dlp with bun? The primary use is to solve JavaScript challenges sent by YouTube, which uses Deno by default. To be fair, I'm not quite sure why it would prefer either Deno or Bun when it's far more likely that a user has Node on their system.

https://github.com/yt-dlp/yt-dlp/wiki/EJS

Read the "Notes" sections for details.

Re: Bun support is now limited and deprecated

#555

Post by literalAardvark »

gryn wrote: post #268
eddythompson80 wrote: post #144

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Pretty normal in many corporate cultures especially ones with high turnover. You get assigned to a team that's "maintaining" a 10 year old code base with few million LoC. The most senior person on the team has been there for a year or 2 and it's just business as usual. You don't know what those 1M+ lines are doing. No one does. It's not a passion of anyone to work on it. You just get a bunch of requirements handed to…

> It doesn't really matter. It does matter, that's why those people quit because it's such a shitshow, progress happens at a glacial pace, more and more defects and slowdowns keep being created even if they have a big QA department/teams and the users are probably trapped because the software is the only thing in town, the bosses are the ones that makes the purchase decisions, or the it comes attached to big and/or e…

People quit because maintenance is an unsexy job with poor career prospects.

The code base itself has never and will never matter in the big picture

Re: Bun support is now limited and deprecated

#556

Post by usef- »

soraminazuki wrote: post #542
usef- wrote: post #454

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Has the team announced that they're breaking backwards compatibility, or that testing will be reduced?

No, the team mislead people by claiming the rewrite was experimental only to merge 1M lines of unreviewed code merely days later. Responsible software developers don't operate on blind trust, and both the Bun code and the maintainers are highly unpredictable at this point. That's more than sufficient technical grounds to drop an optional and replaceable dependency, especially since there are no user-facing consequenc…

Who did they mislead? A few days later it was no longer experimental and it became the main dev branch as they decided it would be the way forward for development (see the blog post on why). No stable release has been declared yet.

Here was the Bun team's message on merge:

> It passes Bun's pre-existing test suite on all platforms (and fixes several memory leaks and flaky tests), the binary size shrinks by 3 MB - 8 MB, the benchmarks are between neutral and faster - and most importantly, we now have compiler-assisted tools for catching & preventing memory bugs, which have costed the team an enormous amount of development & debugging time over the years.

>

> The codebase is otherwise largely the same. The same architecture, the same data structures. Bun still uses few 3rd party libraries. No async rust.

Re: Bun support is now limited and deprecated

#557

Post by bhaak »

doug_durham wrote: post #466
oytis wrote: post #198

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How can you claim following SWE best practices if couldn't realistically even have read the code?

So transcoding doesn't work unless every line of code is read? That's not how transcoding is done in practice.

But the code that does the transcoding has been read.

Somebody needs to have read deterministic code to even have a chance of noticing something being wrong.

This has not happened here.

Re: Bun support is now limited and deprecated

#558

Post by jabavagauha »

solenoid0937 wrote: post #483
gkfasdfasdf wrote: post #406

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes, it’s actually similar to discriminating based on race or religion, in the sense that it’s an arbitrary, meaningless criterion to discriminate on. If the Rust Bun port is better in every measurable way — passes all tests, has the same performance or better, and fixes existing bugs — then who cares what language it’s written in or how it was implemented? The point is that it’s higher quality. If you don’t trust th…

[flagged]

What about people who view AI as a useful tool, and use it daily while still recognizing it’s limitations?

I’m no AI hater, but there’s a limit to how much trust I give it and the Bun rewrite is well beyond that limit.

Re: Bun support is now limited and deprecated

#559

Post by jabavagauha »

KingMob wrote: post #540
wiseowise wrote: post #489

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Anyone who isn’t supporting using runtime rewritten by an LLM is obviously “doesn’t get it” and a luddite.

But in this case, the yt-dlp maintainers didn't actually evaluate the rewrite yet, they just declared they wouldn't support it, sight unseen. Not really an argument on its merits.

That’s the fun part no one has evaluated the rewrite yet! Not even the bun team!

Claude says it’s all good though so what could go wrong

Re: Bun support is now limited and deprecated

#560

Post by kibwen »

cybercatgurrl wrote: post #530
kibwen wrote: post #355

Earlier quoted context omitted.

People addicted to chatbots appear to be suffering from cognitive atrophy.

insult people you disagree with. smart approach

To merely disagree with someone first requires one to acknowledge the legitimacy of their capacity for logical reasoning. Rather, what I'm doing here is outright dismissing someone who isn't worth disagreeing with. There is no law of the universe that says that I am morally obliged to waste my energy taking seriously the arguments of fools.
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