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ATMs didn’t kill bank teller jobs, but the iPhone did

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Re: ATMs didn’t kill bank teller jobs, but the iPhone did

#551

Post by 9rx »

awesome_dude wrote: post #550
9rx wrote: post #547

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Remember, when it comes to government — at least a democratic one — the people complaining are also the leadership. Think about it from their perspective: - If they do a good job with leadership, only one team will be necessary. Anything else is truly a waste. - If they do a poor job with leadership, every team will fail. Any more than one is also truly a waste[1]. The latter is the most likely outcome, of course. No…

If all people complaining are the leadership - then so are all the customers (potential, or otherwise) The repeated movement of the goalposts here is only evidence of the no real scotsmen strategy being employed.

> If all people complaining are the leadership - then so are all the customers

Not necessarily. Unless you think a global democratic government formed overnight?

> The repeated movement of the goalposts here

Whatever it is you are reading in other threads has no relevance to this one.

Re: ATMs didn’t kill bank teller jobs, but the iPhone did

#552

Post by radlad »

ludston wrote: post #375
somerandomqaguy wrote: post #368

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Disagree, we do have the Bach's and Rachmanioff's today: John Williams, Jerry Goldsmith, Bear McCreary, Yuki Kajiura, Hans Zimmer, and probably a slew I'm not even aware of today. We're in the greatest era of symphonies IMO, it's just that they're hiding in surprising places; movies, TV shows, games, etc.

I don't think we can know whether or not this is the case in our own lifetimes, because we are so immersed in popular culture that we can't be objective about it. Enough of our historical great composers weren't venerated until after their deaths, and to describe composers as "hiding" within the most popular media of our era is a great disservice to the many composers that don't have the fame, connections and reputat…

Do you think that composers of the past did not also face real-world constraints?

Re: ATMs didn’t kill bank teller jobs, but the iPhone did

#553

Post by giancarlostoro »

Steppphennn wrote: post #534
giancarlostoro wrote: post #497

Earlier quoted context omitted.

American Express savings has no physical branches. Heck its not unique to them, there's other banks with no physical branches.

Cash App is probably the biggest. I was surprised how many gen z people I talked to say they use cash app for everything from direct deposit to their tax returns.

That's quite crazy to hear about tax returns.

Re: ATMs didn’t kill bank teller jobs, but the iPhone did

#554

Post by kurthr »

skybrian wrote: post #311
kurthr wrote: post #305

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You're implying that insurance companies will allow prices to fall and lower their profits. That seems like a really unlikely event in the current economy. They fire a lot of doctors and nurses, but they won't lower prices.

The ACA requires 80-85% of health insurance to go toward medical care (medical loss ratio). The way they work around that is to figure out how to charge more for medical care.

Exactly my point.

Re: ATMs didn’t kill bank teller jobs, but the iPhone did

#555

Post by awesome_dude »

9rx wrote: post #551
awesome_dude wrote: post #550

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If all people complaining are the leadership - then so are all the customers (potential, or otherwise) The repeated movement of the goalposts here is only evidence of the no real scotsmen strategy being employed.

> If all people complaining are the leadership - then so are all the customers Not necessarily. Unless you think a global democratic government formed overnight? > The repeated movement of the goalposts here Whatever it is you are reading in other threads has no relevance to this one.

> Not necessarily. Unless you think a global democratic government formed overnight?

This is a distraction. Whether it's 300 million voters or 300 million iPhone users, both groups act as the ultimate arbiter of value. If a customer stops paying, the "leadership" of a company fails. If a voter stops voting for one party, or the other, the "leadership" of a state fails. The mechanical result on the "seven teams" is identical: the unsuccessful ones are defunded.

Further, this proves the detachment from reality you are bringing to the conversation - everybody in the private sector knows the golden rule - your customers ARE your employers

THEY dictate what they will pay for, and therefore what can be sold (unless you are a fan of monopolies forcing people to buy things they do not want to)

> Whatever it is you are reading in other threads has no relevance to this one.

Your dishonesty only highlights your bad faith, and as such we are done here.

Re: ATMs didn’t kill bank teller jobs, but the iPhone did

#556

Post by bigtex88 »

hackyhacky wrote: post #147
pixelatedindex wrote: post #138

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Long-term, they will need none. I believe that software will be made obsolete by AI. I think this is a bit hyperbolic. Someone still needs to review and test the code, and if the code is for embedded systems I find it unlikely. For SaaS platforms you’ll see a dramatic reduction, maybe like 80% but it’ll still have a handful of devs. Factories didn’t completely eliminate assembly line workers, you just need a far fe…

> Someone still needs to review and test the code, and if the code is for embedded systems I find it unlikely. I feel like you didn't understand my comment. I am predicting that there is no code to review. You simply ask the AI to do stuff and it does it. Today, for example, you can ask ChatGPT to play chess with you, and it will. You don't need a "chess program," all the rules are built in to the LLM. Same goes for…

So even in your example you still need to have someone to ask the AI to play chess. So there will still be a need for someone somewhere to ask the AI to do something and supervise it or guide it in the right direction.

Re: ATMs didn’t kill bank teller jobs, but the iPhone did

#557

Post by 9rx »

awesome_dude wrote: post #555
9rx wrote: post #551

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> If all people complaining are the leadership - then so are all the customers Not necessarily. Unless you think a global democratic government formed overnight? > The repeated movement of the goalposts here Whatever it is you are reading in other threads has no relevance to this one.

> Not necessarily. Unless you think a global democratic government formed overnight? This is a distraction. Whether it's 300 million voters or 300 million iPhone users, both groups act as the ultimate arbiter of value. If a customer stops paying, the "leadership" of a company fails. If a voter stops voting for one party, or the other, the "leadership" of a state fails. The mechanical result on the "seven teams" is id…

> If a voter stops voting for one party, or the other, the "leadership" of a state fails.

Political parties in democracy are quite literally labor unions. The people in them do not independently lead the state, they are merely employees, hired by the leadership. You know, that's what you host elections for — to choose which employee you want to hire from the set of candidates who want the job. They may act as sub-leaders within the capacity of their job, but they are not the top leaders we are talking about. "Leadership" here was never intended to be about "middle managers".

That seems pretty obvious, but perhaps this confusion is the source of your misunderstandings?

> and as such we are done here.

Done with what? Thinking other threads are related this one? That is a good idea.

Re: ATMs didn’t kill bank teller jobs, but the iPhone did

#558

Post by CamperBob2 »

babypuncher wrote: post #277
CamperBob2 wrote: post #269

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Technological progress that hurts more people than it helps isn't progress, it's class warfare. We've never seen such a thing before, so I don't know how you can draw such sweeping conclusions about it.

The longer we ignore the collapse of the middle class, the angrier the bottom half of the economy will get and the more justified they will feel in enacting retribution. We absolutely have historical precedents for what happens here: The French Revolution, the Gilded Age, etc. People will only tolerate a declining standard of living for so long.

Maybe so, maybe not, but you are trying to argue two completely different points here.

Re: ATMs didn’t kill bank teller jobs, but the iPhone did

#559

Post by thegrimmest »

idiotsecant wrote: post #508
thegrimmest wrote: post #284

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Who ever said you have the right to a decent a secure life? People don’t universally agree about this. Some of us posit that we will never escape a state of competition for fundamentally scarce resources. And that the organizing principle of a free society should be peaceful coexistence, not mandatory cooperation. You figure out your own economic security, I’ll manage mine.

There are already enough resources that nobody should live in abject insecurity and poverty. Your position is fundamentally morally abhorrent to me. You're saying that your ability to take a little bit more for yourself is more important than a child not having polio, a mother feeding her child, a village having clean water. You are, in short, a tiny little microcosm of why humanity is doomed as a species.

I’m not saying that at all. I’m saying that my right to choose which children I help is more legitimate than your right to dictate to me. That the voluntary nature of our cooperation is more important than equality of resource distribution.

Re: ATMs didn’t kill bank teller jobs, but the iPhone did

#560

Post by thegrimmest »

idiotsecant wrote: post #513
thegrimmest wrote: post #289

Earlier quoted context omitted.

For something to be deserved, it must be earned. What do these people do to distinguish themselves from The Engineer’s pets? If they are wholly dependant on him for their subsistence, what distinguishes him from their god? To derive an alternate system you need alternate axioms. The axioms of our liberal society are moral equality and peaceful coexistence. Among such equals, no one person, group, or majority has the…

Hey, dude. How does someone earn value once automation does all the work? Earning the right to a share of the resources when resources are derived from automated labor is such a thoroughly pathological concept that I'm not sure we're communicating on the same planet.

Same way everyone has earned value from the beginning of time: negotiate with others. We are all born naked and without possessions. Everything we get, from the first day of our birth, is given to us by someone else. Our very first negotiations are simple, we are in turns endearing and annoying. As we grow older they become more complex. All I’m saying is that these interactions should be maximally voluntary and nonviolent.
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