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The TSA's New $45 Fee to Fly Without ID Is Illegal

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Re: The TSA's New $45 Fee to Fly Without ID Is Illegal

#551

Post by 542354234235 »

Fhch6HQ wrote: post #242
ehasbrouck wrote: post #202

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As of the imposition of start of this new fee/fine, about 200,000 people a day fly without ID or without REAL-ID: https://papersplease.org/wp/2025/05/28/200000-people-a-day-f... - At $45 a pop, that would bring in >$3B a year. "A billion here, a billion there, and pretty soon you're talking about real money."

That's a really disappointing source. The headline is '200,000 people a day fly without REAL-ID', which starts out quite interesting. It then goes on to explain that the TSA has reported 93% of traveler's complied with REAL ID, citing a TSA blog from a week prior which in fact states the same. They then take this and couple it with a single day, which they state was the busiest travel day of the Memorial Day weekend,…

So, 1 to 2 billion dollars, depending on how many round trips are above or below 10 days. You're right, I thought this was real money, like 3 billion. But 1 to 2 billion? You find that between the couch cushions every week. I'm so glad people like you are out there debunking these ridiculous claims.

Re: The TSA's New $45 Fee to Fly Without ID Is Illegal

#552

Post by ben_w »

pjc50 wrote: post #504
OkayPhysicist wrote: post #121

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's a deep-seated cultural paranoia that the federal government is out to get us. Initially, the US tried to be a confederation like the EU or Canada, but it turned out that we needed slightly more federal power than that to stay as a unified country. But the tension between "loose coalition of independent states" and "unified government that grants some powers to the states" is a pretty fundamental theme throughout…

> deep-seated cultural paranoia that the federal government is out to get us. And yet when the Federal government deploys paramilitaries to a city to do sweeps of everybody who isn't carrying papers, while also using 2nd-amendment lawful carry as a pretext to murder someone, those same people are very quiet.

I've been noticing the same category of oddity for a while now.

Bill Gates and a poorly thought out brainfart about vaccine microchips becoming a conspiracy, vs. Musk and an explicit plan with a funded company to make brain-computer interfaces to merge humans an AI met with barely a peep.

Government spying on all of us was an awful dystopian nightmare right up until Snowden showed us they already had been.

Conspiracy theorists claiming contrails changing the climate, but the actual climate change from the invisible CO2 etc. of the same planes being dismissed as if it were the conspiracy.

Or the one about 5G sending mind-control signals, ignoring the real mind-control (such as it is) coming from accessing social media on your phone… via 5G.

I was about to wonder what pizzagate would turn out to be, then I remembered the Andrew formerly known as Prince and specifically the attempt at using Pizza Express as an alibi.

At this point, given what we've witnessed from them regarding injecting bleach and so on, I wouldn't be surprised if someone in the Trump administration will turn out to have done the conspiracy-theory version of adrenochrome even though it has been produced by organic synthesis since at least 1952. And if they are, it will be brushed aside.

Re: The TSA's New $45 Fee to Fly Without ID Is Illegal

#553

Post by xxs »

542354234235 wrote: post #545
noduerme wrote: post #332

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As a white guy who was caught accidentally carrying a large knife once through security, at the bottom of a carry-on backpack I'd had since high school, I don't think it's in any way essential to use racial or ethnic markers to figure out whether someone is taking something dangerous onto a plane. I didn't even know I was trying to bring a knife onto a plane at a regional airport. There's no reason to think that Sikh…

Interesting that none of these comments seem to be questioning why we can’t just carry a small pocketknife on the plane. We used to be able to before 9/11. The 9/11 hijackings only worked because the policy was comply, land, and let the negotiators do their work. Suicide attacks using commercial airlines just wasn’t a thing. We now have armored locking cockpit doors and no airplane would give up control to hijackers…

it's still allowed across the EU (Mostly all of it)- up to 6cm blades are permitted in the cabin luggage.

Re: The TSA's New $45 Fee to Fly Without ID Is Illegal

#554

Post by almosthere »

intermerda wrote: post #325
rayiner wrote: post #125

Saying that there is “no legal requirement to show an ID” is truthy but misleading. Federal law gives the TSA authority over “screening” passengers: https://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/49/44901 (“The Administrator of the Transportation Security Administration shall provide for the screening of all passengers and property, including United States mail, cargo, carry-on and checked baggage, and other articles, that…

You seem to be under the impression that the word "screening" means TSA can do whatever it wants. When in fact, if you click on the link under the word "Screening" in the own link you posted, there is a definition provided. > (4) Screening defined .— In this subsection the term “screening” means a physical examination or non-intrusive methods of assessing whether cargo poses a threat to transportation security. You s…

And reading further...The Administrator may approve additional methods to ensure that the cargo does not pose a threat to transportation security and to assist in meeting the requirements of this subsection.

You clipped the first part while the definition was a lot longer including the above TSA can do anything they want escape hatch. Have a good day sir.

Re: The TSA's New $45 Fee to Fly Without ID Is Illegal

#555

Post by expedition32 »

pjc50 wrote: post #501
keeda wrote: post #358

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The TSA was NEVER about security. It was designed as a jobs program and make it look like we were doing something for security. To a great extent, it is security, even if it's mostly security theater, in the sense that it is security theater that people want . A large portion, maybe even the majority, of travelers simply won't feel safe without it. I've had and overheard multiple conversations at the airport where…

The problem with allowing "feels unsafe" to drive policy is that you get this: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=46866201 ; a lot of Americans (and other nationalities) get that "feels unsafe" feeling when they see a visible minority. Or a Muslim. Or someone who isn't a Muslim but (like a Sikh!) is from the same hemisphere as the Middle East. You get one set of people's rights compromised to salve the feelings of…

[flagged]

Re: The TSA's New $45 Fee to Fly Without ID Is Illegal

#556

Post by gcanyon »

paxys wrote: post #23

It's hilarious how transparent a money grab this entire thing is. "You need to show a Real ID for security, otherwise how do we know you won't hijack the plane?" "Well I don't have a Real ID." "Ok then, give us $45 and you can go through." So it was never about security at all then, was it? And don't get me started with all the paid express security lanes. Because of course only poor people can weaponize shoes and la…

"My ID? I identify as Andrew Jackson twice and Lincoln"

Re: The TSA's New $45 Fee to Fly Without ID Is Illegal

#557

Post by caseysoftware »

seg_lol wrote: post #388
zoklet-enjoyer wrote: post #277

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Lying to TSA and other government representatives is patriotic

This is a scam that the GOP has convinced many of, that taking from the government commons is the right thing to do. But the GOP is the embodiment of a low trust society. I'd rather live in a high trust society.

> This is a scam that the GOP has convinced many of, that taking from the government commons is the right thing to do.

You should look around carefully and see who is actively defending government fraud right now.

If you're honest, you may be shocked.

Re: The TSA's New $45 Fee to Fly Without ID Is Illegal

#559

Post by pjc50 »

ben_w wrote: post #552
pjc50 wrote: post #504

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> deep-seated cultural paranoia that the federal government is out to get us. And yet when the Federal government deploys paramilitaries to a city to do sweeps of everybody who isn't carrying papers, while also using 2nd-amendment lawful carry as a pretext to murder someone, those same people are very quiet.

I've been noticing the same category of oddity for a while now. Bill Gates and a poorly thought out brainfart about vaccine microchips becoming a conspiracy, vs. Musk and an explicit plan with a funded company to make brain-computer interfaces to merge humans an AI met with barely a peep. Government spying on all of us was an awful dystopian nightmare right up until Snowden showed us they already had been. Conspiracy…

I call this being "exactly wrong".

I don't know whether it's organically muddled thinking as ideas get repeated and blurred without proper thought or evidence, or whether this in itself is "chaff" to hide things (given the allegations around Epstein and 4chan, maybe there's something to that), or whether it's a sort of self-fulfilling prophecy.

Re: The TSA's New $45 Fee to Fly Without ID Is Illegal

#560

Post by gradus_ad »

caseysoftware wrote: post #160
paxys wrote: post #23

It's hilarious how transparent a money grab this entire thing is. "You need to show a Real ID for security, otherwise how do we know you won't hijack the plane?" "Well I don't have a Real ID." "Ok then, give us $45 and you can go through." So it was never about security at all then, was it? And don't get me started with all the paid express security lanes. Because of course only poor people can weaponize shoes and la…

> So it was never about security at all then, was it? Never was. I flew every other week prior to covid and haven't once been through the scanners. For the first ~6 years, I opted out and got pat down over and over again. Then I realized I could even skip that. Now at the checkpoint, I stand at the metal detector. When they wave me to the scanner, I say "I can't raise my arms over my head." They wave me through the m…

So... You're lying about having a health condition in a loud and obnoxious way? Not sure what the point is.

Just because you can get around TSA checkpoints doesn't mean it's not "about" security. There's only so much that can be done when we have to balance safety and convenience.

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