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Porsche sold more electrified cars in Europe in 2025 than pure gas-powered cars

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Re: Porsche sold more electrified cars in Europe in 2025 than pure gas-powered cars

#551

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Yes, and? They're different tools for different purposes. Such a disingenuous comment.

Disingenuous? Plenty of people live without a car.

By choice?

Life is short enough, I don’t need to waste it providing power to travel to work and back when I can save 1.5 hours per work day driving. (And more if I go to lunch.)

Re: Porsche sold more electrified cars in Europe in 2025 than pure gas-powered cars

#552

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I like manual transmissions but I think DCTs are an improvement for the average car. They seem to have a lot less "hunting" than the typical torque-converter automatic and good precision for the driving conditions. It is easy to put them into a manual-select mode. And, of course, they don't seem to stall.

The manual transmission crowd cannot be convinced. Even when you show them the performance advantages etc. They just want 'fun' and 'engaging', however they define that.

I have only ever owned cars with manual transmissions for my personal vehicles.

I would 100% get a vehicle without a manual for my next car if it’s an improvement over a manual. I’ve driven a handful of Priuses. I would definitely own one. I would definitely own an EV.

I have no desire to own an ICE-only vehicle with a CVT, automated manual, or conventional automatic. They add complexity and opaque failure modes. Last year I lost reverse in our plow truck (an automatic). Totally undiagnosable for me, nevermind fixable. Had a new used transmission put it, and it started bogging and lurching from a stop and up hills. Can’t work around it, can’t fix it. Sold the truck for $300 to someone who’s going to part it out (the engine wasn’t great either) and moved the plow onto a new used truck.

We’re not all stuck in the past. Some of us do understand the system well enough to be picky about believing something is an improvement.

Another example: CFL lightbulbs flat-out sucked. Avoided them as best as I could. Bought CREE LED bulbs at $20 apiece as soon as they came out at Home Depot.

Re: Porsche sold more electrified cars in Europe in 2025 than pure gas-powered cars

#553
post #542

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> Then I think you see an early indication not just of electric car dominance, but of the (very potential) rise of China as the premier automotive super power. It’s done man. Americans are stuck in ICE engines because they’ve been told they’re “car enthusiasts” while the Chinese have been developing EV technology for years. Meanwhile, European makers are stuck not knowing what to do, make Americans happy or compete w…

EU car manufacturers decided that cheaper-to-make electric cars must be sold as luxury vehicles and failed to achieve economies of scale China did with their underwhelming initial models they kept improving relentlessly every year.

The corner is turning on this, with e.g. the Renault 5 EV being extremely popular: https://bestsellingcarsblog.com/2026/01/france-full-year-202...

I've test driven one, fun little car, decent provision of some non-touchscreen controls.

Ironically I think Tesla really opened up the EV market at all in the West by starting as a luxury option and working downwards. People don't want to feel they're taking a "hair shirt" option. "EVs are for rich people" has probably sold more cars than "EVs are for poor people" messaging would have.

The VW ID4 is winning the middle of the range family SUV market: https://electrek.co/2025/02/28/volkswagen-id-4-best-selling-...

It's not to my taste that bonnet lines have got higher, SUV style, but it appears to be what the public wants to buy.

Re: Porsche sold more electrified cars in Europe in 2025 than pure gas-powered cars

#554
post #2

While the headline is interesting. I think the table at the end of the article is more so. - Worldwide sales -10% YoY - China sales -26% YoY And when you cross compare Porsche saying they sold more EV powertrains than their gas equivalents against China's new found foothold as the market leader in consumer electric cars (BYD, NIO, Xiaomi, etc...) Then I think you see an early indication not just of electric car domin…

> Then I think you see an early indication not just of electric car dominance, but of the (very potential) rise of China as the premier automotive super power. It’s done man. Americans are stuck in ICE engines because they’ve been told they’re “car enthusiasts” while the Chinese have been developing EV technology for years. Meanwhile, European makers are stuck not knowing what to do, make Americans happy or compete w…

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Re: Porsche sold more electrified cars in Europe in 2025 than pure gas-powered cars

#555

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Then I think you see an early indication not just of electric car dominance, but of the (very potential) rise of China as the premier automotive super power. It’s done man. Americans are stuck in ICE engines because they’ve been told they’re “car enthusiasts” while the Chinese have been developing EV technology for years. Meanwhile, European makers are stuck not knowing what to do, make Americans happy or compete w…

I'm a "car enthusiast" and even I understand that holding onto ICE is like holding onto horses because cowboys look cool. It is a distilled macho culture like those old Marlboro ads.

You are wrong - it is like holding onto horses because cars require carrying a mechanic to get anywhere. BEVs aren’t ready for every use and every place and every one in the US by at least a decade, so keeping an ICE / buying one today is the pragmatic choice.

Re: Porsche sold more electrified cars in Europe in 2025 than pure gas-powered cars

#556

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When your ICE vehicle breaks down on the highway, you can get it towed and repaired at any half-decent car mechanic. If you don't like his cost quote or his service/repairs, you can get your car taken elsewhere (usually the mechanic can get it running in a short while, unless it is a major breakage problem) for a second opinion or service/repairs. When your EV breaks down, you won't even bother to get it towed, becau…

> When your EV breaks down, you won't even bother to get it towed, because the only ones who can repair are the (very expensive) showroom of the car manufacturer you bought it from, or their authorized (and very expensive) service center That's true, but it is has more to do with parasitic capitalism than EV technology, and could (and hopefully will)be solved with regulation. My understanding is that there is already…

Regulation will do nothing because it is not meant to tackle such problems.

EV is basically a battery-powered motor on wheels.

The smartphone in your hands is a battery-powered communication device with a touchscreen.

If your smartphone doesn't work, can you take it to any phone repair shop and get it repaired for anything other than a battery replacement or screen replacement (or if the service center guy is technically competent, then maybe replacing the charging port if it is busted).

EU, India and few countries have enacted the Right to Repair law.

But if your smartphone is broken, your options to get it repaired are minimal, because its manufacturers have gone to extreme lengths to ensure that such devices are not easy to open (let alone repair).

Now extrapolate that Smartphone Repair problem 10x-100x, and you have the EV Repair problem.

EVs are DESIGNED and MANUFACTURED to be extremely difficult to repair even by excellent technicians and software experts.

EVs are the Razor Blade Theory in moving attractive action. (Razor Blade Theory is basically a selling cheat but perfectly legal one; they sell you a razor blade with special handle/holder cheaply, but you have to keep buying razor blades from same brand (e.g., Gilette) & model that only work with that specific type of handle/holder. Over a period of time, the manufacturer will keep increasing the cost of the razor blades, because they know they have locked in the customers who have become accustomed to that type of handle/holder, blade quality & comfort, design, etc.)

You can buy an EV for an expensive upfront cost (it is sold as a premium (> ICE car) segment; just like smartphone brands have a premium price-tier segment), but running and repair costs is where the customers will be fleeced.. hard.

And please note that running cost (wear & tear) of an EV will not be covered by car insurance, so if your EV breaks down on the road, and you get it towed for repair, then the showroom/service-center (who usually have a tie-up and nexus with car insurance vendors) and insurance vendor will simply say the repairs won't be covered under extended warranty or insurance as it is normal "wear and tear".

And you'll have to swallow all those lies at face value, because you cannot even go elsewhere for a second opinion (because an EV of one brand, cannot be repaired at service center or showroom of another; if you go to another service center of same brand, they will cite you the same lies because that's their revenue model (Razor Blade Theory)).

EVs are a losing proposition for humanity, because unfortunately, even the supposedly green (not affecting climate change) EVs have toxic waste (typically the chemical batteries and plastics) that are never safely disposed off in climate-friendly ways.

ICE vehicles have some of these same problems, but their biggest advantages are their long mileage (per full tank of fuel), easier operation (not driving, I mean it is easy to top/fill up the fuel), easy maintenance (affordable repair options), and all-round viability that can even last a century with the right care.

However, you can bet that EVs are being designed for planned obsolescence, and that's a shame since humanity indeed needs some viable alternative to fossil-fuel-guzzling climate-polluting ICE vehicles.

Re: Porsche sold more electrified cars in Europe in 2025 than pure gas-powered cars

#557

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It is 100% compatible when your basis is just finding a local gas station to fill up. 600 days later, you may know where a charging station is, but not any more convenient... yet.

You don't need a charging station for 99 per cent of your rides. You can charge daily at home and forget about recharging except when making a long trip. If you usually make trips that are over the battery life, that's a different thing though. But most people don't have that problem.

That makes it even more realistic. I have the charger in my garage, I happened to need a charger to get home on my last trip (120 mile round trip, the car claimed 220 miles of charge but that didn't account for the cold winter), but I had to open an app and such just to use it. (at least I had the app and an account - but my credit card was expired so I had to type numbers to get it activated). I had to search for that charger - there was exactly one charger within 30 miles (only 7kw, but it gave me enough range to get home while I ate lunch).

Meanwhile I passed half a dozen gas stations. No app/account needed at any of them, just tap/swipe my credit card and fill.

Most people don't have the charging problem often, but when you make a mistake you sometimes will need it. The system doesn't work. There needs to be chargers all over, and they need to be quick/easy. I don't want to download an app for a charger I will likely never visit again in my life.

Re: Porsche sold more electrified cars in Europe in 2025 than pure gas-powered cars

#558

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Feels bad faith to shit on people from your ivory tower, just because they can't afford to ditch their reliable beaters and buy a new car. Have you seen wage growth vs car price increases lately? Not everyone is on a remote six figure US tech job. Try to view and judge things from outside your bubble as well. I'd also dump my ol reliable ICE car that's now probably worth less than a fancy electric bicycle, if someone…

Like me, you're not buying new cars on that budget anyway. 6 years ago when my ICE car became unreliable I bought a used Chevy Bolt for less than $20k. They're closer to $10k now. Plenty of range. People aren't being asked to dump their current reliable vehicles. What we want is for people to think about EVs when it's time to replace them.

> People aren't being asked to dump their current reliable vehicles

Depends on where the people live. In France, that's just about what they're asked. If their car is "too old" (reliability doesn't matter, only age), they may no longer drive in Paris and some other major cities on weekdays from 6 AM to 8 PM or something like that.

https://www.france.fr/en/article/crit-air-anti-pollution-veh...

Re: Porsche sold more electrified cars in Europe in 2025 than pure gas-powered cars

#559

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Hmm this comment gives the impression that electric Porsches are bad to drive and are only bought for the badge and convenience, like the SUV:s. I haven't driven a Taycan so can't say but I would assume it's not so. (And also it doesn't look like a convenient car.)

The Taycan is the ev version of the Panamera. They are in the grand tourismo category. Aka 4 doors, plenty of storage space, great for traveling. Yes they are very functional compared to a 911. No they don’t drive like a 911. Do they drive better than an Audi A7, Mercedes GT, BMW 8 series? That is debatable.

I own a Panamera and my husband owns an M850i. The Panamera drives like a Porsche, while the M850i is comparatively a boat. I'm not a big fan of how much suspension travel the M850i has; the Panamera has exactly the right amount to feel sporty but still comfortable, just like our 718 has.

Re: Porsche sold more electrified cars in Europe in 2025 than pure gas-powered cars

#560

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I am in Portugal right now. You know something we don’t have often here? Garages. For example in my neighborhood most cars are parallel parked, people are living in centuries old houses converted into high density condos, there are no garages. So what is more practical, charging your car overnight without an electric plug or going to the gas station for a few minutes?

>>So what is more practical, charging your car overnight without an electric plug or going to the gas station for a few minutes? 100x charging your car overnight with a plug. I don't think people who don't own an EV realize how great that is. Imagine if your petrol car magically got refilled with fuel every single night - add up all of those "few minutes" spent at a petrol station over your lifetime, and realize how…

Please don’t repeat the myth that your car is getting refilled every very night unless you are charging to 100% every night or are willing to concede your range is 80% of the stated range.
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