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French ex-president Sarkozy begins jail sentence

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Re: French ex-president Sarkozy begins jail sentence

#551
post #517

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Qatar gave a great deal of money to Tulane University - if you want to call an insititution with a 40% Jewish student body anti-Semitic I don't know what to say to you.

Are you saying the donation wouldn’t have an effect?

They were not against the IDF as an institution.

Re: French ex-president Sarkozy begins jail sentence

#552
post #363

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What do you mean? You can get detained and held in jail without bail until sentencing if the court orders it.

If you re-read my comment carefully, you will see that I already mentioned that possibility: "unless you are already in preventive detention due to flight risk or danger." However, if you are not in jail, as was the case with Sarkozy, you cannot be sent to prison in the U.S. after receiving a sentence from a lower court while the case is still open and pending in higher courts on appeal. In France, however, there is…

I did catch that, I just found your statement contradictory - "it's not possible unless the court uses a mechanism that makes it possible".

Re: French ex-president Sarkozy begins jail sentence

#553
post #537
post #436

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In April 2024, Le Monde Group’s majority stakeholder became a financial endowment, or fonds de dotation (FDD), named Fonds pour l'indépendance de la presse. En: https://www.lemonde.fr/en/about-us/article/2023/09/24/two-ma... Fr: https://www.lemonde.fr/actualite-medias/article/2023/09/24/d... This was the result of journalist demands, covered here: https://www.cjr.org/the_media_today/le_monde_daniel_kretinsk... This s…

Le Monde Diplomatique is a far-left (but rather intellectual) newspaper, completely separate from Le Monde.

Le Monde Diplomatique is a subsidiary (51%) of Monde SA.

"Le Monde owns 51%; l’association Les Amis du Monde diplomatique and l’association Gunter Holzmann, comprising the paper’s staff, together own 49%)."

But this 2010 article supports your point generally, claiming that the editors of the newspaper cannot influence the monthly. https://www.monde-diplomatique.fr/2010/07/HALIMI/19372

Re: French ex-president Sarkozy begins jail sentence

#554
post #546

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I was attempting to invoke Hanlon's Razor to rationalize the narratives being disseminated by news media, because I am exhausted by conspiratorial thinking. I chose the phrasing that I did in an effort to be as charitable as possible to both sides. I will not be badgered into wasting my time on an embarrassing and fruitless political debate on this orange website or any other.

So far we’ve had a genocide where the population increases, a destroyed hospital that was still standing, people begging for food from a photographer in a staged environment with no food being handed out, disabled children that look thin being used to fake starvation - if you’re exhausted by the conspiracy theorists you don’t to be as charitable as possible to them. Call them out.

No.

Re: French ex-president Sarkozy begins jail sentence

#556
post #52

We, French, are very proud of having put an ex-President in jail, for his crimes of having tried to whitewash a dictator responsible for the death of more French people than the Bataclan terror attacks in exchange for money. This person humiliated our country, and we're glad our justice put him behind bars

As an American, I envy you and your country. What millions of us wouldn’t give for the wheels of justice to catch up over here.

Re: French ex-president Sarkozy begins jail sentence

#557
post #258

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't think that people are stopped from committing assault by an abstract risk-benefit calculation that considers the likelihood of jailtime. It's not what stops me, at least. Mostly I just don't want to. And even if I do want to hit someone, I know that that fleeting temptation doesn't accord with my fundamental values; I'll feel bad afterwards. I'm intimately aware that they might retaliate, or that I might acci…

You're not a remorseless psychopath, though. Some people are. For a nuanced discussion, the Illustrated Guide to the Law is an excellent introduction. Here's the section on Punishment: https://lawcomic.net/guide/?p=41 It ends with the summary "The State punishes those who commit crimes partly in the hope of preventing future offenses (via rehabilitation, deterrence, and removal)... partly to restore a sense of balanc…

But... the section on deterrance pretty much aligns with what I just said above: https://lawcomic.net/guide/?p=114

Namely that it is unlikely to factor into people's decision-making process - and when it does, the extent of the punishment makes little difference. Slightly disappointed to wade through slides of challenging handwriting to find that it wasn't saying much more :/

Re: French ex-president Sarkozy begins jail sentence

#558

[flagged]

Law doesn't seek to punish but to rehabilitate. Act of taking freedom away from the criminal is violent enough. Treating them badly is just a sign of unfair/poor society that cannot maintain (afford to keep) it's promise to be civil to all citizens.

I would be fine with it if all prisoners had similar conditions, which they do not.

Also he and his supports have always criticized prisons for being "too luxurious", so hearing them complaining about his conditions now is infuriating.

As for rehabilitation, there is little hope for him. Prisons also serve to isolate individuals which are dangerous to the society, which he is (he is currently investigated for attempting to rig his current trial, something for which he was already condemned in the past).

Re: French ex-president Sarkozy begins jail sentence

#559
post #520
post #472

Earlier quoted context omitted.

that is not the same.

Sure they are. They’re both just people using whatever power they have to shape the narrative.

on the one hand you have the owner dictating his political bias to all his employees/journalists. on the other hand you have a person/journalist interpreting reality through their own political bias. what's the difference? in the first case the medium would only report biased in one direction, in the second case it'd report roughly split around the percentages of the (journalistic) population, e.g. 60% this, 40% that.

Re: French ex-president Sarkozy begins jail sentence

#560
post #486

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is either clever satire or seems to be saying a politician should be able to shoot somebody on 5th avenue without legal consequence.

It depends on the politician. And not whether they should but whether they could . That's the critical distinction. One that gets lost when ignorantly amplifying misquotes. The actual quote from Trump was that he could do so and not lose votes. About that he was correct. QED.

That answers the question of whether or not it was satire.

> s lost when ignorantly amplifying misquotes

Just barely squeezed that ad hominem in, with some plausible deniability. Nice.

In any case - I suppose it could, if one misquoted. Fortunately for me, was intentional as my version seems to reflect the gist of what you're saying: we (the people) shouldn't enforce the law when it comes to the actions of the leaders we elect.

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