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U.S. pauses all military aid to Ukraine

wsj.com

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Re: U.S. pauses all military aid to Ukraine

#551

Post by jopsen »

ozmodiar wrote: post #434
rapind wrote: post #395

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Everyone's about to get nukes now. What could go wrong.

You're not joking, a lot of people I talk to have gone from anti nuke to hard pro nuke. I can see the future having a lot more nukes in it now that there's no reliable world order to believe in.

I doubt Denmark will get nukes, nor am I sure I'd be in favor of nukes.

But I can see the argument that having the ability to nuke 50m Russians might deter them from attacking 5m Danes.

And I'd personally hate to sit in a trench. Which is a real risk if Russia attacks the Baltics and only half of NATO shows up.

So maybe we should get nukes and preposition them in the Baltics.

I'm sure our politicians wouldn't want to :)

Re: U.S. pauses all military aid to Ukraine

#552

Post by potato3732842 »

herculity275 wrote: post #206
jisnsm wrote: post #192

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I can imagine the very same thing being said if the USA had pulled out of the War on Terror. B-but they have WMD! The NYT said so!

It really sucks that "Saddam has WMDs" broke an entire generation of Americans into knee-jerk contrarianism regarding any global conflict US is involved in. What's the "WMD" equivalent here - what do you think the media is lying to you about? That there's an ongoing Russian invasion of Ukraine is something all involved parties acknowledge.

All the WMDs did was disgrace the media

It was the half dozen other adventures in the sandbox with nothing to show for it that made people put down their foot and say no more and stick to it even when it's a cause they may support (Ukraine for some, Israel for others). That's how fed up with it the American public is.

Re: U.S. pauses all military aid to Ukraine

#553

Post by netsharc »

throwaway48476 wrote: post #352
wewxjfq wrote: post #345

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As all conspiracy theories, this provides a simple explanation to circumstances that otherwise require complex answers, but it holds no water. The KGB was ineffective and inept. It didn't reach the masses, it didn't influence public opinion. Of course a former KGB agent selling his story must tell you otherwise, but most of these guys spent their whole career feigning successes to their superiors.

While they may feign success to their supervisors you need to look at the tangible results. They got germany to shut down their nuclear power plants and got the civil rights act passed. That's not ineffective.

> They got germany to shut down their nuclear power plants

Huh, so do they have an earthquake machine that caused Fukushima? Quick, someone tell that Jews-Space-Laser-Congresslady!

(Fukushima happened a few days before a German state election. Merkel, ever the opportunist and fearing a loss to the Green Party, finally said "We should accelerate the nuclear shutdown". The Greens won anyway).

Re: U.S. pauses all military aid to Ukraine

#555

Post by kelipso »

libertine wrote: post #511
kelipso wrote: post #296

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The nukes were never under Ukraine control or possession. It's like saying Turkey has nukes, they don't, they are US nukes.

Here comes the Russian propaganda... The nukes belonged to Ukraine. Just like Belarus nukes belonged to them. What is said by Russian propagandists is that Ukraine didn't have the launch codes - like it was some magical barrier that would prevent Ukraine from deploying the nukes if they wanted to. Like Ukrainian scientists didn't play a major a role in USSR nuclear development, and didn't have the know how to just us…

[flagged]

Re: U.S. pauses all military aid to Ukraine

#556

Post by michaelgburton »

tonyhart7 wrote: post #451
crazygringo wrote: post #287

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yet somehow the US is continuing to send tons of expensive military aid to Israel. Which shows this isn't actually about the cost. If this had anything to do with money and caring about domestic spending first, then you'd see aid to Israel cut off as well. Funny how that's not happening.

[flagged]

> Top gov officials is jews

Hard to imagine why you get labelled antisemitic

Re: U.S. pauses all military aid to Ukraine

#557

Post by rad_gruchalski »

lifestyleguru wrote: post #369
insane_dreamer wrote: post #359

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Except that one one country is resisting invasion by its bigger bully neighbor that is killing its civilian population, while the other is the bigger bully neighbor killing a civilian population and reducing it to rubble. A pretty clear indication that America stands on the side of the aggressors and doesn’t give a fuck about you know ordinary people being killed. Shameful.

The ethical "who's who" is irrelevant for US, in both cases they have "big beautiful ocean" inbetween.

The ocean doesn’t stop anyone. If you don’t believe, have a look at the southern border.

Re: U.S. pauses all military aid to Ukraine

#558

Post by goatlover »

throw919232156 wrote: post #493
tim333 wrote: post #411

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well there's not much conspiracy theorizing. Politico article: >The top level of the Soviet diplomatic service arranged his 1987 Moscow visit. With assistance from the KGB. It took place while Kryuchkov was seeking to improve the KGB's operational techniques in one particular and sensitive area. The spy chief wanted KGB staff abroad to recruit more Americans... https://www.politico.com/magazine/story/2017/11/19/trump…

That recites a book from a Trump hating Guardian reporter. Why would the CIA let him become president if they actually had something on him? Why would they let Gabbard (also called a "Russian asset") become DNI if they had something on her?

Can the CIA overturn elections?

Re: U.S. pauses all military aid to Ukraine

#559

Post by rdm_blackhole »

mrtesthah wrote: post #460
rdm_blackhole wrote: post #168

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Your comment is exactly the kind of high-ended attitude that is turning off people from having healthy debates with other people who might disagree with them. I am asking a legitimate question. Your contention is that even though the war is at best a stalemate and has revealed that Russia is at best a paper tiger, we should now believe that somehow it has the strength to invade all the Baltic states? I am sorry to sa…

> I am asking a legitimate question. At best your question was uninformed to the point that it constitutes provocation, at worst it was deliberate disinformation. I’ll repeat: Russia appears weak because the Ukrainians have received so much military backing from the US and the rest of Europe. It’s a stalemate because others stepped in to stop them. And furthermore, Russia’s rate of ammo production is higher than Euro…

> If my attitude puts you off from dialog, then might I politely suggest you educate yourself more on these topics before engaging?

Here we go again with the condescending attitude.

> your singular viewpoint

I don't push a singular viewpoint. I asked a question which other people have answered. Some people agreed and others disagreed. Each to their own. This is how a healthy debate works.

> At best your question was uninformed to the point that it constitutes provocation, at worst it was deliberate disinformation.

Asking a question about a major event and having a debate with other people is now considered a provocation? May I suggest you take a step back and rethink how you interact with other people if you think truly that this is the case.

Questioning things is good. Asking questions when we don't know the answer about something should be encouraged. That's how we learn and that is how we grow.

You have decided that you are right and that I am wrong. That's your right but that shouldn't stop people from asking questions that you deem to be provocative.

I have had many debates with plenty of people on this forum, some heated debates even, but I can say that you are definitely not someone I am interested in engaging with anymore.

Goo day to you.

Re: U.S. pauses all military aid to Ukraine

#560

Post by ModernMech »

justin66 wrote: post #449
roxolotl wrote: post #218

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I agree it’s a huge disgrace and half of the US is living in a fantasy land. However polls show that Americans don’t like Putin. A poll two weeks ago[0] actually showed 81% of Americans do not trust Putin. Finding 81% agreement about anything is hard. This is something that is unique to the administration and those who deeply agree with what it’s done. Not that it matters… clearly people don’t care enough to vote for…

That poll in isolation means nothing. A person who "does not trust Putin" but nevertheless subscribes to Russian propaganda is still doing his work. I see plenty of people in social media (enough to be convinced that they aren't all bots) who appear to believe that continuing to support Ukraine with aid would bankrupt the US, would be equivalent in effect to fighting Iraq or Vietnam again, would lead to WW III, and s…

Right. They don’t Trust Putin but they trust Trump. If Trump acts on Putin’s agenda, they will vote for it and call it smart.
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