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Trying to use Bluesky without getting burned again

chrisholdgraf.com

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Re: Trying to use Bluesky without getting burned again

#551

Post by sangnoir »

ChocolateGod wrote: post #541
glenstein wrote: post #504

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I accept that I overlooked your distinction here. You are right that there's no recursive blocking with email. But I also think that's an oversimplification, because the block list is a helpful proxy for content characteristic of an instance. But this is a case where I think the analogy to email breaks down insofar as its instructive to social media generally, because some things about email don't cleanly map on to w…

> to listen to you against their consent. Then stop trying to make a public discourse and instead make a private forum.

The idea of the fediverse as an agglomeration of private forums is a half-decent mental model. Each instance has its own rules and community, and some of them really hate each other.

Re: Trying to use Bluesky without getting burned again

#552

Post by strogonoff »

ianopolous wrote: post #533
strogonoff wrote: post #292

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is an extremely unpopular take in today’s world where 99% of what you use is expected to be “free” and subsidized by those with interests thoroughly misaligned with yours. Nevertheless, it is my strong opinion that offering paid service is the only way to a healthy ecosystem, healthy competition, products that actually benefit the user, and the market that works as the market is supposed to (and that Big Social…

Very well said. This is the approach we're taking with peergos, paid accounts unless you self host. I wrote some of our thoughts on this here: https://peergos.org/posts/the-social-dilemma

1. I am not sure it is possible to compete with a free product. By definition it will have more users. That’s the tragedy, competition is not possible.

2. My approach is not “one more product will be the answer”, more like “fixing the incentives and making the market work will enable many products”.

Re: Trying to use Bluesky without getting burned again

#553

Post by marcus_holmes »

kazinator wrote: post #528
jeroenhd wrote: post #518

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I do the same, and some companies flat-out refuse to accept email adresses with their own name in them. Samsung, notably, won't allow samsung@domain.tld for some obscure reason. Every time I have to hand out my email over the phone, I brace for having to explain my catch-all to people. Depending on how tired/tech-illiterate the person on the other end sounds, I've started using plausible-sounding alternatives (contac…

> won't allow samsung@domain.tld for some obscure reason. It's not obscure. Some code monkey at Samsung was told to filter out certain addresses, Samsung ones among them, and just used a regex or substring search on the entire address.

It could also fall foul of a Scunthorpe filter - refusing to accept names with some subset of characters, and the company name got added to the filter to avoid "samsungsuxbawls@gmail.com" or similar

Re: Trying to use Bluesky without getting burned again

#554

Post by baggachipz »

edavis wrote: post #548
baggachipz wrote: post #430

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't know how long you've been in the space, so forgive me if I seem condescending. Twitter and Facebook used to be extremely open and encouraging to developers. That's how they gained prominence, by allowing... nay, incentivizing developers to use their platform. Once they hit critical mass, that was all unceremoniously ripped away. Assuming a for-profit venture like Bluesky gains critical mass, it will absolutel…

I'm sorry, but there's just a qualitative difference between a company setting up some API endpoints and what Bluesky PBC is doing with building atproto, releasing PDS software, encouraging self-hosters and treating them as first class, etc. You may be interested in this thread from a core dev which examines this exact play by Reddit (and how nobody could do anything about it), how it would have been different on atp…

I'll refer to Cory Doctorow's excellently-written takedown[1] of this idea. Bluesky has plans to make it technically shit-proof, but haven't executed those plans "yet". Until that's the case, they're just as susceptible as any other content platform. After all, they haven't even revealed how they will make a profit yet. And they will have to do that. Profit motive always wins, exponentially so when something is venture-backed. To quote Public Enemy: "can't truss it"

[1]https://pluralistic.net/2024/12/14/fire-exits/#graceful-fail...

Re: Trying to use Bluesky without getting burned again

#555

Post by khafra »

bumby wrote: post #459
khafra wrote: post #414

Earlier quoted context omitted.

On Twitter I get to see interactions between the people that built games I played as a kid, famous actors, Nobel prize winners, heads of state, and authors I had assumed died decades ago. If I write something insightful and relevant enough, I might get a gesture of appreciation from a FAANG research director, a prominent philosopher, or just someone who writes the funniest aphorisms I've ever seen. It's toxic in some…

I have felt that pull myself, but can't help that even the "gesture of appreciation" is a somewhat hollow and superficial feeling of status. From that standpoint, I don't know that it's all that good of a signal to chase especially given the larger context of the limitations of Twitter.

Agreed--twitter interactions with famous people are absolutely a superstimulus in the same way ice cream or Factorio are; unless you're following some kind of rigorous strategy to promote a product or service.

But, indulging (in moderation) in ice cream or Factorio is one of the great things about living in the modern era. Just don't let it rewire your dopamine receptors too far to enjoy the real stuff!

Re: Trying to use Bluesky without getting burned again

#556

Post by ianopolous »

strogonoff wrote: post #552
ianopolous wrote: post #533

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Very well said. This is the approach we're taking with peergos, paid accounts unless you self host. I wrote some of our thoughts on this here: https://peergos.org/posts/the-social-dilemma

1. I am not sure it is possible to compete with a free product. By definition it will have more users. That’s the tragedy, competition is not possible. 2. My approach is not “one more product will be the answer”, more like “fixing the incentives and making the market work will enable many products”.

1. It depends on the time scale. The question is if you can outlive their VC funding.

2. How do you fix the incentives short of fixing capitalism to remove software VCs?

Re: Trying to use Bluesky without getting burned again

#557

Post by strogonoff »

ianopolous wrote: post #556
strogonoff wrote: post #552

Earlier quoted context omitted.

1. I am not sure it is possible to compete with a free product. By definition it will have more users. That’s the tragedy, competition is not possible. 2. My approach is not “one more product will be the answer”, more like “fixing the incentives and making the market work will enable many products”.

1. It depends on the time scale. The question is if you can outlive their VC funding. 2. How do you fix the incentives short of fixing capitalism to remove software VCs?

1. They are supported by paying customers (the advertisers), not just VC money.

2. You don’t need to get rid of VCs, it’s orthogonal.

Just make interoperation/complete API coverage required by law to be available to any user if you have more users than certain amount. It would neuter the lock-in when anyone can make a third-party GUI that has no ads and interoperates with any other social platform (meaning no “all my friends are there” effect).

Re: Trying to use Bluesky without getting burned again

#558

Post by fuzztester »

SiempreViernes wrote: post #345
fuzztester wrote: post #334

Earlier quoted context omitted.

why didn't you close the account instead, after transferring your balance, to send them a stronger message?

Sounds like the sort of bank that only allow closure to be requested via fax certain months.

Then I request, in no uncertain terms, that the government kindly close those sorts of faxers.

Re: Trying to use Bluesky without getting burned again

#559

Post by networked »

pavel_lishin wrote: post #116
jeroenhd wrote: post #108

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You'll be surprised how many people think they can just use first.lastname@gmail.com and have email magically appear in their account. And even more people have no idea what the @gmail.com/@ibm.com is about. All they know is that some of their emails don't reach their contacts, probably because "the computer broke again". It's not a hard concept, but it's a concept that was only ever explained in school to a sliver o…

I have my own domain, and have email set up so that any email to that domain goes to me. You'd be surprised (well, nobody here on HN would be) to know how many times I tell a business that my email is "their-business@my-domain.com", and they ask me how I got that email address, whether I work for their company, etc.

Since this happens often, you could try changing the form of the email addresses to make them less confusing. I can think of several options:

1. Prepend "from-", so that instead of @example.com you give them from-@example.com. It should at least make it easier to explain your approach when you have to.

2. ROT13 or reverse the name of the business so it's gurve-ohfvarff@example.com or ssenisub-rieht@example.com. You can design a different stateless function that maps names to email addresses. The function doesn't even have to be invertible. This is similar to a stateless password manager like https://www.lesspass.com/.

3. Use a list of pre-generated addresses you keep on your person. Think recovery codes. Of course, you can keep the list on a smartphone.

Re: Trying to use Bluesky without getting burned again

#560

Post by throw10920 »

thrance wrote: post #21
darthrupert wrote: post #2

My experience is that fundamentally there's nothing better with Bluesky or Mastodon when compared to Twitter. They're all toxic doom scrolling applications and if one does use them, it will be a good idea to control your usage as if it was cocaine.

I use none of these, and generally agree that the world would be a better place if we could magically get rid of all social media. But Twitter is filled with much, much more hate and disinformation than its alternatives. I'd say it is definitely worse than the others.

> But Twitter is filled with much, much more hate and disinformation than its alternatives.

What's your source on that? And who defines "hate" or "disinformation"?

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