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Scrollbar Blindness

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Re: Scrollbar Blindness

#551

Post by ricardobeat »

dmitriid wrote: post #549
IncRnd wrote: post #526

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Except that I did answer as to specific toolkits - with two answers for two separate kits. You used a lot of words to make it seem otherwise. As you yourself wrote, "Ignorance is bliss, isn't it?"

> Except that I did answer as to specific toolkits - with two answers for two separate kits You din't, really. On the third attempt you said "I see our testers doing this all the time - but I don't know what libraries they use " and "various people have scripted UI exploits using selenium or appium. I just asked one of the people familiar with those two tools" This shows that you started this entire argument with ver…

What you are looking for is called visual testing or visual regression testing, and would immediately flag such a difference between platforms. It's widely available and there are even services dedicated entirely to it.

https://saucelabs.com/platform/visual-testing

https://chromatic.com

https://diffy.website

And a ton more: https://lmgtfy.com/?q=visual+diff+testing

Re: Scrollbar Blindness

#552

Post by spixy »

snazz wrote: post #200
mbar84 wrote: post #131

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The other being System Preferences -> Keyboard -> Modifier Keys and map Caps Lock to Escape

Or Control, depending on which you're used to. Every time I try to use Windows I'm surprised that there's no easy-to-access setting for remapping Caps Lock like there is on every Linux DE and macOS.

you can easily remap keys with PowerToys...

https://github.com/microsoft/PowerToys

Re: Scrollbar Blindness

#553

Post by IncRnd »

dmitriid wrote: post #549
IncRnd wrote: post #526

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Except that I did answer as to specific toolkits - with two answers for two separate kits. You used a lot of words to make it seem otherwise. As you yourself wrote, "Ignorance is bliss, isn't it?"

> Except that I did answer as to specific toolkits - with two answers for two separate kits You din't, really. On the third attempt you said "I see our testers doing this all the time - but I don't know what libraries they use " and "various people have scripted UI exploits using selenium or appium. I just asked one of the people familiar with those two tools" This shows that you started this entire argument with ver…

You're still at it???

> You din't, really. On the third attempt you said "I see our testers doing this all the time - but I don't know what libraries they use" and "various people have scripted UI exploits using selenium or appium. I just asked one of the people familiar with those two tools"

Because I see this sort of test being done almost daily... I work in security and not specifically in testing. I mentioned what frameworks are used in a security context. You are beating a dead horse, focusing on what doesn't matter. I suggest you get off hacker news, go educate yourself, and stop pontificating.

When I said that I "just asked" I meant that I just now asked, not that just asking was all I have ever done. You're being foolish, projecting in every comment that you know more than everyone else.

PS. Please quote properly. I wrote that the security team uses selenium and appium not whatever it is that you are pretending I wrote.

Re: Scrollbar Blindness

#554

Post by contextfree »

phil294 wrote: post #496
contextfree wrote: post #458

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I appreciated the Windows Phone 7/8 and early Win10 approach to compact icons which was/is: Just have a button next to the icons that expands them to show labels when you press it. Unfortunately later redesigns to Win10 apps seemed to drift away from these patterns towards just having unlabeled icons everywhere.

Sounds interesting, do you happen to have an image of this available? I was not able to find any more information about it

Here's a tour of the application bar control (which follows this pattern) from the Windows Phone 8 days: https://www.c-sharpcorner.com/UploadFile/1e050f/application-...

Windows 10 introduced the navigation bar, which is essentially a vertical version of the Windows Phone application bar, just using a "three lines" icon as the "show labels" button instead of an ellipsis. https://docs.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/uwp/design/controls... The start menu and inbox mail app use this control, for example.

Re: Scrollbar Blindness

#555

Post by breatheoften »

DJBunnies wrote: post #517
andi999 wrote: post #487

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Exactly. Why should e.g. a floppy disk symbol signify anything to anybody born after 2000.

What would you replace it with?

I don't care what the icon is -- just ensure it has a label that says "Save" or something similar ...

Re: Scrollbar Blindness

#556

Post by dmitriid »

IncRnd wrote: post #553
dmitriid wrote: post #549

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Except that I did answer as to specific toolkits - with two answers for two separate kits You din't, really. On the third attempt you said "I see our testers doing this all the time - but I don't know what libraries they use " and "various people have scripted UI exploits using selenium or appium. I just asked one of the people familiar with those two tools" This shows that you started this entire argument with ver…

You're still at it??? > You din't, really. On the third attempt you said "I see our testers doing this all the time - but I don't know what libraries they use" and "various people have scripted UI exploits using selenium or appium. I just asked one of the people familiar with those two tools" Because I see this sort of test being done almost daily... I work in security and not specifically in testing. I mentioned wha…

A person who doesn't do testing himself, doesn't know which libraries testers use, and has to ask other people how to solve the problem in OP (because he himself doesn't know) is telling me to stop pontificating and go educate myself.

Good luck with your holier than though attitude, and god help your security.

Re: Scrollbar Blindness

#557

Post by projektfu »

majewsky wrote: post #528
projektfu wrote: post #374

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Monitor buttons are particularly awesome. Often you can't even see what you're pressing because it's behind the bezel or just an unmarked capsense location, and then whether it's up, down, increase, decrease, forward, back, reset, etc. is all different for each page of settings. Bonus points: turn the monitor to portrait mode and do it sideways.

Both monitors on my desk have a single button on the back side of the bottom right corner. The button can be pressed or pushed in each of the four cardinal directions (left, up, right, bottom). It's actually really nice. Since it's only one physical button, there's never any guessing which button you're on. And once you know the menu structure, common tasks can be done completely blind. (For example, I know that swit…

What model?

Re: Scrollbar Blindness

#558

Post by IncRnd »

dmitriid wrote: post #556
IncRnd wrote: post #553

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You're still at it??? > You din't, really. On the third attempt you said "I see our testers doing this all the time - but I don't know what libraries they use" and "various people have scripted UI exploits using selenium or appium. I just asked one of the people familiar with those two tools" Because I see this sort of test being done almost daily... I work in security and not specifically in testing. I mentioned wha…

A person who doesn't do testing himself, doesn't know which libraries testers use, and has to ask other people how to solve the problem in OP (because he himself doesn't know) is telling me to stop pontificating and go educate myself. Good luck with your holier than though attitude, and god help your security.

What is wrong with you? I never said any of that. You keep cherry picking half-statements and then taking them out of context.

I did not need to ask other people how to solve a problem. That is a silly interpretation of what I wrote. You are willfully pretending ignorance of how to read and have a conversation.

Pontificate: "express one's opinions in a way considered annoyingly pompous and dogmatic." Yes, you really do need to stop pontificating.

I hope you find happiness.

Re: Scrollbar Blindness

#559

Post by notacoward »

derefr wrote: post #536
notacoward wrote: post #533

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> where the view-controller isn't necessarily aware That's a really poor excuse. If that "awareness" is missing then the code is structured wrong, probably because somebody cargo-culted a design pattern without ever once thinking of the user.

No? Infinite scroll is usually just a direct translation of SQL cursor semantics into the frontend. And an SQL cursor (or its equivalent for a disstributed store) is an optimal choice for a situation where: 1. there's a potentially-huge result set; 2. almost nobody ever wants to see the whole result set, but rather almost always just wants to see the first N chunks, and then drops off; 3. the results are sourced from…

That excuse doesn't work at all, and you even provided the counterexample yourself. If you know the data fits on one screen, which you know very quickly, skip the scrollbar. If you don't know, add one. All you need from API is an indication of whether you're already at the end, which you probably already have so you can know whether you can/should call again. You might not know the precise number of results to size the "thumb" on the scrollbar, but that's OK. Just guess and nobody will be bothered too much. But if you don't know whether you have even one more result then your system is broken.

I'm glad I work in infra, not apps. Infra developers certainly make their own share of dumb decisions, but they're not that lazy and sloppy and user-blaming.

Re: Scrollbar Blindness

#560

Post by golergka »

jakub_g wrote: post #71

If you read between the lines, you should understand that the root cause of issue is the macOS developer monoculture. All you need is one Windows or Linux-based developer in your team to catch those kind of issues. But so many dev teams are macOS-only those days, whereas, apart from US and 2-3 other rich countries, 80%+ or even more of actual desktop users are Windows-based. (There are many other problems with macOS…

In my current company, my manager, when I complained that my remote PC machine was a bit buggy with Docker, ordered me top-of-the-line MacBook, delivered in 2 hours.

I don't even live in US. But this culture certainly exists here too.

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