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European Commission fines Google €2.42B for abusing dominance

europa.eu

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Re: European Commission fines Google €2.42B for abusing dominance

#551
It's just a covert trade war with the US. The US fines VW, then the EU fines Google and Facebook and maybe Apple too. I don't like Google's practices or their ad network but this is just about taxes and clawing back some money after Google used their Ireland subsidiary and banks in the Caymans to avoid paying some taxes in the EU. In the UK they got a slap on the back last year - some 130M pounds in back taxes.

https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2016/jan/22/google-ag...

Re: European Commission fines Google €2.42B for abusing dominance

#552

Earlier quoted context omitted.

99% of the population. Last time checked significant portion of the population uses various tools including ad-blockers, and other privacy tools to decrease their online foot print. So that point is wholly incorrect. You mean significant portion of the population who does not mind being tracked constantly by Google. Most likely the most unsavy masses. Not anyone that cares about their privacy.

> Last time checked significant portion of the population uses various tools including ad-blockers, and other privacy tools to decrease their online foot print. In what alternate reality ?

"PageFair 2017 ad blocking report: Usage up 30%"

Whether or not that number is correct, it's definitely a significant portion of the population doing it.

Re: European Commission fines Google €2.42B for abusing dominance

#553
post #524
post #317

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"It is generally conceded in our age that a critically strategic producer has an obligation to the public for the sake of the common good." And what happens if Google says, "f * it, we're not providing a utility, we're not taking traffic from European IPs anymore"? I am no anarcho-capitalist, but I really think more folks should read Atlas Shrugged.

Even if Google did this, and got past the shareholder lawsuits, what would happen? Nothing much. Someone else would step in. Greed and free markets makes the "Atlas Shrugged" scenario nonsense. I'm sure there are millions of smart people who would love it if all the other smart people stopped producing. All it means is more market share for them. I'm guessing you're posting this as someone who is fully sucked into th…

You named a few Google products to be contrarian and think that Google is far from indispensable? I'm calling bullshit because I'm willing to bet most of the non-Google products you use use Google somewhere in the chain.

Re: European Commission fines Google €2.42B for abusing dominance

#554
post #538

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Can someone explain why they believe google and other "emerging" power centers saveguard their interests better than the EU? 1. Because it's in their long term best interest to have a customer for life (No political cycle) so they are more incentivized than a politician would be to support the interest of the consumer. 2. They have a more insight into user desires and actions on a day to day basis, meaning they can p…

Wow. Really sad to read that here but: 1) They are a quasi monopoly. The word you use to describe searching on the internet is "googling". Most of the phones on this planet run on their OS. So please...don't fool yourself. 2) Who's creating those desires? You think that the desire for millions of useless shit products that drive the global market are created by some neccesity deeply in our DNA? Or maybe by your free…

The competition is a click away. Remember AltaVista?

Re: European Commission fines Google €2.42B for abusing dominance

#555

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Can you give an unbiased concrete example (eg. tainted baby formula, collapsed bridge, corrupted hard drive from virus) of something that has benefited google to the direct harm of one of it's users? The biggest argument I've seen is that people don't like that they aggregate the data you give to them.

AMP. This is entirely what the AMP argument has been all about.

As a user I like AMP. it loads faster than the normal bloated websites and doesn't freeze my device while megabytes upon megabytes of scripts try to run.

Re: European Commission fines Google €2.42B for abusing dominance

#556

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> Google users are not (in most cases) their customers but a product Google sells to their actual customers. No, Google users are suppliers of a product (ad views) that Google sells to their customers. But they are suppliers that are paid via in-kind exchange (with Google services) rather than cash, which is exactly equivalent to being customers of Google services that pay with in-kind exchange rather than cash. So,…

Are chickens in the farm also customers?

> Are chickens in the farm also customers?

Chickens in a farm aren't situated similarly, with respect to the farm, as users are with respect to Google services.

Chickens can't freely choose a different farm, or to use no farm at all.

Re: European Commission fines Google €2.42B for abusing dominance

#557
post #53

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That's another case that's being worked on. The preferred solution of the EU would be that there would be a standardized API between search engines and map providers, shopping providers, etc, and you could simply choose which map provider you'd want, and that'd be shown in every search engine. This is still being discussed, of course, as no solution has been found yet, but in general the idea is based on Android's In…

So if Spotify creates a music recognition feature that competes with Shazam, would they need to create an API that allows you to choose your music recognition service from within Spotify? This a very slippery slope!

If spotify is the only app used by 97% of all users, then yes. At that point, spotify also couldn’t refuse to list an interprets album.

Re: European Commission fines Google €2.42B for abusing dominance

#558
post #352

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>I might be in a minority here Nope. It's crazy. You don't go to the most popular restaurant in town and have them tell you to go get desert across the street because the superior food and experience hurt their sales. Even looking at the commissions fact sheet (Search Engine market share) [0]. 3 of the 4 other companies are billion dollar enterprises. Microsoft decided to make it difficult to switch to Chrome/Google…

> Nope. It's crazy. You don't go to the most popular restaurant in town and have them tell you to go get desert across the street because the superior food and experience hurt their sales. Which is why they determined Google's market dominance in Search , not shopping sites. Your analogy should be about the single most popular restaurant guide in town, opening up their own restaurant and then only writing reviews for…

Lots of tourist towns have sponsored free maps that do exactly this.

Re: European Commission fines Google €2.42B for abusing dominance

#559
post #367

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As a consumer, I have (much) more trust that my interests are advanced by the EU than google. This is an opinion which I don't feel the need to convert anyone to but I really don't understand the opposite view. Can someone explain why they believe google and other "emerging" power centers saveguard their interests better than the EU?

As a consumer, I have (much) more trust that my interests are advanced by the EU than google. The same people that brought you that idiotic cookies warning?

Do you not think that websites should alert users that they are being tracked?

I suppose the Guardian shouldn't alert people that the NSA listens to their telephone calls, either. (Because every spy agency does it?)

Re: European Commission fines Google €2.42B for abusing dominance

#560
post #472

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's possible for such tactics to be useful for consumers and still be an illegal use of their dominant market position. Compare MS and the bundled Internet Explorer: Yes, it was more convenient for people not to be required to download a browser after installing the OS. But imagine if MS had been successful, and Internet Explorer had emerged as the only browser: Do you think that would have been in the common intere…

> Compare MS and the bundled Internet Explorer: Yes, it was more convenient for people not to be required to download a browser after installing the OS. That was a non-issue, as OEMs were able (and did often) pre-install any number of software packages on top of Windows. The issue was MS telling them "if you preinstall Netscape Navigator, you won't get any more Windows licenses from us". Among other things that were…

In the words of another poster, it sounds MS was punished for being very successful!

The thing about anti-trust is that being a monopoly is allowed. What's not allowed is using a monopoly position to get a large advantage in another market.

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